AND2 and SVN Bug Reports - A New Dawn 2 ONLY

[gbs5009]

Savegame please, we can't check otherwise.

Unfortunately, I didn't think to grab a save of the game after it happened... I was depending on autosave, then started a new game after this happened. Here's the start of the game, at least.

 

[voleur]

What is the purpose of the modification MIN_CITY_RANGE?

Play huge map but with less cities.
Like that cities will average most populous.

And I hate playing with cities stuck next to each other as the AI does.

 

[45°38'N-13°47'E]

I've found a link describing very well how current vassal system works:
http://www.civfanatics.com/civ4/strategy/vassals.php
In theory, when you peacefully get a vassal, not a capitulated one, it might break free every 10 turns. Did it ever happen to anyone? It certainly never ever happened to me, not a single time. But I see it happening to AI. So I wonder if the code is broken somewhere.
Also I don't understand from description in the link: AI might break free if vassal lose a certain % of cities in war (i.e. master is not able to defend him), or if it grows larger than a certain % of master population and/or size (and I've recently added a certain % of military strength too). But this is true for both peaceful and capitulated vassals, so what does it mean that "every 10 turns"? Does it mean a vassal can break free even if it hasn't met those % requirements? If so, I've never seen it happening with humans. Opinions or experience?

 

[platyping]

Peaceful vassals can break free without any of those conditions.
Forced vassals need one of those conditions to break, either they grow too big or too small based on initial size when they capitulated. Just hover over it for details in scoreboard.
The only time master can break vassal agreement is when resource demanded and refused, by declaring war.

 

[45°38'N-13°47'E]

Peaceful vassals can break free without any of those conditions.

Are you 100% sure about this? I wish it were so, but as I've said I've never ever seen it happening with humans.

Forced vassals need one of those conditions to break, either they grow too big or too small based on initial size when they capitulated. Just hover over it for details in scoreboard.
The only time master can break vassal agreement is when resource demanded and refused, by declaring war.

That makes sense but if you think about it, it would also make sense that a peaceful vassal might break free if he loses more than x% of his cities because the master can't defend him. Are you sure this doesn't apply to peaceful vassals too?

 

[platyping]

Peaceful ones join on their own will and can break on their own will.
You seldom see it with humans because generally humans are overpowered, which is why they want your protection, but humans become more and more overpowered, so no reason why they want to end it.

You can always use my WB to set some peaceful vassals attached to weak masters and see what happens. BTS WB can only set forced vassals.

 

[45°38'N-13°47'E]

Peaceful ones join on their own will and can break on their own will.
You seldom see it with humans because generally humans are overpowered, which is why they want your protection, but humans become more and more overpowered, so no reason why they want to end it.

You can always use my WB to set some peaceful vassals attached to weak masters and see what happens. BTS WB can only set forced vassals.

Mmmm, I'm not yet convinced. This is the dll code from original BTS (AND is almost identical):

bool CvTeam::canVassalRevolt(TeamTypes eMaster) const
{
	FAssert(NO_TEAM != eMaster);

	CvTeam& kMaster = GET_TEAM(eMaster);

	if (isVassal(eMaster))
	{
		if (100 * getTotalLand(false) < GC.getDefineINT("VASSAL_REVOLT_OWN_LOSSES_FACTOR") * getVassalPower())
		{
			return true;
		}

		if (100 * kMaster.getTotalLand() < GC.getDefineINT("VASSAL_REVOLT_MASTER_LOSSES_FACTOR") * getMasterPower())
		{
			return true;
		}
	}

	if (GC.getDefineINT("FREE_VASSAL_LAND_PERCENT") < 0 || 
		100 * getTotalLand(false) < kMaster.getTotalLand(false) * GC.getDefineINT("FREE_VASSAL_LAND_PERCENT"))
	{
		return false;
	}

	if (GC.getDefineINT("FREE_VASSAL_POPULATION_PERCENT") < 0 || 
		100 * getTotalPopulation(false) < kMaster.getTotalPopulation(false) * GC.getDefineINT("FREE_VASSAL_POPULATION_PERCENT"))
	{
		return false;
	}

	return true;
}

from what I can understand, a vassal can always revolt, unless that function is returned false, which happens when vassal population/size is below values defined in DefineINT.

I have a savegame of my last game where I have 3 volountary vassals; I'll kill all my military units and see what happens. If it works like you say, they should break free quickly, I suppose.

 

[Rezca]

I only had this happen to me once. Years ago in BTS with Egypt, he came up to me and said he's breaking free, "what are you going to do about it huh?"

Which resulted in the options "Fair enough" and "This means war!" - not sure if that's EXACTLY what was written, but one option was just accepting that and moving on, the other auto-declares on the nation that broke free.


Since then though, I've never actually had an AI break free from me.

 

[45°38'N-13°47'E]

That's exactly what I was asking. So it happens under certain conditions. Thanks as usual Rezca!

 

[IPEX-731BA5DD06]

Another way to get rid of a 'Forced capitulation' Vassal, is to use espionage to bribe the city to you.

You need to spread a certain % of Culture, I assume > 66%, and then use a spy to "Bribe" the city to yourself.

Most times this will result in the vassal declaring war upon you, were, you can now wipe them out, or just make peace and let it slide.

Also other civ's can declare war upon you for using this methodology.

P.S. already noted in the vassal thread.

 

[45°38'N-13°47'E]

Hello,


My first game with your MOD and unfortunately after few turns CTD every time

Save attached.

Just 2 comments I made two modifications inside XML files

GlobalDefines.xml
MIN_CITY_RANGE = 3

and

CIV4BuildingInfos.xml
<BuildingClass>BUILDINGCLASS_AIRPORT</BuildingClass>
AirUnitCapacity = 12


Savegame and Min Dump attached

I can't open your minidump but I have played 30+ turns without CTD. Have you tried playing without your changes and see if it doesn't crash?

 

[voleur]

I guess I found the problem

Map size

No CTD with Large but unplayable with Huge

Tested with my 2 changes.

 

[45°38'N-13°47'E]

I guess I found the problem

Map size

No CTD with Large but unplayable with Huge

Tested with my 2 changes.

Then I guess the problem is your changes because huge and bigger work fine.

 

[valeriosavio]

Hallo everyone,

City management button (F1) doesn't work anymore for me !
Can you guys help me out?

thanks

 

[45°38'N-13°47'E]

Hallo everyone,

City management button (F1) doesn't work anymore for me !
Can you guys help me out?

thanks

It's working here on latest revision, which revision are you using?

 

[valeriosavio]

It's working here on latest revision, which revision are you using?

I'm using the 0.15 rev, if I'm correct..

 

[45°38'N-13°47'E]

I'm using the 0.15 rev, if I'm correct..

Hover your mouse over your flag near the minimap while in game, that will tell you your revision number, currently we're at 962

 

[valeriosavio]

Hover your mouse over your flag near the minimap while in game, that will tell you your revision number, currently we're at 962

Have updated my game version, (now it's 962).. but the f1 button still won't work...

 

[45°38'N-13°47'E]

Do you know from what revision it started to not expand anymore?

dbkblk, I've checked older revisions; the problem is your production changes, probably in cvcity.cpp, in rev925. I've tried back to rev925 when the code was still experimental. If I turn it off via XML, AI expands properly; if I switch on your code (same map, same conditions), AI doesn't expand on other continents/islands anymore. I've tried to look at the code but there are simply too many changes for me to understand where the problem might be...

Edit: I've tried some intermediate revision, but I'll try more because I think I remember you fixed some expansion problem at some point but I don't know if our current problem is one we didn't notice until now or if it's something you've fixed but got broken again.

 

[dbkblk]

I'll try to find some time to look at this particular problem. Do you know if the problem comes only for Archipelago maps?
Is the AI building settlers? Does it lack boats or military?