AND2 and SVN Bug Reports - A New Dawn 2 ONLY

[walkerjonny]

With the last Update (rev. 1054) it seems that the technology costs have been reduced to only 20% to 30% than before in the modern era at least. Before the last changes the technology costs were placed in a height that it took about 9 to 10 rounds with my actual settings at eternity speed to achieve the next technology. Now it takes just 2 rounds! That is way too fast at eternity speed!
Please have a look into it.

 

[45°38'N-13°47'E]

With the last Update (rev. 1054) it seems that the technology costs have been reduced to only 20% to 30% than before in the modern era at least. Before the last changes the technology costs were placed in a height that it took about 9 to 10 rounds with my actual settings at eternity speed to achieve the next technology. Now it takes just 2 rounds! That is way too fast at eternity speed!
Please have a look into it.

Tech costs have been reduced throughout all eras because increasing units costs means also slower buildings productions and hence less commerce/science/etc: I've run some tests and it looks fine in my games. Techs costs have been reduced by around 20-25% and not to 20-30% than before. 2 turns is definitely too fast for Eternity but that might depend on how well you are playing and on other options. For example, if you're going too slow and you are using Realistic Timescale, this option will cut techs costs: for example if it's year 2050AD and you still have to research Computers. On the contrary, if you are in 1700AD and you're researching Computers, tech cost will be greatly increased. Also, if you started with another revision and switched to rev1052 during your game, that might cause some troubles with tech costs. Try turning off Realistic Timescale for this game: BUG options, A New Dawn tab, last column, almost to the bottom.

 

[rtt4a]

Tech costs have been reduced throughout all eras because increasing units costs means also slower buildings productions and hence less commerce/science/etc: I've run some tests and it looks fine in my games. Techs costs have been reduced by around 20-25% and not to 20-30% than before. 2 turns is definitely too fast for Eternity but that might depend on how well you are playing and on other options. For example, if you're going too slow and you are using Realistic Timescale, this option will cut techs costs: for example if it's year 2050AD and you still have to research Computers. On the contrary, if you are in 1700AD and you're researching Computers, tech cost will be greatly increased. Also, if you started with another revision and switched to rev1052 during your game, that might cause some troubles with tech costs. Try turning off Realistic Timescale for this game: BUG options, A New Dawn tab, last column, almost to the bottom.

Could you open a little bit this formula of yours..? increased unit cost mean more expensive workers but does it really mean that much slower building production? Also lesser units mean lesser unit costs and more money to use research, right?

 

[walkerjonny]

As I understood building production should have stayed at the same rate - except that has been changed in svn. 1054, too.
I think that the overall unit manintenance costs are lower now because of playing with a lesser amount of units. Therefore there should be more money left for research, right.

I'm playing around the year 1830. So technology research should still have been quite expensive then...
I'll turn that suggested option off.

 

[45°38'N-13°47'E]

Could you open a little bit this formula of yours..? increased unit cost mean more expensive workers but does it really mean that much slower building production? Also lesser units mean lesser unit costs and more money to use research, right?

True, but the main thing is what AI can do. I'm using values which AI can handle and I've tested dozens of games. So main thing is not to cripple AI, and it works like this. Then we can tweak only human values but this can't be based on just a couple of games, especially if they're not played completely on the same revision from start to end.

As I understood building production should have stayed at the same rate - except that has been changed in svn. 1054, too.
I think that the overall unit manintenance costs are lower now because of playing with a lesser amount of units. Therefore there should be more money left for research, right.

I'm playing around the year 1830. So technology research should still have been quite expensive then...
I'll turn that suggested option off.

It depends, which techs are you researching in 1830? Also buildings costs haven't changed. But if you're playing with Flexible Difficulty, that might be responsible for changing values for units/buildings/wonders/everything else.

 

[walkerjonny]

It depends, which techs are you researching in 1830? Also buildings costs haven't changed. But if you're playing with Flexible Difficulty, that might be responsible for changing values for units/buildings/wonders/everything else.

I'm at the year 1838 exactly and I'm researching computer technology right now. The only other tech that can be choosed is mass media. And without Realistic Timescale the tech research goes down to 1 round at eternity speed - and that with a research rate of 0%...
And yes, I have switched from svn. 1050 or 1051 to 1053 and then to 1054. That may explain those tech cost troubles...
At the moment my actual game is not really playable anymore with those last changes that have been done in svn. 1052 to 1054. Especially those low tech costs that I have with 0% research rate at the moment would cause a lot of troubles over time I think because I assume that at this rate I can't build the necessary buildings (even without building any further unit) as fast as it would be required at this research speed.

 

[45°38'N-13°47'E]

I'm at the year 1838 exactly and I'm researching computer technology right now. The only other tech that can be choosed is mass media. And without Realistic Timescale the tech research goes down to 1 round at eternity speed - and that with a research rate of 0%...
And yes, I have switched from svn. 1050 or 1051 to 1053 and then to 1054. That may explain those tech cost troubles...
At the moment my actual game is not really playable anymore with those last changes that have been done in svn. 1052 to 1054. Especially those low tech costs that I have with 0% research rate at the moment would cause a lot of troubles over time I think because I assume that at this rate I can't build the necessary buildings (even without building any further unit) as fast as it would be required at this research speed.

Can you please upload your save game so that I can check? Thanks.

 

[Rado]

hi, my first post here, first of all, great work and thank you for the mod. it's much better than civ 6. there's a minor "bug" that is a bit annoying. when i select a unit its icon is behind the blue ui thing, so if i have a group of units i can't choose the first unit without pressing crtl+i in order for the blue borders to disappear. i'm playing on 1920x1080. my game is currently updating, so i can't provide a screenshot, but i may do that later if it's not clear what i mean... would be grateful if you looked into that. cheers

 

[walkerjonny]

Can you please upload your save game so that I can check? Thanks.

I'm not so firm with uploads to civfanatics. Should I use something like that: https://www.file-upload.net/?
Or should I just attach that file directly to my post here? The file size is about 12 MB.

 

[<Nexus>]

Or should I just attach that file directly to my post here? The file size is about 12 MB.

Zip or Rar it. It will greatly reduce the size.

 

[Aquila SPQR]

I have a strange problem - I can't update the game. When I click the "update" button - my updating progress goes from 0 to 100% in just a second but nothing happens. When I go back to the launcher it still says I have the old version and I have the yellow "update available" button. I can click "update" as many times as I want, but the result is still the same. I downloaded previously a mega civ pack.

 

[walkerjonny]

Well, there's my actual save game with recalculated values. That had just reduced the money output but had no effect to the tech research issue.
I'm managing over 440 cities at the moment and have several thousand units so be a bit careful.
High graphics settings will cause out of memory crashes quite soon. Therefore I'm playing with medium graphics settings and single units to avoid that somewhat.

 

[walkerjonny]

I just tried a new game at eternity speed on a gigantic map with override. It is now really as I have guessed it.
Building a warrior or a scout now takes 36 rounds, building a worker or a javelineer now more than 60 rounds and building a settler requires now about 70 rounds...
Now I have researched about 2 new techs before I'm getting a single warrior.
Usually you select a gigantic map with override and a game speed of eternity because you want to explore and build and grow.
And now it takes at least 70 rounds even to get your first scout...
Well, that way to play has now been crippled because the unit costs in the early game are now way to high in my opinion...
And would you really risk it to build a scout that is now way to weak compared to its building costs and risk to loose it maybe just 10 to 20 rounds later because of an animal attacking it?
Also you won't try out many different unit types anymore even if you can build them - they are simply too expensive now.
Instead you now have to think twice about if it is really a good idea to build a worker or a settler because that could lead to a serious protection drawback.
But you have researched at least about 15 or more techs before you're even thinking of expanding your empire. And and then you can't do it because the peoples in your first city are going riot because they demand this building or that stuff...
That is not well balanced anymore.

Yes, the unit production costs within the modern era and also maybe some eras before have been somewhat too low before the changes made in SVN 1052/1053 because there are now much more buildings that increase the production output - but only within those eras!
And that is exactly the point. The unit costs weren't an overall issue. They became an issue slightly more and more over the time as the production output of the cities increased much more than the unit production costs for the newer units. And this scissors went farther and farther apart throughout the eras.
And that means that this issue can't be properly handled by simply increasing ALL unit production costs at the same rate!
The unit production costs have to be increased accordingly to their era and the expected production output of the cities at that time. And it also needs to be respected that there are more different unit types and therefore there should be a somewhat higher overall amount of units compared to a standard game to ensure an exciting gameplay. That could for example mean a raise of the unit production costs for units from the classic era to a factor of maybe 1.1 or 1.2 but at the renaissance era a factor of maybe 1.8 or 2 might be the right thing.
And then you don't need to touch other aspects of the gameplay like the tech costs to fix issues that pop up just because of the wrong fix in the first place.
But, well, that is just my opinion...

 

[Aquila SPQR]

I have a strange problem - I can't update the game. When I click the "update" button - my updating progress goes from 0 to 100% in just a second but nothing happens. When I go back to the launcher it still says I have the old version and I have the yellow "update available" button. I can click "update" as many times as I want, but the result is still the same. I downloaded previously a mega civ pack.

I've tried today and everything went smoothly.

 

[zoob]

I started a new game with rev1054 and experienced cultural borders not expanding (see screenshot attached)

And somehow Revolutions is active again. Maybe it has been enabled by me opening BUG menu via Control+Alt+O (i did not alter any options^^)?

 

[45°38'N-13°47'E]

In the latest revision some default game options have been changed. No revolution was default On and now it's default Off since most people are using it.

 

[Vokarya]

I started a new game with rev1054 and experienced cultural borders not expanding (see screenshot attached)

Check your options (F8 screen or Ctrl-Shift-Q) and see if Realistic Culture Spread is on. From your screenshot, all the squares that aren't being expanded into are all squares that RCS requires more than one expansion to cover (hills, forest, or ocean).

 

[walkerjonny]

@45°38'N-13°47'E:
I have created an installation guide for MCP for AND2 including all required download links as it is a bit difficult for newbies to find all required files.
Maybe you want to update the launcher accordingly...
Here is the link to that post: https://forums.civfanatics.com/threads/updated-and-2-1-mega-civ-pack.521289/page-17#post-14693800

 

[45°38'N-13°47'E]

@45°38'N-13°47'E:
I have created an installation guide for MCP for AND2 including all required download links as it is a bit difficult for newbies to find all required files.
Maybe you want to update the launcher accordingly...
Here is the link to that post: https://forums.civfanatics.com/threads/updated-and-2-1-mega-civ-pack.521289/page-17#post-14693800

Thanks but MCP full installer is being updated only when there are major changes to the mod. We'll update it eventually but for the moment it's OK and anyway there is a full explanation at the link provided with the installer. Only the hotfix for the latest revision is not mentioned because it's a temporary solution before we release 1.8.3.

 

[zoob]

Thanks for your answers, 45° and Vokarya.

Realistic Culture Spread is awesome, you have to decide even more carefully where to build a new city.

Hey, i wonder what those other inactive BUG options are Maybe i try Flexible AI for example.