Any news on the possibility of DLL being released?

[sukritact]

But on the other hand I do think that you, sukritact and others underestimate what can be done with it.

It will give the ability to "fix the game" on so many way that I can't think of them all, because there is no limitation on gameplay once you have access to it.

Almost every time someone says "I don't like the way this gameplay element is done by Firaxis", it could be fixed with DLL access.

I don't underestimate it. I just have very little desire to touch those bits YOU believe are crucial. Your priorities are NOT my priorities, nor are they everyone else's priorities. Which is why most of the Civ VI modders I know aren't as irked by the lack of DLL access as you are.

So like I said. Your mileage will vary.

 

[TreVor_ish]

Like I said. Your mileage will vary.

Off course it's gonna vary, but with dll we will be limited by engine itself. Not by how much was given by few hooks.

 

[sukritact]

Off course it's gonna vary, but with dll we will be limited by engine itself. Not by how much was given by few hooks.

Well yes, but just because you could do more with the DLL doesn't mean you currently can do nothing. Just because I already have the ability to add a Blue Monkey of Destruction that gives adjacent units +100 Combat Strength doesn't mean it's something I'd like to do for instance.

I don't NOT want DLL access, but I'm just saying we already have a reasonable amount of flexibility within our current limits.

 

[Gedemon]

Like I said. Your mileage will vary.

per individual, yes, but not at a community level.

 

[AntSou]

I already have the ability to add a Blue Monkey of Destruction

Can't wait for BMD. Instead of Uranium, it requires Bananas.

 

[sukritact]

per individual, yes, but not at a community level.

And I think you greatly overestimate both what the modding community will be able to do with it; but I guess we'll have to agree to disagree.

 

[Deliverator]

Blue Monkey of Destruction

Uh oh. Didn't Giant Death Robots start as a joke on CFC?

 

[Gedemon]

And I think you greatly overestimate both what the modding community will be able to do with it; but I guess we'll have to agree to disagree.

That the community may do nothing with it is a strong possibility this late in development. But denying the abilities it would have opened... It's not that I disagree, I just can't understand the position.

 

[TreVor_ish]

Well yes, but just because you could do more with the DLL doesn't mean you currently can do nothing.

No one said You can do nothing. But can we mod back spying on allies?? Can we make deal more equitable working again?? Can we build a building that prevents environmental damage?? We can't. (or please, enlighten my sorrow darkness) And those are rather three simple things I would like to have working.

 

[pokiehl]

No one said You can do nothing. But can we mod back spying on allies?? Can we make deal more equitable working again?? Can we build a building that prevents environmental damage?? We can't. (or please, enlighten my sorrow darkness) And those are rather three simple things I would like to have working.

No one is disputing whatsoever that the dll will open up more possibilities. You’re strawmanning what Sukritact and I have said or you’re missing the point.

 

[Zegangani]

Seeing even the very few Modders that Civ VI have in account arg if the DLL is THAT crucial for modding, just leaves the impression that the devs might be much less likely of thinking to release the DLL for us.

I used to mod only with the database modifiers and thought that we can make various things with them. Which is true, but with Lots of limitations (and there are not enough IMO). Hence, I started to learn lua in order to overcome the limitations, and guess what? it's even more restricted. We cannot make a lot of things that should be at least possible with lua. Perhaps it is possible, but because of the lack of documentation, it's like groping around in a dark room. With access to more lua objects and a better/reliable interaction between Gameplay and UI Scripts, it would open a lot of possibilities, so that we can make even new considerable mechanisms with them. But how do we gonna make AI make use of those? in a Proper way? Ok, let's just jump back to modifiers, are YOU really happy with the current AI decisions? do you really think the AI is making a good use out of the things added with Mods? Yeah,... exactly. NOPE.

I might be a newbie to the Civ modding community, who doesn't know exactly what can be achieved with access to DLL, but as long as we cannot make AI better with our current possibilities, I won't be satisfied with the Game till we get the DLL. And I'm even willing to learn C++, if the DLL gets out, in order to get rid of the current stupidity of AI (not to mention Diplomacy, Deals, CS, Units management...). I would even pay for it.

 

[c4c6]

[...] We can't.

Depends also on how much you want modify existing things or create completely new ones ... "painting by numbers" vs. "unlimited freedom".

I already have the ability to add a Blue Monkey of Destruction that gives adjacent units +100 Combat Strength

Can't wait for BMD. Instead of Uranium, it requires Bananas.

I'd say you are up to something ... Bananas! ... Now I can see the Blue Monkeys of Destruction ... They stand on a desktop. Three in a line. And all three hold their hands in front of their eyes.

 

[Relic56]

I might be a newbie to the Civ modding community, who doesn't know exactly what can be achieved with access to DLL, but as long as we cannot make AI better with our current possibilities, I won't be satisfied with the Game till we get the DLL. And I'm even willing to learn C++, if the DLL gets out, in order to get rid of the current stupidity of AI (not to mention Diplomacy, Deals, CS, Units management...). I would even pay for it.

What do you think "making the AI better" entails? You seem to treat it like a simple on/off switch, or some basic things that can be done after doing a C++ tutorial... If it were that easy to create a competent AI surely the devs would have done it by now.

 

[Nerevatar]

What do you think "making the AI better" entails? You seem to treat it like a simple on/off switch, or some basic things that can be done after doing a C++ tutorial... If it were that easy to create a competent AI surely the devs would have done it by now.

Vox populi did it, so it is possible. Will it be hard? Yes it most definitely will. But someone will do it eventually, as with most (all?) other 4x games where the option was given.

 

[AntSou]

I'd say you are up to something ... Bananas! ... Now I can see the Blue Monkeys of Destruction ... They stand on a desktop. Three in a line. And all three hold their hands in front of their eyes.

There's already a blueish Monkey of Destruction who stood on a desktop.

 

[Gedemon]

What do you think "making the AI better" entails? You seem to treat it like a simple on/off switch, or some basic things that can be done after doing a C++ tutorial... If it were that easy to create a competent AI surely the devs would have done it by now.

It's not easy, but modders have something the devs have not: no time/development cost ratio.

 

[Relic56]

Vox populi did it, so it is possible. Will it be hard? Yes it most definitely will. But someone will do it eventually, as with most (all?) other 4x games where the option was given.

I'm not denying that someone will try it, nor am I arguing that it's impossible. But it's a lot harder than "I will learn C++ to make it."

 

[TreVor_ish]

No one is disputing whatsoever that the dll will open up more possibilities. You’re strawmanning what Sukritact and I have said or you’re missing the point.

Forgive me if I sound a little anxious, but I'm not the one with pretensions attitude whether or not community (as a whole or by particular people) would or not be able to do this or that if door would be open wider.
Even with full freedom in modding after this many years, a miracle might actually never happen. But the ability to change at least a part of a gameplay that I do like to spend my free time in, is really something I would be very happy to be able to do. And Yes, programming AI is quite complex and it would take probably years to make it somewhat satisfactory. But the first step is to at least not have to reverse engineer everything.

 

[pokiehl]

Forgive me if I sound a little anxious, but I'm not the one with pretensions attitude whether or not community (as a whole or by particular people) would or not be able to do this or that if door would be open wider.

I'm not quite understanding what you're implying but if it's anything like the last 2 or 3 times you've quoted me, it's a sarcastic attack. It's getting tiresome, so I'd appreciate it if you stopped. We can disagree without resorting to remarks like this.

Even with full freedom in modding after this many years, a miracle might actually never happen. But the ability to change at least a part of a gameplay that I do like to spend my free time in, is really something I would be very happy to be able to do. And Yes, programming AI is quite complex and it would take probably years to make it somewhat satisfactory. But the first step is to at least not have to reverse engineer everything.

I understand this is an emotionally charged topic for some people so all we can do is agree to disagree here. I feel like we're just going back and forth and my initial point isn't being understood.

The fact is I haven’t said a single thing about what the community can or cannot do with the dll. I don’t know why people keep resorting to this. Again, it must be because emotions run high about the topic.

 

[leif erikson]

I think we can all agree that it would be best if the .dll's were released. Then we can have hope for an amazing modder project to fix any number of things and make the game better for the community, even if the majority of users do not even know it exists.

I can recall in Civ4 that Firaxis asked to use some of the best mods from here and incorporated them into the expansion packs. Do not see why that is not a great example for them?