Arioch's Analyst Thread

[MisterBarca]

Arioch,

Has there been any screenshot (esp. with unit stats) of the city-state unique units? Do we have any idea whether they will be stronger than their normal unit counterparts (as national unique units are)?

 

[12agnar0k]

"endings become" nice name, "the end has come" would be the English way of saying it I guess.
Which is a fitting name for a volcano

 

[Tatran]

@SickFak
Modo? Horror from the nineties.

 

[SJSerio]

Arioch,

Has there been any screenshot (esp. with unit stats) of the city-state unique units? Do we have any idea whether they will be stronger than their normal unit counterparts (as national unique units are)?

I'm thinking that there might not be any! So far, there has been no sign. And when it was mentioned, it was not a definite thing... just speculation.

 

[Jaybe]

re foreign-built Roads in your borders:
While you have to pay for them, you'll be able to pillage/destroy them ... but by using a worker, not a combat unit.

I read it here somewhere, and I think it was official.

 

[Ahriman]

I read it here somewhere, and I think it was official.

I think much of this was early speculation based on the Siamese elephant unit, when we thought that there couldn't possibly be room for Siam in the main 18 civs (that would mean leaving out Mongols, and no-one would do that right?) - and so that anything Siamese/Khmer must be a city state.

We heard that city states can give you units, but its not clear that they would be *unique* units.

Its a shame. There's so much scope for awesome city state units (Genovese crossbows, Swiss pikemen, Venetian war galleys, Scottish highlanders, Malaccan corsairs, Jerusalem zealots, Omani dhows, Brazilian bikini babes....)

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

Note to self, make friends with Rio.

 

[MisterBarca]

I think much of this was early speculation based on the Siamese elephant unit, when we thought that there couldn't possibly be room for Siam in the main 18 civs (that would mean leaving out Mongols, and no-one would do that right?) - and so that anything Siamese/Khmer must be a city state.

We heard that city states can give you units, but its not clear that they would be *unique* units.

Its a shame. There's so much scope for awesome city state units (Genovese crossbows, Swiss pikemen, Venetian war galleys, Scottish highlanders, Malaccan corsairs, Jerusalem zealots, Omani dhows, Brazilian bikini babes....)

Hmmm, I thought I read in a recent review somewhere that the gifted city-state units could be unique.

Brazilian bikini babes--a good one!

 

[Venereus]

Can Sparta be a City-state too? Or is it only a greek city? Because the unique units they would gift you...man...

 

[Polobo]

City-States have their own technology trees (through to what distinction - 1/type or 1/CS) as thus can easily have unique units associated with them; whether they do (or will) is a question in search of an answer. I agree it would be fun if that were to be the case (and definately make attacking/allying a city-state that much more difficult/valuable).

Regarding roads; If a road already in culture becomes neutral it should be auto-razed (as should all tile improvements). The only way this can happen (I think) is if you raze a city to the ground and in that case any tiles that would normally be transfered with that city during a change-of-owner should instead be razed as well. Solves the owned->neutral road maintenance issue (neutral->owned is easy, as is simple ownership change).

 

[12agnar0k]

I'm thinking that there might not be any! So far, there has been no sign. And when it was mentioned, it was not a definite thing... just speculation.

No, Militaristic City-States definitely give UU's, its just a matter of what ones, do they have their own, of will they just give you a random UU from the highest technology the leading Civ has, or maybe from their technology level.

Is it confirmed that city-states have thier own technology trees? I can't remember if that was speculation or not, if its true then all of their units from their tree could very well be unique /

 

[AriochIV]

Has there been any screenshot (esp. with unit stats) of the city-state unique units? Do we have any idea whether they will be stronger than their normal unit counterparts (as national unique units are)?

No information on that. The person giving the E3 presentation mentioned them, and I seem to recall one other E3-era previewer that mentioned them, but I haven't heard anything about it since. They might not have made it into the game, or we may have misunderstood what was said.

Same with city-state technology trees; this was mentioned in a preview, but no hard data on it.

 

[Mercade]

Ive heard of the Americas map pack and the middle east map pack...but which store is offering a Mediterranean map pack?

And there's an Asian map too. There are four. See this post for a description of all four and the shops that are offering them. Then see this post for links and pricing.

 

[Semmel]

The problem is that Spear ->Sword is not an appropriate upgrade

So the Warrior might not be part of an upgrade path

Warrior upgrades to
->Sword path
OR
->Spear path if Sword path is not available

Spear path
Spear->Pike->Rifle path
Sword path
Sword->Longsword->Rifle

Bow Path
Archer->Crossbow->Rifle path

Musket->Rifle path

Rifle path
Rifle->Infantry->Mech Infantry

Artillery path
Catapult->Tebuchet->Cannon->Artillery->Rocket Artillery

Chariot Archer->Knight path
Horseman->Knight path
Knight Path
Knight->Lancer->Cavalry->?Tank->Modern Armor

AA gun->Mobile SAM

AT gun?->Helicopter?

Ship path
Trireme->Caravel->Frigate->Ironclad->Destroyer ??-> (Missile Cruiser)..since Nuclear sub takes the antisub role

Sub->Nuclear Sub

Battleship->Missile Cruiser

Fighter->Jet Fighter

Bomber->Stealth Bomber

Atomic Bomb->Nuclear Missile

Stand alones (probably)
Carrier
Guided Missile
GDR
Paratrooper

From Civ4 and from gameplay aspects, i would do it a little different. I guess the modern cavalery are helicopter gunships. And the modern counter to them are AA unit. So I would suspect that the uprgade path can fork off too. For example:

Warrior->Spear->Pike->Rifle
Warrior->Sword->Longsword->Rifle
Archer->Crossbow->Rifle
Musket->Rifle
Rifle->Infantry->Mech Infantry
Rifle->AT gun->Mech Infantry
Rifle->Paratroopers->Mech Infantry
Rifle->AA gun->Mobile SAM

Catapult->Tebuchet->Cannon->Artillery->Rocket Artillery

Chariot Archer->Knight
Horseman->Knight
Knight->Lancer->Cavalry->Helicopter

What I dont like about this is, that all foot units seem to become a Rifleman at some point. but there are just no other units available.. I would like to see some otherpaths.. like Warrior->Spear->Pike->?->AT gun/AA gun. And that AT gun and AA gun can not come from a rifle man. That way a counter unit (spear) would always stay a counter unit until the very end. Maybe the Musket man could be used, even without historical evidence.

Warrior->Spear->Pike->Musket
Musket->AA gun->Mobile SAM
Musket->AT gun->Mech Infantry

Warrior->Sword->Longsword->Rifle
Archer->Crossbow->Rifle
Rifle->Infantry->Mech Infantry
Rifle->Paratroopers->Mech Infantry

 

[Schuesseled]

re foreign-built Roads in your borders:
While you have to pay for them, you'll be able to pillage/destroy them ... but by using a worker, not a combat unit.

I read it here somewhere, and I think it was official.

You are correct but pillage probably isn't the right word, maybe unbuild? Dismantle?

 

[Schuesseled]

He said it right there...Vesuvius.

Vesuvius was the name of the anrgy shaking mountain, it was renamed volcano.

 

[stealth_nsk]

OK, recent French preview confirms Legion requires Iron.
So it's definitely worries me, why the screenshot doesn't show an ability to upgrade Warrior to Spearman.

 

[12agnar0k]

Vesuvius was the name of the anrgy shaking mountain, it was renamed volcano.

And one day the mountain shook, news spread fast amoung the known world, come see the great shaking mountain, and they came, they all came, every single last humman on earth, to see the angry shaking mountain, proof of god on earth, and one day, displeased his his offerings of virginal scrafice the mountain did destroy the humans, and that was the end of that.

 

[marioflag]

Is Vesuvio a new confirmed natural wonder? That would be fantastic.

 

[Bino]

Is Vesuvio a new confirmed natural wonder? That would be fantastic.

Im wondering why you say that