Back In the Saddle: Monarch, Normal, Not Huts, NO Events, Fractal.

[i_imperator]

Hey all, So ive been playing civ a bit again, and have decided I need some help with my game play, Ive been having a tough time trying to get anything past lib on emperor so ill bump this one back down to monarch and will roll a random leader.

Ive noticed that my decisions are not the best and my worker micro isn't either, I could use some help with this, and that's what this play-through will hopefully be focused on.I have also noticed that around education and lib is generally the time when I tend to fall behind and the AI propels ahead in tech and every other aspect Feel free to provide critique and play along if you wish, just remember to post spoilers if you play ahead of me

Ill try my best to update this as much as possible, and will play at least 20 turns a day. And I'll try and play slow, taking time to think about actions and decisions.

Our Leader is Hannibal of Carthage,


Settings (All Random Fractal)


And the start!



Yikes, Double gold and Double plains cow.
apologies for the spelling on the thread title, that should be NO Huts, how do i change that again? thanks

 

[Tempesta13]

You can see the river by the gold in the screenshot. There may be irrigated wheat or something to the West if you SIP but I wouldn't risk it. I'd move warrior 1 NE just to check up there first - then move settler 1 SW. You lose one of the cows but you wouldn't lose any green tiles and could settle there (1 SW) without wasting a turn. You at least pick up some more green riverside if nothing else. Depending on what you see/don't see I'd consider wasting a turn to continue moving West or Southwest in search of food.

If there is more food spending a turn moving 2W could be a great starting spot with double gold, plains cow, riverside grassland with HOPEFULLY irrigated corn/wheat or pigs. Worst case you work 3 farms, cow and 2 gold and aim for an early rush. No ocean in sight so you should have neighbors - never know with Fractal though.

Looks like flood plains to the SW too.

 

[i_imperator]

You can see the river by the gold in the screenshot. There may be irrigated wheat or something to the West if you SIP but I wouldn't risk it. I'd move warrior 1 NE just to check up there first - then move settler 1 SW. You lose one of the cows but you wouldn't lose any green tiles and could settle there (1 SW) without wasting a turn. You at least pick up some more green riverside if nothing else. Depending on what you see/don't see I'd consider wasting a turn to continue moving West or Southwest in search of food.

If there is more food spending a turn moving 2W could be a great starting spot with double gold, plains cow, riverside grassland with HOPEFULLY irrigated corn/wheat or pigs. Worst case you work 3 farms, cow and 2 gold and aim for an early rush. No ocean in sight so you should have neighbors - never know with Fractal though.

Looks like flood plains to the SW too.

Very accurate analysis Tempesta13, There's not much point in SIPing on this start as the food is so bad, if I moved 1n i could get both golds into the BFC but i dont think its worth it, i can always settle my second city if there's better food up there, see the spoiler for the result.

Spoiler :

Ok I followed your advice and moved the warrior 1NE, you were correct it actually revealed furs and irrigated wheat, there is also a suggestion of a coastline. I could settle right in the middle of the wheat furs and plains cow, making it a bit better for food. The game is recommending I move to that location 2 SE maby if it is a coastline there's seafood there?

 

[pigswill]

I'd be tempted to move settler 1SW, no point having double gold if you don't have food to work both and still grow. If you've got coast to the east then you can backfill it later.

 

[cseanny]

I'd move the settler to the warrior, move warrior 1NE next turn, and then decide where to settle.

 

[Pangaea]

Tough call. It looks like between the resources you mention could be coastal, but hard to tell from just a picture. Tile gazing is easier as you can see if there are waves crashing towards land when properly zoomed in. If you settle there you'll have 3 good tiles in cows and wet wheat, but there is a lot of brown tiles around. Can always hope for sea resources ofc, IF this indeed is coastal.

It's more tempting to move SW and check out the river down that way tbh, but the risk with that is you find yourself in a region with no food at all. The golds is a big draw, though, so maybe it is worth the risk? Can go SW with settler, then W, and if you find good food there, settling 1S of gold (1N of the settler's location after the first turn) would be good as you can work both golds and there is freshwater.

Moving NE is the safe choice as you know there is food, but getting those golds from the off would really power up your research.

Edit: I had to check it out...

Spoiler :

Moving SW was a mistake as there was no food, unfortunately.

 

[Dhar Khosis]

The blue circle SE-E of the settler could be seen even before moving the warrior. Would it been better to move the warrior there to check that place out? Hannibal starts with fishing and has a Harbor-UB so a coastal start (you can see the waves SE of the blue circle) wouldn't be bad?

Moving the Settler SW gives you at least a floodplain(?), that can be farmed, so if there's no other food-resource it's not all bad.

But at the moment NE-NE looks best (also coastal - from the waves). It's also not eliminating the other settling spots (blue circle and SW) for later cities.

 

[Macksideshow]

If I had to play this start, I would go NE-NE. Thats a good hammer capital and I would hope for a nearby target to rush or take a shot at a wonder or 2. You are going to have good early happiness, however I am lost for ideas as to how to leverage that.

 

[MegaLurker]

1W of the wheat is an excellent city. Probably not even worth moving your warrior again to check for seafood locations. If you get lucky with seafood that becomes a ridiculous early city.

It may not be the way you like to play, but if you find horses on a start with this much early commerce you should be able to take your entire landmass with horse archers.

 

[cseanny]

and will play at least 20 turns a day.

O really!? This is the second day mister!

 

[i_imperator]

O really!? This is the second day mister!

I do have college and a few assignments to get around to , the first round will be up tomorrow, I think I know where i am going to settle, NE NE seems like the safest place to go.

 

[Pangaea]

College? Your priorities are all wrong!!!11

 

[i_imperator]

4000BC To 3500BC (Round 1, 20 Turns)



So I Decided to Move the warrior 1NE and move the settler NE NE, it seemed like the safest spot for a decent production capital, and I decided to have the capital to create a worker ASAP



The border pop of the capital later revealed seafood to the east however it is too far away for the capital to work it.



first techs were agriculture and animal husbandry to improve the obvious food sources surrounding the capital
First leader was met on turn 9, Pericles.



warrior scouting south, came across alot of jungle and eventually see Percilies Boarders ,thankfully there is quite the distance between us, at least it isnt Alex.





So the questions now are what techs do we get after animal husbandry, do we go for bronze working pottery and mysticism for some cottages and border growth? or could we go for writing and alpha? I'm wondering about wonders however we do not seem to have any those resources available. Of course there is always the possibility that we may have access to horses, bronze, or we could rex peacefully. Of course the obvious question is where do we settle our first city.

 

[The Oz-Man]

I can't figure out why you explored every direction except toward the gold. You're Hannibal! Get the shinies!

 

[Jet]

I would have gone Ag -> Hunting -> AH, and then Archery. You probably don't need Archers that early on Monarch, but it would be a good habit if you want to play higher levels later. In fact it might not be too late to switch to Hunting now. You'll probably have AH by the time you need it if you improve the furs second.

 

[cseanny]

Cant decide on city placement until more scouting is accomplished. Definitely find out whats W of 2x gold. And you really need more land info before deciding on what your tech path after AH will be. BW seems rather unattractive imo. I don't see lots of trees and I wouldn't be whipping away tiles like cows.

Hunting for sure! You want to get those beavers online asap. Myst will probably be needed for future city's. The fish to the south needs a pop for sure. The tricky part though is what you find past the gold mines. W/out BW monuments obviously take longer, and that can be problematic if most new cities need them immediately.

The Capital could always pump out its first settler at 4 pop (working wheat/2xcow/fur) and then build SH in the Capital. You're Charismatic so I don't see the harm in picking up Myst after Hunting if the need arises. It really does depend on what else you scout but I'm just saying, if it lets you bypass 20t for BW then denying AIs a Wonder and picking up charismatic monuments isn't Bad per se.

Alternatively you could indeed tech BW (after Hunt), followed by Myst and chop out SH in your 2nd city. This could become attractive if you find no horse and or more forest in future sites. But given your Capitals 2x cows, unforested hill, and 3 fur tile (and unattractive whipping) I'm still inclined to do my best and skip BW if possible.

So seeing how I'm not a fan of whipping this particular capital, not to mention cottages won't work either that leaves........at tech path of AH > Hunt > Myst > Writing > Alpha and back fill or AH > Hunt > Myst > Sailing > Masonry >

Personally I prefer the immediate beeline towards Alpha. Otherwise you still have to pick up Wheel/Pot/BW/Sailing/Masonry yourself. There's a good chance you can trade for all that stuff. The con is you get a delayed start on TGLH (if you decide that route) but on Monarch the AIs complete Wonders pretty slowly anyways.

And if someone wanted to Oracle something then the beeline for Alpha would leave the possibility of getting Poly or Med too. Of course everything I just wrote could change depending on what else you scout . Oh, and barbs are a joke on Monarch. I wouldn't waste my time getting Archery unless you find some horsies (HAs), but even then, I'd wait for it. Warriors are fine for now. Just get 3-4 out there fogbusting.

Edit: Did a bit of experimenting and if you want to beeline to Alpha I find it better to grow to 5 to you can work some worthless ocean tiles ^^.

 

[Pangaea]

Initial reaction here is I don't understand why you went straight south instead of scouting around your capital. The main priority of the early warrior/scout is to check out your surrounding land for good 2nd city locations. With some luck you bump into a close AI from which you can workersteal, but the main job is to scout in a circle around your capital so you know what the land looks like. Later on use him for fogbusting, in addition to a few more warriors. On this map it's easy since your coastal.

Not easy to decide on much else given we don't know about your surroundings, but Hunting looks like a good option due to beavers.

You haven't met more leaders by turn 20? Maybe that doesn't mean too much on this level, but it COULD indicate semi-isolation, at least pre-exploring workboat. Speaking of, once the main priorities are done (some warriors, a settler and probably another worker), you can get out a workboat and send it around the coast, probably northwards since you have already explored the coast down to Pericles - just hope ice doesn't block it off.

The initial warrior is already so far away you may as well use him to scout down there, and into Greek lands once Writing and OB is in, but use your second warrior to scout your west. You NEED to know if there is food near those golds.

Hopefully you find a better capital spot later on, because with so much brown land it's hardly prime cottage land. Few hills too, but decent hammers anyway due to double plains cows. Poor food aside, plains cows aren't bad tiles to work, especially as you are financial. Don't they turn into 333 then? Pretty sweet if correct.

Edit: Actually, think I mis-remembered that one, they probably don't add 1 commerce. Still a pretty good tile in terms of yields though.

 

[Dhar Khosis]

I agree with the other posters regarding your "interesting" scouting pattern

And I would have gone Hunting before AH, you get extra % for teching AH if you have both pre-techs. After that probably Mysticism, not sure if going for SH is worth it though. (I usually play normal speed and nTT - so my tech suggestions may be a bit off).

I think I would want to settle on the gHill N-NW of the fish as a third (fourth?) city. The second one somewhere by the gold. In respect to the fish-city maybe SW of the river-Gold (if there's food). The problem I see is, that there's less than overlap in between and I don't see me wanting to put a filler into that brown tiles somewehere - so the maintenance costs will be higher. And alas, that clam tile in the east seems unworkable, too, if there's no island. So may need to tech Wheel to connect your cities after Myst.

The desert to the SW and the jungle makes expanding in the direction of Pericles not attractive, so hopefully going west doesn't give us too many tundra tiles.

 

[i_imperator]

In terms of my scouting, I went that route just as preference, i think it is safer to scout around water or coastline, not as many barbs, I agree with not having to get archery on monarch, warrior fog-busting should be enough. And on Emperor I do get either chariots or archers anyways if the barbs do become a problem. I will scout back up again, (Yes im starting to see why its a weird pattern )

I will pick up hunting so after AH, might as well finish that and see if there is horse around. As for the second city site ill decide on that when im at 3 to 4 pop.

Edit: I have to rush to a lecture now but ill address the rest of the critique later

 

[cseanny]

I agree with the other posters regarding your "interesting" scouting pattern

LoL. I guess I'm a noob because I like his scout path very much. Fogbusting coast is safer and opens up trade via sailing later. The capital has 2X Cows so you can easily get 3-4 Warriors out before you even start your 1st Settler. I've already played many many many turns and I used the exact opening scout pattern, so Piff!

Lots and lots of time to scout around the Capital. Besides, lots of jungle gives good protection and nice chance for a Wood II and potential worker steals later.