broken wonders/world projects

[Dancing Hoskuld]

Well, a Golden Age increases your hammer output a good bit. I took the 70-100 turn number as being 1% of the total game turns, as IIRC we have ~100 Great Wonders.

I was not saying build a wonder in a golden age just that the time it takes to build a wonder should not be longer than the time for half a golden age. Especially since most wonders, including The Pyramids, were built in much less time than the time in one game turn.

 

[Hydromancerx]

If I make a list I may as well do it myself.

Hey I make big lists all the time with specific data. Planning it is half the battle. Look at all the terrain info I give you for new terrain features and resources. That's the kind of planning I want from you if you want me to fix them. Tell me exactly how you want it fixed and I will do it.

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

Hey I make big lists all the time with specific data. Planning it is half the battle. Look at all the terrain info I give you for new terrain features and resources. That's the kind of planning I want from you if you want me to fix them. Tell me exactly how you want it fixed and I will do it.

That is new stuff. I am doing a great deal of work on old stuff (resources, terrains and improvements) which results from people complaining about balance. No list provided. Same goes for old wonder buildings; and it is mainly the ones we inherited from RoM/AND and earlier that are the problem.

 

[Hydromancerx]

Fine I will go through the tree to find them all.

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

Fine I will go through the tree to find them all.

Use the XML Scanner by Koshling on building class to find all the ones which are wonders. Then the buildings to find the costs etc.

 

[Hydromancerx]

@Dancing Hoskuld

Ok here is a list of current costs ...

- Angkor Wat = 550
- Catacombs of Kom el Shozufa = 300
- Cheomseongdae = 500
- Chichen Itza = 650
- Circus Maximus = 400
- Flavian Amphatheater = 450
- Hadrian's Wall = 250
- Inuksuk = 200
- Labyrinth of Knossos = 600
- Lascaux Paints = 90
- Mausoleum of Maussollos = 450
- Moai Statues = 250
- Nazca Lines = 400
- Olympic Games = 800
- Pergamon Alter = 350
- Petra = 300
- Piazza San Marco = 800
- Plato's Academy = 400
- Shwedagon Paya = 450
- Silk Road = 400
- Stonehenge = 120
- Sun Tzu Art of War = 400
- Temple of Ah Caccao = 525
- Terracotta Army = 300
- The Colossus = 250
- The Great Bath of Mohenjo-Daro = 500
- The Great Library = 350
- The Great Lighthouse = 200
- The Great Wall = 250
- The Hanging Gardens = 300
- The Oracle = 150
- The Pyramids = 600
- The Sphinx = 250
- The Temple of Artemus = 350
- Theater of Dionysus = 300
- Tlaloc's Alter = 300
- Valley of the Kings = 500
- Via Appia = 600

Which ones do you think should be changed and to what value?

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

@Dancing Hoskuld

Ok here is a list of current costs ...

- Angkor Wat = 550 - too low
- Catacombs of Kom el Shozufa = 300 - OK
- Cheomseongdae = 500
- Chichen Itza = 650
- Circus Maximus = 400
- Flavian Amphatheater = 450 - too low
- Hadrian's Wall = 250 - too low
- Inuksuk = 200 - OK
- Labyrinth of Knossos = 600 - OK
- Lascaux Paints = 90 - OK
- Mausoleum of Maussollos = 450
- Moai Statues = 250
- Nazca Lines = 400 - OK
- Olympic Games = 800 - OK
- Pergamon Alter = 350 - OK
- Petra = 300 - too low
- Piazza San Marco = 800 - OK
- Plato's Academy = 400 - too low
- Shwedagon Paya = 450 - too low
- Silk Road = 400 - OK
- Stonehenge = 120
- Sun Tzu Art of War = 400 - OK
- Temple of Ah Caccao = 525
- Terracotta Army = 300
- The Colossus = 250 - too low
- The Great Bath of Mohenjo-Daro = 500 - OK
- The Great Library = 350 - too low
- The Great Lighthouse = 200 - too low
- The Great Wall = 250 - too low
- The Hanging Gardens = 300 - too low
- The Oracle = 150 - too low
- The Pyramids = 600 - OK
- The Sphinx = 250 - too low
- The Temple of Artemus = 350 - too low
- Theater of Dionysus = 300 - too low
- Tlaloc's Alter = 300
- Valley of the Kings = 500 - OK
- Via Appia = 600

Which ones do you think should be changed and to what value?

Is that the real cost of just the icost? If you look at Bull Leaping I did not change the icost just the era indicator to get it right.

 

[Hydromancerx]

Is that the real cost of just the icost? If you look at Bull Leaping I did not change the icost just the era indicator to get it right.

Yes this is the iCost. In games costs chnage depending upon your speed, which is why I used the iCost.

Also what about the ones you did not mark OK or Too Low?

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

Yes this is the iCost. In games costs chnage depending upon your speed, which is why I used the iCost.

Also what about the ones you did not mark OK or Too Low?

Then I had nothing to say because I can't remember building them in a game.

 

[Sgtslick]

Increase them ALL by 50% and reduce the bonuses from stone etc, this is simple way to fix.

From here you can adjust further down the line with feedback etc

How can you scan to get a list? I can do this balancing for you if I know how to get a list. And ill adjust on a case by case depending on strength and those im unsure about we'll discuss. I can have a draft done by tomorrow (aus time).

I'd need instructions if you wanted me to adjust anything other than xml.

 

[Hydromancerx]

I just went down the tree looking for wonders. I skipped National Wonders and Religion specific Wonders.

Anywho +50% to the ones he marked sounds good to me.

 

[Hydromancerx]

@Dancing Hoskuld

Here are the revised numbers by increasing by 50%.

- Angkor Wat = 850
- Flavian Amphatheater = 650
- Hadrian's Wall = 375
- Petra = 450
- Plato's Academy = 600
- Shwedagon Paya = 675
- The Colossus = 375
- The Great Library = 525
- The Great Lighthouse = 300
- The Great Wall = 375
- The Hanging Gardens = 450
- The Oracle = 225
- The Sphinx = 375
- The Temple of Artemus = 525
- Theater of Dionysus = 450

How's this sound?

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

Increasing by 50% is not good enough that takes the Great Wall and Oracle from 4-5 turns on snail to 6-7 turns still way too fast. Similarly the Colossus and Great Lighthouse.

 

[Hydromancerx]

Well then by how much? Double? Triple? Give me some numbers.

 

[Sgtslick]

Maybe just make them universal price per era, and some more powerful ones more expensive. Also if they have a (double with stone or +50% with stone +50% with marble or anything these need to be reduced or increase the overall price so this bonus isn't as effective). Like 250 prehistoric, 500 ancient, 750 classical, 1000 renaissance etc. (not sure obviously). 500 for oracle that would mean for example- +100% is that +50% marble? then make it like 650 or something, as an example. I think much higher than this could be too much, 650 sounds about right to me.

 

[Hydromancerx]

Ok I increased a bunch to 50% and then The Great Wall, Oracle, Colossus, Great Lighthouse and Stonehenge to 100%

 

[Sgtslick]

Can you decrease the bonuses from stone/marble to wonders too, like if its +50% make it +25%, if its +100% make it 50% etc. I think even more but up to you. I think generally don't have too many +50% only a couple imo.

 

[Thunderbrd]

I would think instead of giving these wonders a bonus to production times for critical resources, that they would only be buildable if those resources were possessed!

 

[Hydromancerx]

@Sgtslick

I disagree and think that bonus is actually balanced. Its only because we have had so many more buildings producing that the wonders were off in cost.

 

[Sgtslick]

What about the 'Double production with' surely this isn't balanced. Its a big disadvantage if you don't have copper/gold/marble/stone for building such and such wonders. Up to you, im just happy they got increased regardless.