Bts "DUNE WARS" {Development Thread}

[Phoenician]

on the priviuos game when you won - the ai did ok right? more then one city?

I played against 2 AI and they both had 2 cities. Although I beat them early, so I can't tell you if they would have built more cities or not.

the picture shows me that you have unit naming option as on - this option must be off, cause it will sure cause problems - cause it wont fiind the names of units - cause i changed them all - ill remove that tab from the bug menu,
you can access it by pressing - ctrl +alt+o.

I didn't realized I had this option on. If I turn it off, the game will stop bugging up so much?

edit: I just disabled it-game still craps up.

I would recommend that you guys try playing as Atreides-the first UB rocks and the Atreides Hornet is a Godly unit---real tough.
If you want to REX, I recommend building The Imperial Space Port--the 2 free merchants can really save your economy.


Let me know when you have an un-bugged version. I'm getting too frustrated playing with all these bugs. It will probably take you
a while considering how many bugs there are. I'm gonna take a step back from touching the mod any further I think--at this point
I'm just gonna test stuff.

Ok, I'm gonna go back to watching Eraserhead.

Later.

 

[keldath]

ok pheonician,

testing is good,

eraserhead? its a horror movie right???

i have to know more about the selection and the bugging issues - i didnt quite understand what you ment and whats the problem,
i gotta see a speciphic example.




*****

ok i think i figured why the ai didnt build more then 1-2 cities...i set the terrain to provide no values at all - the only one was grass,
so the ai knew that it shouldnt build cities on it - cause its a land that wont provide food - like in the vanilla it wont build on desert or snow...

another thing is that buy mistake - i made the plains terrain, thhat a city couldnt be build on.......silly me,

im now fixing this.

also,
i reworked the entire unit ai,
ive made some mistakes there that obiusly...will cause the ai not to use the units as it should.

also ive seperated hovers and transport units to be sea based,

to the hoovers i gave the defult ai of a caraval , frigate and a destroyer,- so they will scout and attack the seas.
transports where given mostly that of a transport in the vanilla,
except sand apc - that i gave it trirame properties.

im now gonna test it -
and if it goes well it should work like the vanilla game.


pheonician,
im very interested to know a detailed report of what you refered to as stuff that bugged you through the gameplay -
selectin unit - what is it?
naming unit - must be disabled - ill remove bug tab from next version

what else?

plz help me kill those bugs buddy .


***
another thing pheonician,
because of the upgraded improvement system,
and the fact that i have to give food values to terrain, i was thinking of lowering the growth speed of cities a great deal, so, the cities wont grow to mega cities fast.

 

[Phoenician]

I think you got most of the bugs figured out.
The selecting bug occurs right when the game starts-like in the screenshots I posted.
If you start a game and it doesn't happen then you have fixed the problem.
Try training a soldier and then see if it is bugged-it will take you minute to test it out.

Please allow land units to enter land-desert. Did Melinko give you the worm stuff yet?
Spice melange shows up on desert a lot, and not being able to work it is annoying.

About growth, I thought there was only one farm improvement type?? unlike mines etc.
If there is only one type of farm improvement--I would leave growth a lone.
If there is more than one farm improvement--like how mines work-just remove the additional farm improvement instead of slowing growth.
I would just make farms as one improvement that gives a +1 food when you research biology-but other than that does not give more food.
The food system is already nerfed--most of the food resources only give you +1food when you build a farm on it.

Eraserhead is more of an art-film than it is a horror film.

fix the bugs that we know of, send me the latest version. I test it out for you and then we fix anything else that needs it.

 

[keldath]

hey,

well..i dont have the selecting thing.

melinko disappeared man....bummer....

im allowing only hornet type units to go over desert,

the rest will have to use transports to cross desert.
in order to work desert tiles - theres a desert former - harvester.

humm...try playing 500 turn game - the cities growing to 30+ size....ill send you later the files after some more optimization.
ill delete the tech food plus.
but the land gives 1 food + improvement lvl 3+ resource - its alot of food.

ill change the windtrap improvements to be desert aswell.



maybe ill watch eraserhead...

 

[Phoenician]

hey,

well..i dont have the selecting thing.

melinko disappeared man....bummer....

im allowing only hornet type units to go over desert,

the rest will have to use transports to cross desert.
in order to work desert tiles - theres a desert former - harvester.

humm...try playing 500 turn game - the cities growing to 30+ size....ill send you later the files after some more optimization.
ill delete the tech food plus.
but the land gives 1 food + improvement lvl 3+ resource - its alot of food.

ill change the windtrap improvements to be desert aswell.



maybe ill watch eraserhead...

that all seems to work, good thinking.
Eraserhead is a good Lynch film but I like Mulholland Dr. and Inland Empire more.
The Elephant Man is good as well.

take his worm unit and make it a seperate barb civ.
Make it have ridiculous strength and cause collateral damage but can't kill--just like an artillery unit. Problem solved.

 

[keldath]

hummm.....pheonician..........

i rather that you delete the comment..or make it more subtle...

im sure he has his reasons not to be available...no need to be mean to the guy, he only waned to help...

*******
i adore the elephant man...
the rest i haven't seen - maybe ill try and get those.

edit:

heres the files : http://uploading.com/files/7B25QSSX/files.exe.html

replaced the related files.

 

[Phoenician]

edit:

heres the files : http://uploading.com/files/7B25QSSX/files.exe.html

replaced the related files.

I'll check it out.

 

[Phoenician]

umm...sometimes the game craps up and sometimes it plays completely normal.

I usually play with new random seed and lock modified assets.
Do you think this is causing problems?
Or is it something else?

EDIT:
Yeah, I found the cause of this bug. It's caused by locked modified assets option.

 

[keldath]

well dont use that option...

i never turned it on - only random seed.

 

[Phoenician]

I'm playing as Atreides on monarch difficulty--mahdi speed--standard map size-3 continents- 8/9 civs.

It's pretty challenging-despite a very strong specialist economy- my economy is struggling a bit. I tried to build the pyramids but I lost that race. If I had representation-my economy would be in much better shape. But I did build the imperial space port and great film book library-which have boosted my economy significantly.
I took out Rabban so far--ironically Vladammir Harkonnen is pleased with me because we share the same religion. But then again you never know when he can turn on me.
He is my next target--I have a good army but no good transport--right now I am trying to tech for Sand APC so I can transport my army over to Harkonnen land. Right now I have 7 cities.
I'll let you know how the game turns out:

the only complaints I have is without worms and dune soundtrack (the soundtrack only plays in the beginning) the game lacks a little of the feeling of Dune.
I'm starting to like the mushroom spice trees, they are growing on me lol.

I think there should be some kind of chopping bonus from spice plant (jungle). It doesn't make any sense that you clear up spice and get no bonus for it. Maybe a hammer or gold bonus. I mean c'mon! it's spice!

 

[Ajidica]

I'm downloading the mod now, I'll write my impressions later.
Keldath: The sound addon link isnt working. It takes me to 'My Files' as opposed to the dl link.
Heres some things I notieced in the pedia.
-Acyolite>Acolyte
-Assault Heighliner, Atreides Hornet, Death Hand, Heavy Heighliner, Heavy Hornet, Heighliner, Light Hornet, and scout need their z axis raised. They are currently floating in the ground.
-CEO's+Missionaries need new names.
-Deveator>Deviator
-Death Hand? What is it?
-Drone? Remember, all AI is banned at this time under the Great Convention.
-NAvigaotors Guild>Spacing Guild
-Perhaps use House before all applicable civs as opposed to just Fenring
-Its Atreides not Atreidis. Harkonnen not Harkonnan
-Face Dancers for Bene Gesserit?
-Whats a Hawk Strike? Also, the is no ' in carryalls.
-Its Hover, not Hoover. Hoover is the name of a Great Depression era American Prez
-Lasrocketeer>Lasgun Trooper
-Its MAULA not Mhula.
-Orni Bomber>Assault Thopter
-What the heck is a Quad?
-Sardokar>Sardaukar
-Suply>Supply
-Rename David Lynch Museum (doesn't fit) to Jongleurs (master storytellers. I don't remember what House they belong to, its in the prequels)
-Civ/leader buttons are a bit pixly, but meh.
-Still loving the religous victory slide

Game Opnions:
-I played as House Fenring on Noble/Mahdi until turn 115
-Why is the start Fenring City Ginaz?
-The early game is really slow and everything takes forever. On the calender perhaps set it to months not years. Population grows increadibly slow, I was just hitting end turn for about 80 turns.
-Tribal Village>Graban Sietch(The city Fremen and Dunemen)
-When I build my 2nd unit (harvester) I get all the popups for 'You have built your first ______'
-Whenever I build a Soldier, I get the 'error with unitnaming UNIT_LIGHT_INFANTRY'
-The improvement times are too long (20 turns for a farm?). More early things are needed.
-Spice Forest makes no sense. Perhaps rename it to Rocky Outcropping. Then we can include Dew Gatherers.
-Badlands>Desert Waste
-Somewhere please include the first ship that can enter desert. The game is really isolated and boring right now.

The mod is showing real progress. At least we now have a playable thing now.

 

[Phoenician]

-The early game is really slow and everything takes forever. On the calender perhaps set it to months not years. Population grows increadibly slow, I was just hitting end turn for about 80 turns.

Well, I'm playing a Mahdi game speed and I like the speed. Do you usually play marathon speed? Because if you don't you have to accept the fact that the game speed in the beginning will be slow. Everything is mathematically correct.
Maybe we can make another speed that is in between marathon and mahdi--although the speed difference is not that great between those 2 speeds.

Adjica makes good observations--there is a lot of little mistakes that need to be addressed.
I think there is a couple units that are cybrorgs/A.I.--yeah um there is no AI in Dune-they are banned since the Butlerian Jihad(great revolt).
Tons of spelling mistakes.
We need a good and organized soundtrack.
Pretty much everything Adjica said needs to be addressed.



I just beat down Vladammir Harkonnan, he put up a really good fight. I had a huge army and by the time I was done with him I probably lost over 2/3 of my army.
He was tough but still no match for my Atreides Hornets.

Keldath, When you release the next version please include fixed/new Fremen units, a complete soundtrack, and worms.
Do this and it will feel more like a Dune game and I will enjoy it more.

 

[keldath]

hey guys!

thanks alot for the impotent extensive report!

i figured that youll have plenty of stuff to report, thats the way it it with modding, its takes time to get it right.

next version ill make sure, that everything you posted here will be gone.
also ill make a full version with the sounds and all.

Ajidica,
by including a ship that can enter desert at start - you mean i should give a transport unit the ability to enter sand sea ? so you wont get stuck on an island until you get the proper tech right?
ill take care of it.

sont worry guys,
by the time we release, ill get this mod to be more dunish,
i have tons of ideas to bring the mod more action, like hero units, mercenaries, special buildings and more.


in your games - how much did the ai developed it self? did it declared war ? did it use the transports? aerial assaults?

i have much optimization to do - resize mos of the improvements, fix some stuff there,
change the names of great people, change names of alot of things, fix al the "txt_key_unit/building errors...and a whole bunch.

the first thing i had in mind is dirt build the structure of the mod - get all the stuff inside
and only then start optimizing it and fix errors.

im gonna get another unit catagory - of attacking ships - battleship type units.

so im not finished with the structure yet.

i realize that the mod right now is a bit anemic.


keep playing and tell me your thoughts guys, thanks for the help,

i wont have too much time in the coming days but ill do my best.

 

[johny smith]

I just want to repeat what was said before. The link to the sounds goes nowhere.

Guys do not wait on my main menu change. I am swamped with things to do. I hope I can do it when I get time.

 

[keldath]

johny smith,

ill fix the music link on the weekend.

ok, take your time brow.


****
update:

i fixed some of the stuff Ajidica wrote.

i added sietch tabat 3 uu.

i added an assauly hover - its a battaleship like unit.

next im gonna continue to fix all that was reported, ill try to optimize it more and more,
i decided to add all the e button art you guys did before making the building models.

 

[Phoenician]

Several things I want to point out:

As to your question, yes an AI declared war on me-Princess Irulan declared war on me when I declared on Vladammir Harkonnan.

Please make thopters available a little more earlier. Along with something to transport them with unless they can go without transport.

It makes sense that tanks and such cannot go over deep desert(sand sea)--because it would definenetily bring a worm's atttention. The idea that only hovers/carryall/hornets can go over sandsea is realistic.

I think Sand APC should be available more earlier--it's predesser is really slow/weak/ and doesn't carry that much units.
I think Sand APC should get 2 plus movement range. It's really slow.

Also fix the UU for fremen:
Feyadkin replaces Al-Lat (upgrades to nothing) -Feydakin should be able to go toe-to-toe with Saudakar as they do in the book.
Same as Al-Lat except:
strength is 30 and can withdraw from combat (70% chance)

Worm Rider - take away its attack bonuses, make it move 2 instead of 3, and increase strength to 8.
change its tank sound...

Desert Crawler-same as heavy roller except take away its -20% against scorpions, +25% against scorpions and 2 cargo space.
upgrades to nothing.

 

[Ajidica]

Keldath: A unit that can go on the desert would be nice so you don't just sit there.
Phonecian: What I mean by slow is that for my whole game so far, I have basicly been sitting there hitting end turn. Research is too long initialy, workers are too expensive, and population grows way too sssslllloooowwww. The moad needs something to make it more intersting in the early game.

 

[keldath]

Phoenician,
thanks for the feed.

can you write me somthign speciphic abit more?
meaning to which tech should i move the first thoper? and the sand apc?
should i make it for the early transport and sand sea to be able to move into desert right on the start? cause its like the vanilla - first transport units couldn't get into the ocean - same here - only when you learn deep desert exp - units like hornet and transports should be able to get in deep desert right?


glad your agreeing with the sand sea and land unit separation

will fix the uus also, thanks.


pheonicia, i know your not much into it...but could you give names for great people? instead of the current ones - like great scientist to be changed to i dunno - maybe scholar, mentat...i dunno...

i promise next version you'll be happier


p.s.

just saw children of dune, its way way way better then the first miniseries

also i decided to buy the entire book set of dune saga ))) gonna read'em!



Ajidica,
well - you can always play faster speeds,

buti know what you mean, i had this with vanilla game, sometimes early game might be a bit easy,

if you want - i can raise the barb's/smugglers appearance - making it harder to survive at first stages,

what suggestions do you have for early game? pehaps i should make it that you start the game with 2-3 settlers? this can be interesting right?

i can get a pop limit for an ear - say you cant build more then a speciphic num of cities for an era,
also i can get city size limit - in order to make the limit higher - you build certain buildings - like qanat - same princible like in civ 2.
(both are modcomps that i used for my overlord2).

also - how about a system - that is called vicinity bonues - say you wanna build a scorpion - and you need plaz - the plaz must be within city limits or else you cant build in that city .


humm....2-3 settlers on start can be interesting guys - it gives a bit more diversity right on start - you have much more to care for and develop right? i can adjust the upkeep acordinley so it wont be expensive to found 3 cities on start.

id be happy for more suggestions guys - i like to add stuff that gives alot of interest to the game, uniqe stuff, with special unit abilities and such.

 

[Ajidica]

Books: I actualy havent gotten past God Emperor of Dune. You really only need to read up to Children of Dune to get the arc of the Mahdi saga.
Early game: Perhaps start with a worker and a warrior. Perhaps also reduce the cost of early techs and add in some buildings.
Vincinty Bonus: I actualy don't like that idea, it sounds nice in Civ, but it doesn't feel like Dune.
Extra Settlers: That wouldnt accomplish much, as you'll still be sitting there with three cities hitting end turn. I think the main issue is low pop growth, low production, and low commerce initialy. That leads to slow teching, which leads to a lack of interesting things to do.

 

[keldath]

alright then, ill put im in 2 extra fighetrs and 1 worker.