[BTS] The History of Three Kingdoms

Hey guys, thunderfall has just created a forum for us, the location is:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/forumdisplay.php?f=346

currently it's empty, so add something to it:p

Good show!:goodjob:

Also, I've started a Custom Scenario with the second largest map using Aggressive AI and No Tech Brokering in order to spice things up. BTW, using Custom Scenario you can also turn Settlers on/off and plenty more stuff!
 
@Kalimakhus

Impressive!:)

The following things have been implemented already to solve the technology problem:

1. More base city maintenance and civic upkeep, and increased the influence of population on city maintenance
2. implemented tech diffusion
3. implemented hero maintenance, which is related to hero's level.

Combining the three is likely to help solving the 2 tech problem: big ones too fast and small ones too slow

Also, the interaction of belief system and victory condition you've mentioned is specially brilliant. It has the potential to be the foundation of our next release: Victory.:)

Minor civs and Barb cities idea are great too, they help solve the settler problem and much more. Now the problem is when should we implement it!:goodjob:
 
First off, I have to say that this mod is amazing! One of the most unique mods I've ever played. Used to play the old ROTK games, and this brings back the memories.

I have a few suggestions as well that will hopefully make the game even more fun, not sure how feasible some of these are (but seeing the unique implementations you already made, would probably be possible for you).

1. I find that legions are a bit overpowered. With even 1 hero fully leveled say in melee, each member in the legion can move 3 times and attack multiple times per turn, which totally obliterates anything in its path. Maybe you can tone down the number of units per legion or force the entire legion to move as one unit and make all the units lose a move when the legion attacks, reducing the number of attacks a single hero can cause (and the legion attacks/defend with the most appropriate unit).

2. I notice that there are quite a bit of civ leaders but few heroes right now. Rhye's mod had dynamic leaders. When certain years arrived, the leader would change. I was wondering if it would be possible for this mod as well, but slightly different. For instance, when playing as Cao Cao, you would have his hero unit in the game. You can set a faction heir, and when Cao Cao dies, your leader would change to the faction heir. Also, leader units could get unique upgrades. Of course, heroes would have to die more often now. They should have an age, and based on history and probability from an actuarial table of that time period, they may die with a certain probability each turn (maybe start it at age 60).

3. On the topic of heroes, I was wondering if you could make it so that you can assign heroes as governors (with the option of removing them as well). Each turn, they would get xp to a civil level-up system (similar to the hero system right now), also they would get a boost in xp each time something was built (maybe in proportion to hammers). Their upgrades would boost the city (ie. happy faces, increased production, etc.), but the upgrades should be attached to the hero and not the city (ie. when the hero moves away, the upgrades for the city are removed as well). This should make it so that you can make city management much harder. Right now, it seems too easy to maintain city order (overwhelming happy faces). With this, you can make it so that you have to get some respectable governors for major cities to keep the populace happy.

4. On the topic of city disorder. You can implement a similar system as revolutions where long-term unhappy cities rebel, and turn into independent minor states.

5. Back to heroes, you can separate them out into military officers (the heroes right now) and civil officers. Civil officers can't form legions (but can be governors) but can have a special diplomacy upgrade. With this upgrade when they move onto a foreign unit, they have the option of bribing the unit (and heroes as well). And if you're at war, you can let some civil officers have the option of a stealth upgrade so they move similar to spies and can still bribe enemies. Similar to recruiting, bribing costs will be a proportion to enemy hero's belief, historical faction, loyalty, honour (described next), etc. Also, since you need governors now, probably would need a lot more heroes too (should appear around the correct year with a message saying that they are now recruitable).

6. When a hero is captured, his willingness to surrender to your services should be probability based with relation to loyalty, honour, and if his historical faction is still alive. Honour is a new innate stat which can't be changed. This is based historically for a hero's dedication to service (ie. would rather die than surrender).

7. I was also wondering if you can include unique items like in the old ROTK games. Items are immobile if unattached and can be captured. They can be attached to heroes giving them unique upgrades (but can also be removed).

8. On loyalty and bribing, perhaps the loyalty system can be more dynamic. Each turn loyalty can go up/down.

For instance, positive modifiers:
- correct hero belief
- correct historical faction alignment
- salary
- managing major cities
- holding an item
- winning battles previous turn
- successful bribe attempt previous turn (should be somewhat substantial to offset idling negative modifier)
- assign as governor previous turn (major boost proportional to city size)
- being given an item previous turn (major boost)

Negative modifiers:
- different hero belief
- different historical faction alignment
- idling around (no legion, no battle, no city to manage)
- managing minor cities (ie. population 1-2)
- losing battles previous turn
- unsuccessful bribe attempt previous turn
- remove as governor previous turn (major decline proportional to city size)
- removing an item previous turn (major decline)

Also, instead of hero upkeep, you can give them all a salary you set. So the higher the pay, the more loyalty goes up per turn.

9. Also, it would be interesting to implement a dueling system (defeat or refusal to duel decreases morale in legion, resulting in temporary negative upgrade, and victory increases morale). But I'm unsure how this would best be done in civ as it will most likely have to be completely probability based.


Hopefully some of these suggestion are helpful.

Cheers,
CaptainCan
 
SWEET!!! Especially after you made the hero units, (which Bakuel made wonderfully), this mod is just getting better! I haven't played it yet, but now my mouth is watering for this! I have played RTK XI, and it's awesome. I've played Civilization IV, and its awesome. And what do you get when you combine those two, by a pro modder? DOUBLE THE AWESOMENESS!!! Keep up the good job. Oh, and if you need help with modding, I'd love to help. I'm kind of useless though, I can only really do XML work... (which isn't really going to be needed this late in your work).
 
I've been dabbling in modding a little bit and I really didn't like the default civ music so I took those out and put in around 14 Chinese style music in it. So consider this as an unofficial music pack.

The dl is at http://files.filefront.com/13333043

Thanks a lot for this pack. One little issue, you reference an Autumn soundtrack but there is no Autumn.mp3 file within the pack. You also add references in EraInfos.xml to several sound scripts but you don't define them in Audio2DScript.xml or in AudioDefines.xml.
 
For some reason, whenever I try to play this, it CTDs after i click on someone to play as... First I clicked on Civ IV, or clicked the tHoTK icon, and then after it loaded in, I clicked "Play Scenario", then I clicked on a bunch of different people to play as. But each time I do that, the game loads in 2/5, then it CTDs... Can someone please help me :(
 
Thanks a lot for this pack. One little issue, you reference an Autumn soundtrack but there is no Autumn.mp3 file within the pack. You also add references in EraInfos.xml to several sound scripts but you don't define them in Audio2DScript.xml or in AudioDefines.xml.

Oh wow Thanks! I'm kinda embarass now that I missed something like this. I could have sworn I had Autumn in there, but you're right. I'll correct that ASAP and release the new version soon.
 
For some reason, whenever I try to play this, it CTDs after i click on someone to play as... First I clicked on Civ IV, or clicked the tHoTK icon, and then after it loaded in, I clicked "Play Scenario", then I clicked on a bunch of different people to play as. But each time I do that, the game loads in 2/5, then it CTDs... Can someone please help me :(

I think the most probable reason is the issue of incompatible. BtS 3.17 is required to play this Mod.
 
I have to say, I am impressed with the presentation and all the content added--truely outside my abilities as a modder...

So, I started up my first game, picked Cao Cao because he had 3 traits and was at the top of the list...and promptly got lost. Has there been a brief (as in, a page-long) overview written that tells me everything I need to know to play this? It could probably be included in the Sevopedia like "BTS Concepts"--have your own "Three Kingdoms Concepts" to help players get their feet wet.
 
Patch A for Release 2.01 has just come out. It will break save game. It does not support original Release 2. Sorry guys who is still playing original release 2 but since with this patch you need to start a new game, it probably is the best opportunity to redownload Release 2.01.

Fixes:

1. revise a bug that Yuan Shao's UU replace wrong Unit
2. revise some spelling errors and change commanderies goverment into commandery
3. revise the kfm bug in swift archer and xianbei horseman
4. fixed sea lord promotion
5. fixed a Bug when a hero attached to ships in city and the city lost, the hero will disappear but still belongs to old civ
6. fixed a Bug that when a civ's last is lost but there's still heroes attached to units elsewhere, the civ will remain alive
7. fixed a Bug that champion attaching to legion member will grant experience to legion hero

Additions:

1. added main menu backgound image(by koap)
2. added loading screen(by koap)
3. changed advocates' color(by koap)
4. added Taishi Ci's unit model(by Bakuel)
5. added tech diffusion
6. added hero maintenance (as extra unit cost, 2 * level -1)

Adjustments:

1. reduced great wall and dujiang irrigation system's great people points
2. lower the bonus of elite melee and elite cavalry promotions
3. increased city maintenance and civic upkeep
 
@ CaptainCan

I thank you for your sound advice. They are truly thought provoking. Please go to our forum: http://forums.civfanatics.com/forumdisplay.php?f=346, where you can find a project road map. In that post we outlined what this mod could be in the future and how we intend to get there. In general, we will not divert too much attention to ideas not related to current release and the next release. Many of your ideas are great, but they are not our current priority. Now to your suggestions.

1. I find that legions are a bit overpowered.

They are. We are going to make them acceptable again, by balancing promotions and improving AI, but probably won't make a legion into one unit. That way might be great, but it's also too costly.

2. I notice that there are quite a bit of civ leaders but few heroes right now. Rhye's mod had dynamic leaders. When certain years arrived, the leader would change. I was wondering if it would be possible for this mod as well, but slightly different. For instance, when playing as Cao Cao, you would have his hero unit in the game. You can set a faction heir, and when Cao Cao dies, your leader would change to the faction heir. Also, leader units could get unique upgrades. Of course, heroes would have to die more often now. They should have an age, and based on history and probability from an actuarial table of that time period, they may die with a certain probability each turn (maybe start it at age 60).

Since you and other players have repeatedly suggested the change leader idea, we should seriously consider it. If we do it, we will give control to the player, while remain loyal to history. Selecting heir is a great way to give player the control, but it also bears the danger of betraying history.

The natural death of heroes is also a good idea we can implement.

3. On the topic of heroes, I was wondering if you could make it so that you can assign heroes as governors (with the option of removing them as well). Each turn, they would get xp to a civil level-up system (similar to the hero system right now), also they would get a boost in xp each time something was built (maybe in proportion to hammers). Their upgrades would boost the city (ie. happy faces, increased production, etc.), but the upgrades should be attached to the hero and not the city (ie. when the hero moves away, the upgrades for the city are removed as well). This should make it so that you can make city management much harder. Right now, it seems too easy to maintain city order (overwhelming happy faces). With this, you can make it so that you have to get some respectable governors for major cities to keep the populace happy.

This idea is in the domain of Bureaucracy, which is in our future plan. Right now the heroes are all combat heroes. When the time comes for Bureaucracy, we can consider this again.

4. On the topic of city disorder. You can implement a similar system as revolutions where long-term unhappy cities rebel, and turn into independent minor states.

This idea is in the domain of Our People.

5. Back to heroes, you can separate them out into military officers (the heroes right now) and civil officers. Civil officers can't form legions (but can be governors) but can have a special diplomacy upgrade. With this upgrade when they move onto a foreign unit, they have the option of bribing the unit (and heroes as well). And if you're at war, you can let some civil officers have the option of a stealth upgrade so they move similar to spies and can still bribe enemies. Similar to recruiting, bribing costs will be a proportion to enemy hero's belief, historical faction, loyalty, honour (described next), etc. Also, since you need governors now, probably would need a lot more heroes too (should appear around the correct year with a message saying that they are now recruitable).

I believe this idea is in the domain of Strategy.

6. When a hero is captured, his willingness to surrender to your services should be probability based with relation to loyalty, honour, and if his historical faction is still alive. Honour is a new innate stat which can't be changed. This is based historically for a hero's dedication to service (ie. would rather die than surrender).

Although this idea is in the domain of Allegiance, we could implement a small part of it in the current release, making the hero's chance of surrender vary based on his loyalty to current owner and historical relationship to the capturing player.

7. I was also wondering if you can include unique items like in the old ROTK games. Items are immobile if unattached and can be captured. They can be attached to heroes giving them unique upgrades (but can also be removed).

Yes, we could do that. Many people want them. But we will not do it right now. It can wait until Legions are finished up.

8. On loyalty and bribing, perhaps the loyalty system can be more dynamic. Each turn loyalty can go up/down.

For instance, positive modifiers:
- correct hero belief
- correct historical faction alignment
- salary
- managing major cities
- holding an item
- winning battles previous turn
- successful bribe attempt previous turn (should be somewhat substantial to offset idling negative modifier)
- assign as governor previous turn (major boost proportional to city size)
- being given an item previous turn (major boost)

Negative modifiers:
- different hero belief
- different historical faction alignment
- idling around (no legion, no battle, no city to manage)
- managing minor cities (ie. population 1-2)
- losing battles previous turn
- unsuccessful bribe attempt previous turn
- remove as governor previous turn (major decline proportional to city size)
- removing an item previous turn (major decline)

Also, instead of hero upkeep, you can give them all a salary you set. So the higher the pay, the more loyalty goes up per turn.

I love this idea. It's the basic idea of Allegiance. CivIV has one great feature that is the personality of leaders. If we could achieve similar effect to heroes, it would be great.

9. Also, it would be interesting to implement a dueling system (defeat or refusal to duel decreases morale in legion, resulting in temporary negative upgrade, and victory increases morale). But I'm unsure how this would best be done in civ as it will most likely have to be completely probability based.

I'm afraid this is the hardest idea to implement, the harder part is not refuse to duel, but actually accept. This thing is totally animation, which we have little control.
 
I am seriously thinking of giving this mod a go (I only say that because I'm a modder myself and it takes up a lot of my civ time, not because I have my doubts about it). But I was wondering if you put any thought into using some Chinese-flavored units (which are out there) or some of Huayna Capac's great LHs?

I think this would give it a more distinct look. Although the LH images you have are pretty sweet.

Sorry for the late reply The Capo, but I want to give you more time to play the mod first.:D (I wonder if you actually made good use of the time:mischief:)

About Chinese flavored units, I think there are quite a lot in the game already. We used to turn the whole forum upside down just looking for them. Any apparent ones that we should use?

About Huayna Capac's LHs, they are great, and one day we may change all the current people images in the mod, but for now I don't think that's possible. If we change the image, we have to change it all.

SWEET!!! Especially after you made the hero units, (which Bakuel made wonderfully), this mod is just getting better! I haven't played it yet, but now my mouth is watering for this! I have played RTK XI, and it's awesome. I've played Civilization IV, and its awesome. And what do you get when you combine those two, by a pro modder? DOUBLE THE AWESOMENESS!!! Keep up the good job. Oh, and if you need help with modding, I'd love to help. I'm kind of useless though, I can only really do XML work... (which isn't really going to be needed this late in your work).

:lol: Love your word guy! Give us some feedback about the game is really great help.

I have to say, I am impressed with the presentation and all the content added--truely outside my abilities as a modder...

So, I started up my first game, picked Cao Cao because he had 3 traits and was at the top of the list...and promptly got lost. Has there been a brief (as in, a page-long) overview written that tells me everything I need to know to play this? It could probably be included in the Sevopedia like "BTS Concepts"--have your own "Three Kingdoms Concepts" to help players get their feet wet.

Yes, everything is new, you've got to learn a lot. We could do a HoTK concept screen, but what to include? I pretty much said everything about this mod in the first post. Anyhow, we will try to write a tutorial, focusing on the basic things a first time player can do.:)
 
I have played RTK XI, and it's awesome. I've played Civilization IV, and its awesome. And what do you get when you combine those two, by a pro modder? DOUBLE THE AWESOMENESS!!!

I could not agree more, because I have played both of them as well
 
Okay I'm releasing the new music pack for 2.01 with patch A
So here's the link

http://www.sendspace.com/file/qivaaj

It contains alot of XML fixes from the previous version. In the previous version I added the test XML instead of the finished XML so only 3 of the 13 songs were playing :blush: So sorry about that, but it's all fixed now.

I've also edited the diplomatic music so now there'll be custom music when you zoom in to your cities and when you engage in diplomacy. There's also different music depending on you're at war or at peace with your rivals.

It's not 100% yet because I haven't add music for the Yellow Turbans but they're not in the main scenarios so they can wait :D

Please feel free to let me know about any bugs or problems because I know I must be missing something :lol: Praises are also welcome :king:

Hope everyone enjoy this :crazyeye:


@stmartin Did you know Zhang Xiu is a Nanman? :lol: When I edited the music in CIV4leaderheadsinfo.xml for the Nan_Man leader, Zhang Xiu ended up with the music. Also Liu Yao is named Liu You there.
 
I have to say, I am impressed with the presentation and all the content added--truely outside my abilities as a modder...

So, I started up my first game, picked Cao Cao because he had 3 traits and was at the top of the list...and promptly got lost.

Sometimes this kind of thing happens in civ games....Sorry I don't know how to deal with that. Maybe you could try some other scenarios instead?:goodjob:
 
Sometimes this kind of thing happens in civ games....Sorry I don't know how to deal with that. Maybe you could try some other scenarios instead?:goodjob:

I guess I'll just pick somebody who starts at peace on the fringe and use that as a sandbox.

Your mod holds as advertised, though--it's like a completely new game, learning curve and all. :)
 
stmartin or anyone on the HotTK mod team; about that bug that I came across. I actually haven't went back and looked for when/where it went wrong, but thinking about it, I might have figured out what went wrong.

When one of Gao Shun's legions (non core) died, it did not check the legion unit and refresh how many units were attached to it. I think if I manually go back in and reset it, it won't crash. So basically its missing that check to refresh a legion after combat.

If you already have implemented something for that, then I dont think its working correctly 100% of the time.

I'll check it out and report it further in the project development area.
 
I think the most probable reason is the issue of incompatible. BtS 3.17 is required to play this Mod.

No, but my version is Civ Complete. So it should work shouldn't it? Cuz 3.17 is installed in it right? :(


Edit:


No, but my version is Civ Complete. So it should work shouldn't it? Cuz 3.17 is installed in it right? :(
NEVERMIND! I found out that there was a specific patch for Civ Complete! This game is awesome! Thanks a lot for ur help. :p
 
Best civs to start with are Liu Zhang (Shu=turtle heaven), Liu Biao (having a vassal helps too), and Sun Ce (overwhelming force against one weak opponent with a strait dividing you from other opponents).
 
Okay I'm releasing the new music pack for 2.01 with patch A
So here's the link

http://www.sendspace.com/file/qivaaj

It contains alot of XML fixes from the previous version. In the previous version I added the test XML instead of the finished XML so only 3 of the 13 songs were playing :blush: So sorry about that, but it's all fixed now.

I've also edited the diplomatic music so now there'll be custom music when you zoom in to your cities and when you engage in diplomacy. There's also different music depending on you're at war or at peace with your rivals.

It's not 100% yet because I haven't add music for the Yellow Turbans but they're not in the main scenarios so they can wait :D

Please feel free to let me know about any bugs or problems because I know I must be missing something :lol: Praises are also welcome :king:

Hope everyone enjoy this :crazyeye:


@stmartin Did you know Zhang Xiu is a Nanman? :lol: When I edited the music in CIV4leaderheadsinfo.xml for the Nan_Man leader, Zhang Xiu ended up with the music. Also Liu Yao is named Liu You there.

Thanks.:)

I know, Zhang Xiu is a Nanman, and Liu Yao is named Liu You. When we first started, we didn't think someday you would make music for it.:) So we didn't pay too much attention on the internal names of all the civs and units and such.
 
Back
Top Bottom