Bz2 - 5CC Overdrive

[Earp]

I’ve got it and will play when I get home from work. I agree with your suggestions, betazed.

(a) Veto that military academy in our capital. We have only five cities so we can have only one army which we already have. So we cannot build any more armies. Also we cannot use that military academy for any prebuild now either.

I agree.

(b) Create a colony on the wines. That will add another lux immediately.

I agree, but this colony will not last very long. The AI likes to settle next to our colonies. I am not sure if we have enough spare troops to position some around it.

(c) we do not have MA against Zulu, so this might be a good point to stop that war, recuperate and hit Baby. He is at peace with everybody and in Democracy. We can get Iros and Abu in a MA against him and they can put a lot of hurt on him. Raze a few cities of his and he will pop out of Democracy and go into Monarchy. However, our military is weak compared to him. So we definitely need that Military alliance.

I agree, but Hiawatha and Abu both have ROPs with Babylon. Will they break these treaties to sign a MA with us? If we sign a ROP with Hiawatha, he will be better able to attack Babylon, but I think he may charge too much for the ROP because he has so much more territory than us. I think we should fight Babylon for the full twenty turns and then turn our attention to the purple giant to our north.

(c) The leader should most probably be saved for ToE.

I agree. We have our one army and ToE is more useful than Universal Suffrage. Should we start researching ourselves? I think we can get Medicine in about ten turns. I think we should avoid the Nationalism branch of the research tree. I would suggest Medicine --> Sci Meth(ToE) --> Atomic Theory --> Electronics(Hoover) --> Sanitation(Hospitals) --> Industrialization(Factories) Should research Industrialization earlier? Do we need Nationalism?

(d) Also we can get spices for 200 G from the Iroqious. We should get it. That would give us one more lux.

I agree. Shouldn’t we buy it as a gpt? I’ll buy it before building the colony on the wines. I think the price will increase if I connect the wines first.

(e) Lastly, WW is at 35%. We will shortly have riots. If we make peace with Zulu and do the lux dela and connection we will immediately get WLTKD. So, that is another incentive to make peace with the Zulu.

I agree. Any ideas on how can I get Hammi to declare war on us?

(f) For all practical purposes Zulu is out of the game so we need not hit him anymore.

I agree.

 

[Tsukemono5]

If you're going to head for TOE, then pick up Nationalism and INdustrialization first. Nationalism = rifles = good. Industrialization = factories = more good . If we want to get Hoover's in any reasonable amount of time, we will require factories.

EDIT: Although it would be funny to gain the benefits out of free hydro plants before we even have factories to benefit from .

 

[betazed]

Originally posted by Earp
Should research Industrialization earlier? Do we need Nationalism?

I think we can research Indutrialization. No point researching Medicine since the civs are already doing it and will definitely get it before us. Howver, I would save our cash to research SM. That means, trade Industrialization, Medicine and Electricity. It will cost us a lot of gold (even with a 2-fer) but I do not see a way around it.

Originally posted by Earp
Any ideas on how can I get Hammi to declare war on us?

What I usually do is try to extort something like his core cities from him. Of course he denies and gets very furious with you. Then try to steal his tech cheaply. He has nationalism and which we do not have. If you are successful good. You have a cheap tech. If you fail, he is almost guaranteed to declare war.

This method costs a little money but you can get him to declare war on you. Depending on how much money you spend it can work out to your advantage.

 

[Earp]

0 - 1020 AD
Fortify leader in Istanbul.
Buy spices from Hiawatha for WM and 11 GPT.
Found colony on the wines.
Change Istanbul to worker. MM to get to +7 FPT
Change Bursa to worker. MM to get +7 FPT
The Zulus give us three workers, WM and 17 G for a peace treaty.
We buy two workers from Arabia for WM and 165 G.

IBT The Iroquois found a city on top of one of our Saltpeter sources.

1 - 1030 AD
Istanbul Worker --> Sipahi
Edrine Musket --> Worker
Bursa Worker --> Sipahi
Iznik Sipahi --> Worker
The people put a dome on our palace.
We sign a ROP with the Iroquois. We need a ROP to be able to use our rails and get our troops home from the front. A ROP will allow Iroquois troops to travel quickly across our empire in order to fight Babylon(in a few turns).
I surround our wines with troops.
I do not think this is exploitive because I am using troops for the blockade.

No new techs.

2 - 1040 AD
Edrine Worker --> Sipahi
Uskudar Sipahi --> Worker
Iznik Worker --> Sipahi
The Iroquois have Economics. With our 5CC, the value of Smith's is low and I do not even ask how much he wants for it.

IBT The Babs move a knight and settler next to our wine blockade. They found a new city on our border.

3 - 1050 AD
Uskudar Worker --> Sipahi
Babylon now has economics. He is furious with us. I try to steal a tech. Immediately costs 1106 G, Carefully 1659 G, Safely 2212 G. We go for the cheap option. We now have nationalism.
We upgrade ten muskets to riflemen for 400 gold.
We upgrade our three elite knights to Sipahi. With a leader sitting in Istanbul, we have more use for reg Sipahi than elite Knights. The knights will have trouble against the riflemen anyways.
We can try to steal Economics, but it would be cheaper just to buy it. Running with the slider at 30% would cost us about 1240 G (62x20). I think it will be cheaper for us to declare war on Babylon than to try to steal another tech.
We declare war on Hammurabi
We sell Nationalism to Hiawatha for 24 GPT and an alliance against Babylon. The Iroquois are now Gracious towards us.
Arabia agrees to an alliance in exchange for Steam Power. Arabia lacks iron, but they don't have anything to trade us for it.
We raze Adab.
We raze Nina
We raze Telloh

4 - 1060 AD
Istanbul Sipahi --> Sipahi
Bursa Sipahi --> Sipahi
Move troops

IBT The Zulu and America sign an alliance against Arabia. Arabia is actually in pretty bad shape. It is difficult when you have no iron.

5 - 1070 AD
Edrine Sipahi --> Sipahi
Iznik Sipahi --> Sipahi

6 - 1080 AD
Uskudar Sipahi --> Sipahi
We lose our army of Sipahi.
Found an ivory colony

IBT Our alliance with the Iroquois vs. the Americans ends. We renegotiate the gem deal and give Hiawatha 13GPT.

7 - 1090 AD
Istanbul Sipahi --> Rifleman
Bursa Sipahi --> Sipahi

8 - 1100 AD
Edrine Sipahi --> Rifleman
Iznik Sipahi --> Rifleman
We no longer have alliances against America. Abe wants 180 gold for peace.

9 - 1110 AD
Istanbul Rifleman --> Sipahi
Uskudar Sipahi --> Rifleman
Finish railroads in every city tile.
We no longer have alliances against Persia. Xerxes wants 140 gold for peace. We agree to his terms.
I sign an alliance with Xerxes against America. We give him Incense and 17 GPT.
Babylon is still in Democracy. I have been disconnecting his resources, but have not razed enough cities. Babylon does not have any luxuries or resources connected to his capital, and our military is average compared to theirs.

10 - 1120 AD
Edrine Rifleman --> Sipahi
Bursa Sipahi --> Sipahi
Iznik Rifleman --> Sipahi

This turn is not over. We only have 9 Sipahi.

The SAVE

 

[betazed]

Ouch! Losing that army must have hurt. But hey we got Nationalism for cheap.

I have got it. Will play early today and post.

 

[betazed]

I finished my turns. Instead of a turn report (all I did was wage war - my core competency) here are the higlights

(a) I started with 9 Sipahi's. We now have 16.

(b) Our GA has ended. Of course.

(c) We are now strong compared to Hammi.

(d) Every civ is at war.

(e) Hammi has Industrialization and Communism and Economics. Noone else has anything apart from Economics. We can buy Economics for nothing from Abu for Nationalism but it is not worth it.

(f) Hammi is now in Monarchy so tech pace has ground to a crawl. Good for us.

(g) We have managed to raze 8 cities of Hammi including his capital (which contained the Pyramids). The next turn should raze another city of his. Forces are already in place for that. Hammi has now been cut into 4 disjoint parts. It must be hurting him a lot. He has lost furs too. I feel sorry for him (just kidding!).

I played 13 turns. I needed the three extra turns to raze Hammi's capital. Hope you guys don't mind.

In two or three turns our MA against Hammi ends. He should be willing to give us Industrialization for dirt cheap by then. We should take it, build factories, and recuperate our forces. Once again we need not hit him anymore at least now. His prospects in this game look pretty bleak.


Here is the save.

 

[betazed]

Some pictures.

first, Hammi's Empire (or what's left of it).

Next International Relations.
"What a Tangled Web We Weave . . ."

 

[Earp]

Goof job betazed.

I think we should prepare to hit the Iroquois after we recuperate and build factories.

 

[betazed]

Originally posted by Earp
Goof job betazed

You really don't mean that, do you?

EDIT: Snaproll you are up.

 

[Snaproll]

Ok I see it, but I probably can't play until tomorrow. Looks like you guys have been doing well - sorry I've been quiet lately.

 

[Earp]

Originally posted by betazed


You really don't mean that, do you?

It was a typo.

You'll notice that the f is next to the d on the keyboard.

 

[Snaproll]

Turn 0 – 1250 A.D. – Looks like all our workers are automated again. I know all our useful tiles are improved, but this ties up the workers doing useless tasks when it is conceivable they will be needed for something. It looks like our military alliance against the Babs is already able to be canceled. They won’t give us all their techs, though, so I don’t call for peace. Abu Bakr will give us Econ for Horses and Iron. If he doesn’t last 20 turns does that mean we broke a treaty? I don’t think it does. Iron and horses to Abu Bakr. Maybe that will help him survive a bit. Actually, he’ll give us economics plus 400 gold. We are now at tech parity with everyone but the Babs. We should really use our 4800 gold for something. Did anyone realize we are running 20% luxes, but have nothing but happy citizens?? Unbelievable, really. I guess it was for WLTK day? Is that worth it for 60 gpt?

BT – The Iros cancel our military alliance, and we lose 24 gpt. Arabia cancels it too. Sippar razed.

Turn 1 – 1255 A.D. - I notice we have a leader in Istanbul – I guess we are saving him for ToE? I wake up all our workers and get them building rails to the Babylonian front. Our war weariness is at 52% - It might be prudent for us to rush Sufferage. We really need some more defenders in our cities too, methinks.

Turn 2 – 1260 A.D. – Rail connection finished to Babylonian front. I’m going after Nippur, the size 12 Babylonian capitol. It will really hurt him to lose that. The rest of cities are all in tundra, so this should really do him in. Eventually, though, we are going to have to start wiping out people for good, since these lands will be quickly filled in.

BT – Babylon and Iroquois sign peace.

Turn 3 – 1265 - Nippur razed. Babylon is really screwed now, that’s for sure. I call for peace, as they are banished to pretty poor lands. I get Industrialization, 254 gold, and 125 gold per turn!!! That will certainly cripple them! All the other civs have industrialization except the Zulu. Even though we are still at war with the Americans, our war weariness disappears completely, giving us WLTK in all cities. I switch all 5 cities to Factory production. Not sure what to do with the Sipahi – Maybe I’ll go after the Americans? I sign a RoP with the Zulu and start building rails towards the Americans.

BT – Renew gems deal with Iros.

Turn 4 – 1270 A.D. Just building rails towards the Americans and waiting for factories to finish. Once the Factory in Istanbul finishes I’ll rush Sufferage.

Turn 5 – I go ahead and spend some cash to rush the factories.

BT – The Iros make a small demand. Whatever, I don’t agree. Iros declare war. They capture some of our workers that were building rails – sorry about that. We didn’t need them anyway, and well get them back from the Iros.

Turn 6 – 1275 - I mostly mop up as many Iro units as I can find – I kill at least 15 roaming units. Rush Universal Sufferage. I do raze Owego, giving us our Saltpeter source back again and opening up the rail route to the south where our troops that were surrounding the wines were under attack. I cancel the alliance with Persia against America and call for peace. I also raze Kente, the city just east of Bursa with a couple dye sources. I hook up those dyes with a colony. I pull back the riflemen around the wines – we are going to need them. Sorry.

Turn 7 – 1280 – Complete Universal Sufferage. Still mostly cleaning up Iro units that are roaming around – there are a lot of them.

Turn 8 – 1285 - Kawaoka razed, cutting the Iros off of a source of coal.

BT – Zulu and Iros sign a trade embargo. Jeez – I had a RoP with the Zulu! Lose two Sipahi to cavalry counterattack. Babylon and America sign an alliance against the Persians.

Turn 9 - 1290 - Gewauga razed. More Iro units killed, but I haven’t been able to mount a good attack on the core yet. Need to watch WW. I get a great leader attacking a MI in a jungle! I move some rifles out to protect him. Our forces are a bit scattered from picking off available units.

Turn 10 – 1295. Forces are in place to attack the closest Iroquios city. We are doing well. There has been no tech movement at all during my turns. The Babylonians still have a monopoly on Communism. The world wars have calmed down a bit, but not all that much. Good luck!

The Save

 

[Snaproll]

 

[betazed]

Snaproll,

That was a good (and lucky) call to rush US. We also got another leader. IMHO, We should save him for Toe.

Our plan was always to take down the Iro's after the Babs. Now that he has declared war on us so much better.

@tsuke: Can you play or should Earp take it?

 

[Tsukemono5]

See? This is what I was talking about with Suffrage. Use the leader, rush it, take care of WW, get another leader. I don't have any real time until Thursday (esp. because I'm almost up in AM3, a Deity game), so I think Earp should take it and pass it to me at the end of the week.

 

[Earp]

I am up in another SG and probably won't be able to play this one tonight, but I can play tomorrow evening.

We have a very large cash reserve and the tech pace has slowed down considerably. I think we should try to keep the world wars going and begin to research ourselves. With ToE and some luck, we may be able to slingshot out into a insurmountable tech lead.

 

[Tsukemono5]

And we'll have some small chance at a spaceship victory if all else fails .

 

[betazed]

ok. Earp you can take it tonight/tommorrow night and play. Tsuke can play after that.

So earp is next. {It's nice to be the organizer }

We will need part of that large reserver of cash to upgrade our muskets to Infantries. Also, we can rush stuff using that cash. Are all our factories built, already?

 

[Tsukemono5]

You mean rifles, right? I don't think we have Replaceable Parts yet.

 

[Snaproll]

In answer to your question betazed, yes, all of our factories are complete.

All of our muskets are upgraded to rifles right now, although we could always use a few more. It's true that we do not have Replaceable Parts yet. The tech pace is really slow - the Babylonians are up Communism, but they won't be researching anything else for a long time, now that they are paying us like 125 gpt and have their new capitol isolated from all their new cities. All the wars have really slowed tech pace to a crawl.