C2C - Transhuman Era

Sarah Starlight · Jul 6, 2012

He said the tech tree should be LS612 friendly, and Vokarya will love Advanced Computers got renamed.

I have all the Pedia if needed..

Azurian · Jul 11, 2012

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Azurian · Jul 11, 2012

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Azurian · Jul 11, 2012

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Azurian · Jul 11, 2012

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Azurian · Jul 11, 2012

delted

ls612 · Jul 12, 2012

@MrAzure:

Ok, here's my detailing of what I think needs doing on the early TH era.

Gesture Recognition and Cognitive Robotics merged into Machine Learning
Biofuels merged into Biomaterials
Cloning renamed to Animal Cloning (aka Dolly the sheep)
Synthetic Biochemistry, Targetted Drug Delivery, and Neurotechnology merged into Advanced Molecular Biology.
Delete Mechatronics (seems slightly redundant)
Software Sports, Digital Economics, and E-learning merged into Online Communities
Delete Speech Recognition (goes into Machine Learning)
Delete Smart Vehicles (also goes into Machine Learning)
Rename Imaginary Physics to String Theory
Digital Culture goes into Online communities.
Biotech Ag renamed to Synthetic Crop Design
Integrated Network Command, Uplink Tactics, and Active Denial System merged into Digital Warfare
Delet Mobile Workforce (better as a civic)
Delete Underground Warfare (not useful gameplay-wise for a very long while)
Merge Organic Photonics and Ocean Energy Generation into Photosynthetic Power generation.
Delete Autoaim Armament (better as a promotion)
Merge Particle Astrophysics into String theory
Delete the 'Old' Online Community (Now it comes earlier and is an amalgam of other techs)
Merge Tissue Engineering and Bacteriopahge Therapy into Molecular Medicine
Delete Photorealism
Merge Amino Metallurgy into Molecular Medicine
Merge Hormone Design into Molecular Medicine
Delete Intelligent Munitions (better as a promotion)
Rename Civilian Droids to Civilian Robots
Delete Automated Traffic (better as a building)
Merge Disaster Robots into Civilian Robots
Delete Genesis Biology.
Merge Social Calculus and Direct Merchandising to Advanced Sociological Theories
Merge Chronic Immunization into Molecular Medicine
Delete DNA Barcode (better as buildings)
Rename Synthetic Womb (disscused in another thread)
Merge Origin Sociology into Advanced Sociological Theories
Delete Automated Workforce (better as a civic)
Merge Machine Binaurals, Intuitive Internet, and TAEM simulation into Turing Artifical Intelligence
Merge Personalized Health, Biodiversity Geonomics, and Biofeedback Design into Genomic Healthcare
Merge Digitized Fabrics and Miniturized Electronics into Ubiquitous Computing
Merge Evolutionary Alrorithms into Turing AI
Delete weaponized Acoustics (better as units or promotions)
Rename Fusion to Fusion Power
Merge Machine Vision into Turing AI
Delete Liquid Metals
Merge Metabolism Design into Genomic Healthcare
Merge Codebank Tactics, Bugbots, and Nanosat networks into Advanced Digital Warfare
Delete Blue electromagnetic Pulse (better as a unit)
Merge Genetic Warfare and Designer Children into Genetic Manipulation
Delete Binary Legislation (better as a civic)
Merge Crystalline Alloys, Diamondiod Memory, and Nanogenerators into Cystalline Metallurgy
Delete Cyberanthropology and Binary Neurochemistry.
Delete Emotion Transistors
Delete Jovian Exploration (already have an outer-system exploration tech)
Delete Aerial Dreadnaughts (we don't want those until the Galactic Era).
Delete Animal Exoskeletons (already have a species uplifting tech)
Delete Dream Forensics (what??)
Merge meiosis multiplication, Rapid recuperation, Binary Psychoactives, and Bionics into Gene Enhancement
Delete Novus Chemistry and Subsentient Computers
Delete Biomimetics

Whew, that's alot. :whew:

I think that the remaining techs should be kept in the same area on the tech tree, thus leaving openings in the tree, which is good. This way, the TH era will be more down to size and also more generic. Could you do this soon please? Also, you do know that you can attach the GameText file to the post, as opposed to posting it, right?

Azurian · Jul 12, 2012

ls612 said:
@MrAzure:

Ok, here's my detailing of what I think needs doing on the early TH era.

Whew, that's alot. I think that the remaining techs should be kept in the same area on the tech tree, thus leaving openings in the tree, which is good. This way, the TH era will be more down to size and also more generic. Could you do this soon please? Also, you do know that you can attach the GameText file to the post, as opposed to posting it, right?

I agree with all this tech changes, but stronly think we should keep the following Techs:

- Cyberanthropology
-Diamoindoid Memory
-Social Calculus

cyberanthropology
http://www2.fiu.edu/~mizrachs/CyberAnthropology.html
I think this should be kept.
It should lead to Social Calculus, and require Machine Learning and Cognitive Robotics.
-Early Digital Era "Social man and machine Tech"

Social Calculus
Im thinking this can be the Advanced Sociological Theories, since i predict this will be the foundation for all those theories.
-Late Digital Era ""Social man and machine Tech"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethical_calculus

Diamondoid Memory

For most of the fist half of 21st Century, flash memory and silicon transistors and its evolutionary variations have dominated the computer, robotic, and electronic industries. Then graphene based transistors had a quick but powerful grasp on these industries, until multispectrum lasers allowed the commercialization of diamondoid based electronics a possibilty. With the fast minituralization of electronics, graphene alloys introduced Terahertz grade electronics with great heat management, but as transistors entered the 2098-bit Era, heat management of superminiturized transistors started to become a real problem. Diamondoid alloys have great heat resistance, are three dimensional, transparent in solid form, can be up to 0.23 inches thick, superconductive to electricity, and can store more binary data then graphene flash memory. A cubic inch of of Diamondoid can store up to 32.57 Petabytes of binary information, (Generation I),is waterproof, fireproof, virtually undestructable in everyday use, and has a theoretical lifetime of over 22 million years.

We have Flash memory, i think we should keep Diamondoid memory, it can represent the next big computer generation, storage capacity, and can be a prereq for warmachines. Diamondoid memory is " waterproof, fireproof, virtually undestructable in everyday use", and im more than happy to call it Diamondoid Metallurgy.
[hard drives-->flash memory-->graphene memory [at graphene alloys]-->diamondoid memory]

Great job on these changes! Really general but i can agree with almost everything, [we can rename things later]. I can get this dont today probably.

EDIT: please see this also
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=11658348&postcount=9

ls612 · Jul 12, 2012

@MrAzure:

OK, how about this.

1. Cyber Anthropology can stay then, that's fine.

2. That then works much better as a civic, probably in Society or Power. Does that sound good?

3. I think personally that Diamondoid memory sounds fantastical, although I understand now what it is (memory for optical computers). How about Optical Memory then (not to be confused with optical memory as in CD/DVDs)?

Azurian · Jul 12, 2012

*double post

Azurian · Jul 12, 2012

Spoiler :

Hydromancerx · Jul 12, 2012

@MrAzure

1. Can you use the spoiler on your big blocks of code text please?

2. Please post the tech from column X79 in Vokarya-style so we can review them all? Thanks!

Azurian · Jul 12, 2012

Spoiler :

i Show it to my team and this is what they said, and asked them to rate it:

Sarah said:
4/10
I think the tech tree is really board and general and puts the tech into "categories" than technologies. For example why are Nanogenrators merged with Crystalline metallurgy?
Why are 6 things combined into Turning AI? What does Nanosatellites have to do with Turning AI? I Questioned what he said that "blue electromagnetic pulse" is better as a unit, what what tech would you research that unit at? I thought Biotech agriculture was more than synthetic crops, its about genetically modified organisms, GMOS. How can there be robots with no sentience? I prefer Civilian Droids, human level AI should be near the end. There are allot of issues with this tech tree and I think maybe some of the mergers are well intended but most are not needed.

ZaneAntigrav said:
5/10 I think its a good idea to trim down the Tech tree, but its very bland and amateurish. Ubiquitous Computing should not be a tech; if it is why not add ubiquitous paper and ubiquitous horseriding. I also hate the use of the word Advanced, advanced compared to what? Turning AI should be near the end, I am find with the Molecular Medicine merger but not for Genomic Medicine or Gene Enhancement merger. Why delete neurotechnology but keep human machine interface.? Some of the generazations are too macro, you might as well merger the whole prehistoric era to Prehistoric Lifestyle; the whole industrial era to Industrialism, and all unitis with metal weapons under Metal Infantry. it is too broad to me.

mandyai said:
3/10 Of all the dozens of futuristic games ive played, this would have to be one of the worst tech trees. I applaud for sticking some techs to biomaterials but there seems to be a bias of generalism here, and what is up with ubiquitous computing? should there be ubiquious electricity and ubiquious wheels too Why are there less techs here than PREHISTORIC ERA! that really blows my mind, alot. that era has 90 techs why does this one have 40ish? I think the old tech tree was better, some mergers are okay but alot of deletion make me wonder if we should move on to Sins of a solar empire rebellion.

veruna said:
4/10 There is only one thing i can say, why is there less techs here than Prehistoric and Classical Era? digital Era has more discoveries and inventions in one week that a whole century in B.C. If general-ism is the mentality, why is there a Telepgraph, Televison, and Radio tech when they can all be generalized under Analog Electronics? I dont like that this era is being discriminated because its the "future". Why did he assume Autoaim Armament can be a bullet, did he not read that autoaim is about bullet magnetism and true lock-on techs? Ubiquitous computing gets 1/10. Why is there no ubiquitous plastics,ubiquitous electricity, or ubiquitous vehicles? why is computing singled out? How can bugbots be merged with Turning AI if they dont have human intelligence?

mindcrafter said:
6/10
How does this have very little techs compared to ancient eras? Turning AI is more cyber era, why are nanogenerators deleted? Biotech Argriculture is about genetically modified crops, and cloning is not about animals, there are several cloning types. Ugh why does he think animal exoskeletons are about uplifting, they are animal robots not arcology! The tree is very dull and has no creative value like other space games. Umm where would u have Advanced Sociological Theories as a tech, but liberalism, nationalism, and fascism are okay. I dont like the generalization of the future at all, and am offended it has less techs than ancient era. Bring the old one back but keep it at 90 techs max.

futurisma said:
6/10
A good effort but there needs to be more creativity with the names, and some of the techs are really generalized. I dont like ubiquitous computing, why is there no ubiquitous electricity or ubiquitous water power? It doesnt make sense to me. Also why is Ocean Wave energy merged with Organic photonics? How is led lighting connected to ocean wave turbunes please explain that to me. You do know that Astro Particle Physics came after superstring theory, so why name it string theory? I like bugbots and digitazed fabrics! My biggest complaint is this tech tree lacks the CIV4 charm and spirit, its too plain.

Hydromancerx said:
@MrAzure

1. Can you use the spoiler on your big blocks of code text please?

2. Please post the tech from column X79 in Vokarya-style so we can review them all? Thanks!

will do!

ls612 · Jul 12, 2012

@MrAzure:

That still has 88 techs, so a bit more trimming is in order unfortunately. Here are the rest my ideas for today, then I'll stop and let Hydro comment.

Delete:

-Proteomics
-Geomorphology
-Plastic Electronics
-Multispectrum Stelth
-Robot Society
-Deepsea Warfare
-Automated Workforce
-Marine Architecture
-Multiwavelength Lasers
-Emotion Transistors
-Underwater Travel
-Mesh Networks
-AURA Command

Merge:

-Civilian Robots and Microgenerators --> Civilian Robots
-Pheremone Biochemistry --> Genomic Healthcare

As for what your LAN partners say, I hate to say this, but I think they have less experience with era balancing than I do, I've been doing era and gamespeed balancing for four months now. Anyway, let's say what Hydro thinks.

Hydromancerx · Jul 12, 2012

ls612 said:
@MrAzure:

Ok, here's my detailing of what I think needs doing on the early TH era.

Whew, that's alot. I think that the remaining techs should be kept in the same area on the tech tree, thus leaving openings in the tree, which is good. This way, the TH era will be more down to size and also more generic. Could you do this soon please? Also, you do know that you can attach the GameText file to the post, as opposed to posting it, right?

Some should not be deleted since they are core techs and have stuff on them already. For instance "Automated Traffic" needs to stay.

On the tech tree, black techs need to stay and any red tech can go. Note that black techs can be re-named if we need to (such as Cloning to Animal Cloning).

Azurian · Jul 12, 2012

Ill start with 2.

Cyberwarfare (Digital Era)
Location: X79 Y1
Cost: 9400

Req Techs: CLOUDCOMPUTING, WAR SIMULATIONS, KNOWLEDGE MANAGEMENT

Leads to: UPLINK TACTICS,
Buildings:
- Corporate Firewall (-foreign espionage)
-Wireless Broadband (promo for Bradcast tower)
- Unit:Hacker (promotes from Thief line)

Crime: Identity Theft

Wonders:
Department of Cybersecurity (+ espionage)

Civics:
-National firewall [Like great firewall of china, allows the control of what people can see online)

Cyberwarfare refers to politically motivated hacking to conduct sabotage and espionage, wether it is by a rebellion group or a coordinated military grade attack.[PARAGRAPH:2]Government security expert Richard A. Clarke, in his book Cyber War , defines "cyberwarfare" as "actions by a nation-state to penetrate another nation's computers or networks for the purposes of causing damage or disruption. The Economist describes cyberspace as "the fifth domain of warfare,"

Anti ballistic Missile (Digital Era)
Location: X79 Y3
Cost: 9400

Req Techs:Modern_WARFARE, UNMANNED_AIR_VEHICLES, WARSIMULATION

Leads to: UNDERGROUND WARFARE
Buildings:
Modern Missle Silo

Units:
- THOR ICBM (promotion of icbm)
-HAMMER missle (anti- guided missle)
- Avalanche Anti Aircraft (AA) Turret (anti- air unit, bonus against UAVS)
- Javalin RPG (missle infantry)
- Aegis Ballistic Missile Defense System (anti guided missle cruiser)
- Reactive Armor tank ( good against rpgs and artilery)

Civics:
-ICBM Treaties ( no icbm use allowed)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-ballistic_missile

ls612 said:
As for what your LAN partners say, I hate to say this, but I think they have less experience with era balancing than I do, I've been doing era and gamespeed balancing for four months now. Anyway, let's say what Hydro thinks.

Actually they have made over 1200 Techs combined for several games over a decade, and 325+ for C2C (for our private mod). I am very opened minded thou.

Hydromancerx · Jul 12, 2012

What are the names of the techs, not their tech tags.

ls612 · Jul 12, 2012

Hydromancerx said:
Some should not be deleted since they are core techs and have stuff on them already. For instance "Automated Traffic" needs to stay.

On the tech tree, black techs need to stay and any red tech can go. Note that black techs can be re-named if we need to (such as Cloning to Animal Cloning).

The only one that needs reinstating as being an old tech is Automated Traffic.

Some old techs have been renamed, for instance Biofuels is now Biomaterials. I'm aiming for ~70 techs in the first batch, as I can see some nice ways to winnow MrAzure's concepts for the Cyber and Nano eras down to 35 or 40 techs. Currently, after Automated Traffic is reinstated and my second round of cuts are implemented, We'll have 75 techs in the Digital part of the TH era. Do you have another 5 to 10 techs than can be merged or cut?

Azurian · Jul 12, 2012

Hydromancerx said:
What are the names of the techs, not their tech tags.

is this better?

Cyberwarfare (Digital Era)
Location: X79 Y1
Cost: 9400

Req Techs: Cloud Computing, War Simulations, Knowledge Management

Leads to: Uplink Tactics,
Buildings:
-Corporate Firewall (-foreign espionage)
-Wireless Broadband (promo for Bradcast tower)
-Unit:Hacker (promotes from Thief line)

Crime: Identity Theft

Wonders:
Department of Cybersecurity (+ espionage)

Civics:
-National firewall [Like great firewall of china, allows the control of what people can see online)

Cyberwarfare refers to politically motivated hacking to conduct sabotage and espionage, wether it is by a rebellion group or a coordinated military grade attack.[PARAGRAPH:2]Government security expert Richard A. Clarke, in his book Cyber War , defines "cyberwarfare" as "actions by a nation-state to penetrate another nation's computers or networks for the purposes of causing damage or disruption. The Economist describes cyberspace as "the fifth domain of warfare,"

Anti ballistic Missile (Digital Era)
Location: X79 Y3
Cost: 9400

Req Techs: Modern Warfare, War Simulation, Unmanned Air Vehicles

Leads to: Underground Warfare
Buildings:
Modern Missle Silo

Units:
-THOR ICBM (promotion of icbm)
-HAMMER missle (anti- guided missle)
-Avalanche Anti Aircraft (AA) Turret (anti- air unit, bonus against UAVS)
-Javalin RPG (missle infantry)
-Aegis Ballistic Missile Defense System (anti guided missle cruiser)
- Reactive Armor tank ( good against rpgs and artilery)
Civics:

Gesture Recognition (Digital Era) [/B]
Location: X79 Y1
Cost: 9400

Req Techs: Cloud Computing, War Simulations, Knowledge Management

Leads to: Speech Recognition, Smart Vehicles, Organic Photonics, Software Sports,

Buildings:
- CGI Studio
- Motion Video Games (promo for video games)
-Proxemics Lab ( +2 science with biometrics, +2 with augmented reality, +2 with holographics, +2 science with machine vision , +2 science with Cyber anthropology)

Corporation: Pear Corporation [apple corporation)

Gesture recognition and multi-touch are topics in computer science and language technology with the goal of interpreting human gestures via mathematical algorithms. In computing, multi-touch refers to a touch sensing surface's (trackpad or touchscreen) ability to recognize the presence of two or more points of contact with the surface. This plural-point awareness is often used to implement advanced functionality such as pinch to zoom or activating predefined programs.[PARAGRAPH:2] Gestures can originate from any bodily motion or state but commonly originate from the face or hand. Current focuses in the field include emotion recognition from the face and hand gesture recognition. Many approaches have been made using cameras and computer vision algorithms to interpret sign language. However, the identification and recognition of posture, gait, proxemics, and human behaviors is also the subject of gesture recognition techniques.

Hydromancerx · Jul 12, 2012

- Corporate Firewall (-foreign espionage)
-Wireless Broadband (promo for Bradcast tower)
- Unit:Hacker (promotes from Thief line)

I assume you mean a building upgrade for the Broadcast Tower and a Unit upgrade for the Hacker unit. Promotes sounds like its a unit promotion. Just be careful with your wording.

I approve Cyberwarfare. Note that ls612 and Vokarya need to also approve too before it gets passed as a tech.

------

Anti ballistic Missile

Is that how its going to be written? I think it should be written as "Anti-Ballistic Missile".

The name seems like it could be something else but that's minor thing. It looks ok to me but I am going to see what the others say before approving.

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