[GS] Canada Discussion Thread

[Furycrab]

Australia, Brazil and Canada fall roughly in the same boat for me, like.. I can appreciate their designs because they are recognisable for what they are and that's pretty important for a game that seeks to promote cultural diversity, but none of them are Civs that i'm dying to see or play as in a Civ game. I also agree that Aus's design is *way* better than Canada's (because Aus is an indisputably strong Civ, while Canada could grow to be be situationally strong, but never super dominant thanks to their restrictive bonuses) but I'd say that Canada's bonuses are better than Brazil's, at least.

They are civs that were constantly being added into the game via mods, so someone was clearly dying to play them. For me it's practically reason enough to play this one on day one.

Power level wise it's hard to say just yet where it stands, because I don't know how good having extra favor will be or how the AI will deal without surprise wars. I like the flavor thought. Expansionist cultural empire that wants to aggressively settle the tundra borders, yet remain peaceful. Feels very much like Canada.

Surprised you rate it above Brazil. Brazil is a bit boring design wise, but it's usually pretty strong if the map gen isn't awful.

 

[Leathaface]

National parks and ice rinks are fairly late game so the value you get from them will probably be low. I may be wrong on this but late game bonuses only work if you have a way to get there quicker and Canada does not have any early game bonuses. I am not sure how you are going to win a culture victory when Russia/Greece can do this earlier and much easier.

There is still plenty of time left in a Civ game after you can play National Parks, especially with the future era being added. National Parks can provide a big boost towards Culture victory.

A hockey rink provides... Production?? What exactly is it producing?

Canada will be IMMUNE to attack unless you have a casus belli? WHAT?

The unique unit can create a National Park... which is impossible to create in 95% of games?

And here we thought the Canadian traits would be silly, stupid, or useless. Shame on us.

95% of games? You sure you're not exagerrating there? I can found National Parks most of the time if i'm prepared to remove a few mines.

I hope you're right! I read "bonus" as meaning coming from a source that other civs don't have, but it might be extra from a source that all civs now have.

Strike that. The actual wording is "for every 100 Tourism earn 1 Diplomatic Favor." Nothing about "bonus".

Canada's reveal on Civilization.com contains the sentence "Grants bonus Diplomatic Favor based on per-turn Tourism" when talking about the ablity of Four Faces of Peace, nothing about it in the actual first look video though.

 

[gozon]

I don't know how valuable diplomatic favor is, so it is hard to judge Canada's strength right now. Aside from diplomatic victory though...

If Canada doesn't have a tundra bias, then the tundra farm is nearly useless, making Canada almost a blank civ before industrial era. Thus they are not nearly as competitive due to a lack of a snow ball effect. Ice hockey rink can give a good amount of culture, but wouldn't it be too late? You'll probably be swimming in culture from great works if you are pursuing a cultural victory already. Cheaper National Parks are nice (I always try to get one for the "flavor"), but NPs themselves are very restrictive without a way to add appeal.

If Canada does have a tundra bonus though (more likely than not), it is a very severe draw back. Tundra farm can only alleviate this to a minimum degree, without a bonus on production.

I'll probably try Canada for my first attempt at Diplomatic Victory, but a blank civ at the early game doesn't sound like fun.

 

[CivLuvah]

How do you figure?

Australia's uniques are familiar (and admittedly stereotypical) but they are reasonable in that they actually reflect the character of Australia as a country so dependent on the land and coast. Canada is just a mishmash of stereotypical things commonly associated with Canada instead of things that actually reflect the character of the country. The UA though does reflect what Canada does in the international community, what it's really known for.

 

[UWHabs]

One thing I will say, I've seen this shared by at least 4-5 friends on facebook, and I haven't seen any of them post about civ any other time, so I would be willing to bet they get an uptick in sales due to this from Canada. Which, when you come around to it, is probably one of the major reasons why they finally got included.

Although one guy's comment on the post "Is this a joke?" definitely sums up the general reaction.

 

[Sagax]

Although one guy's comment on the post "Is this a joke?" definitely sums up the general reaction.

Well, it could be interpreted either way, without context. The reaction of Smash Bros. players to Persona DLC in Smash can also be summed up as “Is this a joke?” (Spoiler: fans are actually ecstatic about it)

 

[Aristos]

I'm no soccer expert, but don't goalies touch the ball with their hands?

Haha, good one... I should have been more specific and allow for a little exception like that one. Still, the overwhelming majority of the game is played with the feet, and that is what I was trying to convey. Handegg, on the other hand (pun intended), is played mostly with the hands (and with an egg and not a ball).

 

[Jewelrunna]

Welcome to Civ, the True North Strong and Free!

Canada would still be able to do joint wars and be the target of joint wars, which means that Canada is still vulnerable to surprise attacks. At least joint wars aren't as common (even with Gilgamesh).

Correct me if I'm wrong, but don't joint wars require at least one of the Civs to denounce you? That means you can still prepare somewhat in advance for a war, albeit you can't account for their partner.

 

[Cuneiform]

Looks like the ski resorts are an improvement after all.

And apparently they can be adjacent to Rainforest...

 

[jestergl]

I certainly didn't expect my grand uncle, Sir Wilfried Laurier, to be the leader of Canada but I am happy that he is recognized as such.
The forced peace ability is going to be extremely strong in certain game, where if you play diplomatically the computer will never be able to declare war on you. You could run away with a religious victory without war to counter you. You also counter the persian surprise attack bonuses.
The ice rink are fun but too little too late. The mounties are nice but you have to plan for them, especially since tundra are not known as great seaside resort spot.

 

[gozon]

Apparently Canadian Mounties and US Park Rangers wear the same style of hats (also featured as the unit icon). Maaaybe that's why they can build national parks. (Otherwise there are no mentions Mounties having major involvement with parks)

Also according to wikipedia, some members of RCMP did participate in WWI and WWII. But they are by no means a significant military force. Yeah, naming them Mounties is probably a "joke".

Adding loyalty/amenity and counterspy might be a better function for Mounties as a civil police force, but these bonuses are boring...

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

And apparently they can be adjacent to Rainforest...

I bet the requirements will just be a non-desert mountain with high appeal.

 

[Boris Gudenuf]

Yep, they didn't perform well.

For complete accuracy, although Moose Cavalry was a joke, both the Germans and the Soviets in World War Two used reindeer in the Arctic, but not in combat units. They were used as pack or draft animals to supply units near Murmansk and Petsamo - about as far north as you can get and still be on land. Unfortunately, neither side seems to have paid attention to the local reindeer herders, who could have told them that reindeer basically lose weight all winter, so that the 'reindeer supply columns' steadily lost capacity throughout the winter - made supply calculations a nightmare for both sides!

Mountie horses are always all black, they don't use brown coloured horses

When neither England nor Scotland got a Cavalry unit on all white horses, representing the 2nd North British Dragoons, or Scots Greys, probably one of the most Iconic mounted units of the last 200 years, I knew that horse color was not going to be of any importance in Civ VI...

Apparently Canadian Mounties and US Park Rangers wear the same style of hats (also featured as the unit icon). Maaaybe that's why they can build national parks. (Otherwise there are no mentions Mounties having major involvement with parks).

Smoky the Bear also wears that style of hat. Does that mean TR's USA is going to get a Very Special UU related to National Parks also?

 

[jddods]

Keep in mind Goddess of the Harvest pantheon is gone

Where did you see that?

 

[Saltcreek]

There is still plenty of time left in a Civ game after you can play National Parks, especially with the future era being added. National Parks can provide a big boost towards Culture victory.

You are going to have a sound culture base way before you get the rinks and NP if you want to compete against Russia, Greece, and Kongo. As others have said, a blank, vanilla civ in the early game is just going to be boring to play and not competitive. Canada needs more from the tundra to actually make a tundra game viable. I like the idea of basing the civ around the snow but at least give it some bonuses to tundra. Right now, Canada is just a way worse version of Russia.

I don't know how valuable diplomatic favor is, so it is hard to judge Canada's strength right now. Aside from diplomatic victory though...

If Canada doesn't have a tundra bias, then the tundra farm is nearly useless, making Canada almost a blank civ before industrial era. Thus they are not nearly as competitive due to a lack of a snow ball effect. Ice hockey rink can give a good amount of culture, but wouldn't it be too late? You'll probably be swimming in culture from great works if you are pursuing a cultural victory already. Cheaper National Parks are nice (I always try to get one for the "flavor"), but NPs themselves are very restrictive without a way to add appeal.

If Canada does have a tundra bonus though (more likely than not), it is a very severe draw back. Tundra farm can only alleviate this to a minimum degree, without a bonus on production.

I'll probably try Canada for my first attempt at Diplomatic Victory, but a blank civ at the early game doesn't sound like fun.

Canada will most certainly have a tundra bias which will compound the problem and a farm is not going to improve that (neither will the rink) As I have read on reddit: "I have waited 25 years to build a farm on tundra..."

As a Canadian I rather them not add Canada to the game than do it like this.

 

[Zaarin]

Smoky the Bear also wears that style of hat. Does that mean TR's USA is going to get a Very Special UU related to National Parks also?

"Only you can prevent scouting! Boy do we need forest fires!"

 

[AmazonQueen]

Yep, they didn't perform well.

Moose had too much sense, huh?

 

[Boris Gudenuf]

"Only you can prevent scouting! Boy do we need forest fires!"

"Save the Sequoiah forest: Start Forest Fires!"
"Stop Missionaries from sneaking through the woods: Only You can prevent Forest Friars!"
"Stop advertising in the woods: Only You can prevent Forest Fliers!"
"Stop Arson in Flower Shops: Only You can prevent Florist Fires!"

 

[Boris Gudenuf]

Moose had too much sense, huh?

Moose and Elephants apparently share this in common: they are both too smart to voluntarily stick around and get shot at, and when they want to leave, there's not much that can stop them from leaving...

Battle Elephants were as often a disaster to their own side as to the enemy, as Hannibal found out at Zama, Porus at Hydaspes, and Pyrheus in almost every battle against the Romans.
The Tiger tanks of the Ancient and Classical battlefield...

 

[God of Kings]

Aside from all the tundra stuff, the only thing Canada has going at the early game is its immunity to surprise wars.