Discussion in 'Civ3 - Utility Programs' started by BomberEscort, Jan 18, 2004.
Version 1.15 update:
Stealth Ability and SAM Missile Battery options added.
is there sum way you could make this so that the numbers for the attack and defense points go above 99? i am using ur calculater to figure out unit strengths for a mod im working along with help from others, and i need the unit strengths to go above 99....by quite a bit
oh and BTW nice job
Finally got a chance to look at it today. It seems that some options keep graying themselves out for no particular reason, so sometimes I have to click to another option and then click back in order to do a particular thing (Like fortified units).
Also, I can't seem to check Lethal Bombard.
Very nice program.
And to answer one of Louis' questions.
Lethal bombard is only effective when rate of fire is higher than number of hp of defender left. Good programming on that, i'd say.
I have another questions though.
As you have made this program, I'd expect you to know exactly how every outcome of every combat is calculated.
Now I'm wondering if terrain bonusses and civil defence and radar towers and all those kinds of bonusses have any influence on the outcome of air combat (defender intercepting bombarding fighter/bomber unit).
Your program seems to suggest that radar towers and rivers do have an effect and the rest of the bonusses don't. But I can also select fast attacker/defender which is very strange for air units. Can air units retreat? I never tested what happens when you give movement points to air units, but I doubt that they retreat.
Are you correct? Do only radar towers and rivers have any effect on air combat? I'm just curious because I want to balance attack and defence of fighter units for a mod I'm making and thus want to know what effects air combat.
I don't post here much, but I dropped by to say what a nice tool this calculator is. Very easy to use and interpret.
List some specific examples and I will check it out...
No they don't have any effect. The only thing that effects air combat is other air units, AA units, and SAM Missile Battery.
Are you selecting 'Air' for your terrain. I don't have a copy of the program with me, but I remember 'Air' greying everything out. If not I will check this out... You can give air units movement points, I know they don't retreat, but I have heard that you can rebase twice with 2 MP, I haven't personally tested this though. But you are correct, radar towers and rivers have no effect, the only units/improvements the effect air combat are listed above.
No 99's the limit...
Thank you for the information. Now I know everything to balance out air combat in my personal mod.
In the utility a lot of things get greyed out when one selects Air, but not everything in the top half of your calculator (radar towers, attacking across a river, fast defender). This is also true for coast/sea/ocean. I don't know if radar towers give bonusses for sea combat, but rivers obviously can't give bonusses at sea . Also I'm not sure if fortifying at sea really gives a bonus, but I never tested it.
All of these observations are of course minor details, it's a great calculator.
Very useful utility. Thanks BomberEscort!
It seems that your combat calculator (version 1.15) does not calculate the probability of a retreat correctly.
For example, when a unit with an attack rating of 4 on 3HP with regualr experience attacks a fast unit with a defense rating of 3 on 3HP with regular experience (giving a retreat chance of 0.5), the probability of retreat is as such:
(4/7)^2 * 0.5 + (4/7)^2 * (3/7) * 0.5 * 2
Your calculator gives an answer of 0.233236 as the chance of a retreat. This is the same answer as the above equation without the final "*2".
The final * 2 is added to account for the fact that there are 2 ways that there could be a 2-1 retreat: attacker wins, defender wins, attacker wins, defender retreats OR defender wins, attacker wins, attacker wins, defender retreats.
In general, there are (defender's starting HP + no. HP attacker loses - 2)C(no. HP attacker loses) ways that a retreat for a given no. of HP attacker loses can occur.
Apart from the above issue, nice calculator.
Bracketed comments in the quote above are mine...
I see it as only one way to retreat... Here is my rationale...
Fast Defender retreats only occur when the attacker has 2 hp and the defender has 1 hp, any other combination of hit points will not retreat. When this combination exists, using the example above, the retreat happens in 50% percent of those cases. The other 50% the battle continues normally (Win or Loss).
Using your example above, eliminating the 'way' we get to the 2-1 requirement, the retreat-round is as follows:
Case #1: ...attacker wins, defender retreats OR
Case #2: ...attacker wins, defender retreats.
There is one and only one potential retreat round in any given encounter, though this potential may never be realized (the retreat is only calculated once)
In the above cases the defender always loses 2hp and the attacker can lose 0 or 1 (if he loses 2 before the defender loses 2 the retreat will not happen), I account for this in my fomula.
Either way, the retreat is triggered by this scenario (attacker wins round THEN defender retreats)
From what I can tell, you include the 'ways' to get to the 2-1 requirement and I do not... I am far from a statistical expert, if you could explain why you include the 'ways' to get to the 2-1 requirement that might help... Also, I will do another sample based on the example above and post the data...
Either way, good check... I appreciate all the help I can get, the perfection of this calculator being the goal...
this is a great tool....this is THE tool for any civ player.
i'm learning C and C++ and i wanted to do something like this, i never liked the excel calculators they just occupy to much ram and they are just to slow.
you are the man bomber escort!
I include the number of ways to get to 2-1 (actually the number of ways to get to 2-2, as there is only 1 way to get to 2-1 from 2-2 as you have already pointed out) as the retreat can happen as in case#1 or as in case#2. Both the cases are mutually exclusive and therefore the probability of case#1 OR case#2 is P(case#1) + P(case#2). I think we agree that P(case#1) = P(case#2) = (4/7)^2 * (3/7) * 0.5
therefore P(case#1 OR case#2) = ((4/7)^2 * (3/7) * 0.5) + ((4/7)^2 * (3/7) * 0.5) = 2 * (4/7)^2 * (3/7) * 0.5
Hope this explains my inclusion of the number of ways to get to 2-1
Good catch, I have verified your numbers through testing and an update will be forthcoming
Sweet... now I can work out what to do in a game, to attack or to defend... that is the question !
how come the original combat calculator by Xerxes314 uses playing level (i.e. Regent, Monarch, etc) in its calculations and this one doesn't? does the level of play affect those calculations?
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