Clive01 - Warlords Prince Conquest / Domination

[Sirloin]

As far as tech goes, I think there is no need for Iron Working right now; our capital has no jungle, and I don't think we're going to be axing anyone in the next few turns. I would go for Sailing then Masonry. The Great Lighthouse lasts a long time and every one of our cities is going to be coastal; that would be a good short term project.

Also, I think we need to keep religion on our minds. Without happy resources, an early religion would help us a lot. If nothing has been founded yet, we can try and and go Poly-Mono after masonry.

Exploration is a priority, but I think everyone realizes that. Getting a worker soon is important too. Lets not let our worker tech lie dormant; if we're not going to use them immediately we shouldn't have researched them first.

 

[Sir Clive]

With Bede I agree.
North it shall be!
The workboat is there and it has better land. South is too arid.

I think Sailing got really up on the priority list. I'd get it after Agriculture and produce a Galley right after a Settler. We may need to colonize the other islands soon.

I agree with settling next in the north if there is anything half decent there. My dotmap was based on

a) We couldn't see enough of the north yet to establish if there were any decent sites.

b) At the moment the only other landmass we can see is in the SE. We may find there is nothing we can reach with a galley in the North in which case we
need a base in the southe of the island.

Hopefully the workboat will reveal something good in the north !

Definitely agree with prioritising Sailing.
At current research rates we are
8 turns away from Agriculture,
11 turns from Sailing and
22 turns from Iron Working.

Also agree with Bede that there is not much point in a settler just yet since we can't yet see a really good spot to settle the second city.

Let's get to sailing, get a galley out and hopefully find somewhere decent.

Is it worth building a worker just yet ? Even if we continue with agriculture so that we can farm the rice we only have 8 turns until we hit size 4 and then we hit our happiness limit so any growth is just going produce an unhappy citizien . We have no buildings or resources we can use to increase happiness yet We still don't have tech to road or mine so I am not sure what the worker will do. I'd therefore favour going to Sailing immediately.

 

[FeedBack]

Is it worth building a worker just yet ? Even if we continue with agriculture so that we can farm the rice we only have 8 turns until we hit size 4 and then we hit our happiness limit so any growth is just going produce an unhappy citizien . We have no buildings or resources we can use to increase happiness yet We still don't have tech to road or mine so I am not sure what the worker will do. I'd therefore favour going to Sailing immediately.

We have mining! But not having The Wheel is, indeed, not good.
Maybe we can delay the worker a little building another couple of Warriors...

 

[Sir Clive]

Woops - sorry - missed that we had mining

Must wake up ......
Must wake up .......

 

[Bede]

The worker can be time to coincide with the appearance of Agriculture and we have mining for her to work on anyway.

 

[The Sansman]

Logging by Ruff's Cobbled Mod Pack v2.0.4 (Warlords v2.08) - New Log Entries
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Turn 20/460 (3200 BC) [10-Mar-2007 07:05:23]
Madrid finishes: Warrior

IBT:

Turn 21/460 (3160 BC) [10-Mar-2007 07:06:31]
Madrid begins: Worker (9 turns)

Worker will appear 2 turns after Agriculture, I did this to farm the rice.

IBT:

Turn 22/460 (3120 BC) [10-Mar-2007 07:07:14]

IBT:

Turn 23/460 (3080 BC) [10-Mar-2007 07:08:13]

IBT:

Turn 24/460 (3040 BC) [10-Mar-2007 07:08:37]

IBT:

Turn 25/460 (3000 BC) [10-Mar-2007 07:09:01]

IBT:

Turn 26/460 (2960 BC) [10-Mar-2007 07:09:22]
Tribal village results: a little gold

IBT:
Buddhism founded in a distant land

Turn 27/460 (2920 BC) [10-Mar-2007 07:09:52]
Tech learned: Agriculture

IBT:

Turn 28/460 (2880 BC) [10-Mar-2007 07:10:51]
Research begun: Sailing (11 Turns)

Since the general opinion was that our Island is not that great, I figured we would all like to to seek other lands have.

IBT:

Turn 29/460 (2840 BC) [10-Mar-2007 07:13:03]
Madrid finishes: Worker

IBT:

Turn 30/460 (2800 BC) [10-Mar-2007 07:13:16]
Madrid begins: Warrior (5 turns)

I am thinking that we need to build 6-7 warriors for fog busting to Spanish soil Barbarian free.

IBT:

Turn 31/460 (2760 BC) [10-Mar-2007 07:14:10]

IBT:

Turn 32/460 (2720 BC) [10-Mar-2007 07:14:40]

IBT:

Turn 33/460 (2680 BC) [10-Mar-2007 07:14:57]
Madrid finishes: Warrior

IBT:

Turn 34/460 (2640 BC) [10-Mar-2007 07:15:10]
Madrid begins: Warrior (5 turns)

IBT:

Turn 35/460 (2600 BC) [10-Mar-2007 07:16:01]
A Farm was built near Madrid

The world as we know it.

Somehow I do not think will be finding much better on the other little island to our SE. The only thing there I see worth getting are the Elephants. I think we will need to a religion.

The Save.

 

[Sir Clive]

I've got it.

Roster

fbelintani
The Sansman - Just played
Sir Clive - up
Sirloin - on deck
negyvenketto
Bede

I'll keep number of turns at 15 rather than drop down to 10 if that is OK since there is not a lot to do yet.

I'll start at about lunchtime tomorrow (I am on GMT) so suggestions welcome up until then.

What's your feelings team ? We can probably stop building warriors after the curent one as that will give us 4 and there aren't any barbs on our island.

Land looks grim and we do need to explore. Is it worth building a settler and settling to grab the gold in the north ? It's food poor but it will give us more happiness and allow our capital to grow to 5 which will help. However this will delay our exploration.

Current warior build will finish the same time as we discover Sailing. I would assume choice for next build should be either

Settler
or
Galley ?

 

[Sir Clive]

OK - This thread seems to have gone very quiet.

I'm not too keen on going ahead without discussion since I am one of the weaker players in this game but I don't want it to grind to a halt so I am going to go ahead and play 15 now.

Build will be Galley->Settler
Research I am not sure on - there have been suggestions for both Wheel and masonry. I will probably go for one of these but wait to make a decision.

I'll probably stop and post part way though if we meet anyone or discover any significant new land.

Wish me luck

 

[Sir Clive]

Things didn't really work out all that well in this turnset
Sansman and Sirloin both suggested going for a religion due to our lack of hapines resources and that sounded like a good idea to me so after sailing completed I went for Polytheism. Unfortunately we got beaten to Hinduism by 4 turns.

We've now explored all the land we can with the work boat and it doesn't look good. I've just started on Masonry for the Great Lighthouse but it only has 1 turn invested. Maybe we should beeline to Optics / Astronomy instead ?

We now have a galley and settler is due in 5 so we need to think about where to plonk our second city.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

1) - 2560BC

Worker moves towards grassland hill to build mine.
Workboat moves south


2) - 2520BC

Worker moves towards grassland hill to build mine.
Workboat moves south

3) - 2480BC

Worker starts to build mine.
Workboat moves west

IT - we complete sailing. Choices are Polytheism in 11 or Wheel in 8.
Buddhism has gone but Hinduism hasn't yet so I'm going to take a change on
going for Polytheism. Hope that we can get there first for Hinduism since
given our lack of happy resources temples would be useful.

Madrid warrior->galley

4,5) - 2440 BC, 2400 BC

Nothing

6) - 2360 BC

Barb lion appears near our pigs in the south east. It's doing no harm down there
so I'll leave our warriors in the centre where they have protection from jungle /
forest if it moves.
Mine completed - switch production from grassland forest. Galley now due in 7

7) - 2320 BC

Worker heads towards grassland hills to mine.

Our workboat has now explored all the water surrounding our island and the small island
to our SE and there is no more land visible

The workboat can't do anything useful now so I decide to move it towards the first fish/clam
that we are likley to farm and park it there. Unfortunately I can't decided where this
is likely to be So I'm just going to leave it zzzzzing on the clam in our south west for now
as that is the closest tile with a sea resource.

IT - Madrid grows to size 5. Galley now due in 3

8) - 2280 BC

Nothing

9) - 2240 BC

Start mining grassland hill 2S of Madrid.

10) - 2200 BC

Hinduism FIADL I'm not quite sure what to do here so I am going to stay on
Monotheism as it only has 4 turns to go.

11) - 2160 BC

IT - Galley completes - switch to Settler. Start moving Galley towards south.

12, 13) - 2120 BC, 2080 BC

Nothing

14) - 2040 BC

IT - Monotheism completes . Switch to Masonry due in 8 . Hopefully we may have a shot at
the Great Lighthouse but feel free to change.

15 - 2000 BC

Nothing

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Save / screeny to follow

 

[Sir Clive]

http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/26914/PrinceTraining_BC-2000.CivWarlordsSave

 

[Sirloin]

Got It

Its not as bad as you think Clive. We'll just get some Caribbean Island-Hopping flavor in this game as our Conquistadors ravage the West Indies. Archipelago domination is a fun variant.

Expansion-wise, we have a good site up north that will hit fish+goldmine. We can either go for the solid blue dot to grab both without needed a border pop, or we can go 1S to get fresh water. The island to our SE looks like it will eventually be home to a pair of nice production sites.

I will play tomorrow afternoon. Just to note, island domination is probably a lot different that what you may have been expecting, and I'm happy to play this one out, but the team would rather re-roll on pangea thats fine with me too.

 

[Sir Clive]

I will play tomorrow afternoon. Just to note, island domination is probably a lot different that what you may have been expecting, and I'm happy to play this one out, but the team would rather re-roll on pangea thats fine with me too.

I've not played islands much before (I normally play continents) and whilst domination will be difficult it should make for an interesting game.

Although we don't have great land I imagine that the AI will be in a similar position. It will be interesting to see how far behind we are when we meet our opponents and who has made communication with who.

I'd agree with sending the settler to either of the blue dots when ready.

What about research ? Stick with Masonry and try for the GL or head for Optics / Astronomy ASAP ?

 

[Bede]

It is definitely a Dry Tortugas kind of layout. There will be a border appearing somewhere, so we need to have workboats or galleys in all four quadrants to take advantage when it does appear.

One of my best games was an island hoppping conquest.

Don't sweat the isolated start.

Having fresh water is major important, so the blue outline spot is probably best.

 

[Sir Clive]

fbelintani
The Sansman -
Sir Clive - Just played
Sirloin - Currently playing
negyvenketto - on deck
Bede

 

[FeedBack]

Ok, now I'm back from the beach.
What do you guys think about settling 2N of the Bananas (or 2S of the gold)? It's very close to our capital and, when calendar comes in, we will have some food for this city to grow. It'd be a poor city, but it'd grab the gold and make us happier.
I don't think we need wonders yet. We need to settle every spot we can and fogbust every tile we need. So, the order of the day in my humble opinion would be Warriors and Settlers, with an occasional worker. And, remember: the worker! We have a huge bonus for being expansive!

Masonry should be changed. I'd go to wheel -> pottery (we may start cottaging pretty soon) -> Priesthood -> (Start the oracle) -> Writing -> CoL (from Oracle).
How about it?

 

[The Sansman]

Sir Clive I would not worry about thinking that you did poorly, I think the results are fine. When I said that we might want to go for a religion I meant Judaism, I was pretty sure we would not get Hinduism, and I do not even bother trying to get Buddhism anymore.

 

[Sirloin]

Research/Religion/Wonder-wise we have two options:

Masonry-Monotheism Grab Judiasm, Option to build the Lighthouse (or Pyramid)
Priesthood, Oracle-COL Grab Confus

Going the Oracle route puts us in a good position to head toward writing/alphabet/literature but we don't want to get distracted from a run towards optics. Although I originally favored Lighthouse/Mono (and I'm still confident we can grab found the Jewish faith), I'm now leaning towards the Oracle route, since the early courthouses will fuel our economy while we expand, since it looks like we're going to need a lot of small cities.

Whichever way we choose, I would recommend holding off on Wheel/Pottery for at least a tech or two. Normally roads are very important, but for our map, what are do we have to hook up? nothing- we have one food resource that is available but we're happy-capped right now. We'll need to get gold going, but thats going to take a WHILE for a new city, then a monument, then a border pop, then a mine... we won't need roads for 30+ turns, where if we go for construction or priesthood, we can get cranking on those wonders immediately.

 

[Sir Clive]

Since I haven't played at this level before and have rarely played this map type I have no idea when we are likely to see our first AI Civ.

We know we have no Copper and we don't know yet whether we have iron and/or horsies. At the moment the only military we can build are warriors.

None of the current proposed research paths will enable us to build anything better.

I'm just concerned if someone aggressive has spears / swords then our warriors will be toast as soon as they can get to us.

Is it worth sneaking in archery along the way or should we hope we meet friendly civs first and we can get some techs to build better units from them ?

 

[FeedBack]

@Sir, I see your worries, but I don't share them. Why? Because we know we are isolated for now. No one can reach us military until Astronomy (nor can we), except for barbs. Well, barbs are well handled by a few warriors (someone said about 6 or 7) nicely placed. And the need are fewer than any other unit (besides a scout that cannot attack).

@Sirloin, I agree we would take judaism if that's our route. I just think CoL is more useful and gives us the same religion happiness. But I agree on the Wheel. We have agriculture, so you can swap Whell + Pottery to Animal Husbandry. So, it would be:
AH -> Priesthood -> Writing -> CoL.

Production-wise, I'd advocate timing the settler with Animal Husbandry, even if it means it for 2 pop.

 

[Sirloin]

Played 10 turns, very little to report.

I switched our research to Priesthood to pursue the Oracle as we discussed. Madrid 2-pop whipped the settler and sent him north with a warrior to found Havana. The city is set full hammers for a monument (it will be faster than growing and whipping). There is a new work boat parked on Havana's fish.

Madrid has started the Oracle, and it will be completed in 15 turns, which will be right on track with AH(4) -> Writing(10), to get us COL. Madrid is set to grow in 2 turns, one turn after the whip unhappiness expires. Our worker has chopped one forest already. In fact, Madrids growth would take it faster than 15, so we can just retool for commerce a bit when we grow to make sure the timing is perfect.

Here is The Save

Next up is Negy. I would say play 15 turns to finish the oracle (just make sure we have writing first) and grab COL. Even 20 would be fine.