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[BNW] Community Deity Game #26 - Polynesia

Discussion in 'Civ5 - Strategy & Tips' started by beetle, Jan 29, 2018.

  1. beetle

    beetle Deity

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    CDG 26 – Kamehameha

    Please see the CDG Series Discussion Thread to express yourself if you have remarks and ideas. Some maps use mods. This map uses the DLC map packs, so you will need “Explorers Map Pack”, “Scrambled Nations”, and “Scrambled Continents”.

    Please provide a screenshot of your victory turn. We also very much encourages pictures and stories related to the achievements and keys point in the game – because it’s fun to read for all of us! Restart or reload as you like, but in your write-up (which does not have to be long) please describe the challenges you faced.

    We welcome all comments and questions, but please use the SPOILER tag if you attach a picture, make a comment about which civs are in the game, about natural wonders, locations of ancient ruins, terrain features, luxes, resources, etc. In short, if it’s information you can only know by playing the game, don’t spoil it for others by divulging this information in the open. Thank you for your co-operation, and have fun!

    Before you download and play the map, please take a moment to speculate here in this thread on your initial thoughts and plans for the game. Will you settle in place? Will you try to found a religion? What are your plans for getting the most from the UA/UU/UI? What Victory Condition will you be aiming for?

    The suggested VC is Culture.

    Spoiler for opening screen shot :
    civ5ss-polynesia-t000-4cdg.jpg

    Spoiler for UA, UU, and UI :
    Wayfinding. Can embark and move over Ocean immediately. +1 Sight when embarked. +10% Combat Strength bonus if within two tiles of a Moai.

    You can train the Maori Warrior, which starts with the Haka War Dance promotion: “Enemy units receive -10% Combat Strength when adjacent to any unit with this promotion.” This unique promotion is retained when the unit is upgraded.

    Workers can build Moai on any coastal tile. Moai add +1 culture to the tile, plus an additional +1 culture for every adjacent Moai. (E.g., two Moai side-by-side each add +2 culture to the default tile yield. For three Moai in straight line, the middle tile gets +3.)

    Spoiler for map type and settings :
    Standard size, standard speed, standard number of civs and CS, etc. Map type is Small Continents Plus. Map was not altered but I used the Rotate Start Position mod and picked the best location. All VC are enabled.
    Spoiler if you are not familiar with Small Continents Plus :
    The in-game description reads: “Similar to Small Continents, but with extended scripting for chains of island and city-state placement.”

    Spoiler for hints about which AIs you might encounter :
    All opponents are hand selected for competitiveness and role-play. They all have a water-oriented UU or UA.

    Spoiler for difficulty :
    Easy. Only Brazil is better at CV (and they are not on this map). Your starting continent is sufficiently craggy for buffing the Moia.

    Spoiler for links to previous threads in CDG series :
    CDG1: Persia, Oct. 31st, 2015, domination, Pangea, hard, map by Consentient
    CDG2: Assyria, Nov. 15th, 2015, science, Pangaea, medium, map by Consentient
    CDG3: Ethiopia, Dec. 2nd, 2015, culture, NQ Pangaea, hard, map by Consentient
    CDG4: Spain, Dec. 17th, 2015, domination, NQ Pangaea, medium, map by Consentient.
    CDG5: Indonesia, Jan. 2nd, 2016, culture, NQ Continents, hard, map by Consentient.
    CDG6: Zulus, Jan. 15th, 2016, domination, Oval, easy, map by Consentient.
    CDG7: Shoshone, Feb. 2nd, 2016, culture, Oval, very easy, map by Enslingkorp.
    CDG8: Austria, Feb. 15th, 2016, science, Pangaea, very easy, map by IronfighterXXX.
    CDG9: Brazil, Feb. 28th, 2016, culture, Pangaea, medium, map by Blatc.
    CDG10: Denmark, March 14th, 2016, domination, Lakes, hard, map by Beetle.
    CDG11: Venice, April 1st, 2016, domination, Archipelago, very easy, map by Wild_Woojsha.
    CDG12: Byzantium, April 15th, 2016, domination, Continents, very hard, map by Beetle.
    CDG13: Inca, April 30th, 2016, culture, Pangaea, medium, map by Shark Diver.
    CDG14: Celts, May 18th, 2015, domination or culture, Oval, hard, map by Consentient.
    CDG15: America, May 30th, 2016, diplomacy, Mesopotamia, medium, map by Beetle.
    CDG16: Sweden, June 14th, 2016, domination or diplomacy, HB Continents, medium, map by Consentient.
    CDG17: Germany, July 2nd, 2016, diplomacy, Pangaea, easy, map by Dan Quayle.
    CDG18: France, July 14rd, 2016, diplomacy, HB Continents, hard, map by MaxAttack.
    CDG19: Ottomans, Aug. 5th, 2016, domination, Continents, medium, map by Beetle.
    CDG20: Portugal, Aug. 20th, 2016, domination, Pangaea, medium, map by Beetle.
    CDG21: China, Sept. 9th, 2016, domination, Pangaea, medium, map by @Dan Quayle.
    CDG22: Maya, Oct. 2nd, 2016, domination or science, NQ Pangaea, hard, map by @consentient.
    CDG23: Iroquois, Oct. 15th, 2016, domination or culture, NQ Oval, very hard, map by @consentient.
    CDG24: Babylon, Nov. 11th, 2016, science, Continents, medium, map by @beetle.
    CDG25: Arabia, Jan. 15th, 2018, domination, Pangea, medium, map by @beetle.
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Feb 1, 2018
  2. Grendeldef

    Grendeldef Trancerelic

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    Oh, cool - at first glance I thought no lux on sight but then noticed the Crabs so this may be easier than the ancient Poly challenge after all. Perhaps I'll even give a CV a chance.


    @beetle: There's a typo in the OP in the list of past games as the last line is "CDG24: Babylon, Jan. 15th, 2018, domination, Pangea, medium, map by @beetle." while it should be the #25 Arabia game.
     
  3. beetle

    beetle Deity

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    @Grendeldef, there is two Crabs and Cocoa in the opening screen shot. Thanks for pointing out the typo.

    I thought about moving to unlock Watermill and Garden, but settled in place for the extra Hammer and because I like to make canals when I can. I really like using UU, so my initial BO was Warrior, Shrine, Warrior x2.
    Spoiler about late game :
    I hit 1K tourism by the late game (t300+, and not with IG buff). I don’t think I have seen those numbers before, outside of Brazil during Carnival!
     
    Last edited: Jan 30, 2018
  4. raider980

    raider980 Warlord

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    To move or not to move, that is going to be a difficult choice. If you move next to the river you can get Garden and the sheep hill becomes a 4 culture tile with a Moai (or 5 if that plains on the other side is coastal too). Or you could move across the river and your starting hill will be 4 as well. Or settle in place and be on a hill and have a canal city. I'll move the warrior across the river to see what's there and then decide.

    I really like Polynesia. I think its an underrated civ. They were my first win when I moved up in difficulty and it was rather easy. And also Moai are underrated I think. I can never get Chateau to work as well as Moai even though people say Chateau are superior.
     
  5. KingVercingetorix

    KingVercingetorix Chieftain

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    I'm planning something risky with this game. I'll SIP in place for early game hammers, then I'll work the sheep straight away and spam Scouts. If they hit a Pop ruin it will all be worth it. My risky strategy is playing very wide Liberty. I'll settle 3/4/5 decent cities in desirable locations. Grow them and build important infrastructure. Monument, Granary, Library, Aqueduct, and Workshops. After NC is finished my plan is to settle quite a few more cities. Natural Wonders, unique luxuries and horses/iron will all be prioritised.

    After cities are settled I'd like to build a navy capable of taking some capitals. Apart from The Oracle and Pyramids I won't build any wonders up until Modern Era. Taking out the culture runaway and undoing all their hard work is what I have in mind. If this fails I'll try a regular Tradition game.
     
  6. raider980

    raider980 Warlord

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    Yea, I think wide too. The more Moai the better. I hope there are oceans separating us from the other civs so I can found some cities without getting attacked right away.
     
  7. beetle

    beetle Deity

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    FWIW, I won by CV on pretty much my first* try, just using 4-city Tradition.

    The spoiler for map type in OP pretty much answers that question.

    *Three times I retried the first 80 turns (or so) trying to get a religion — I was sooo close. I don’t think I picked too many civs with a religious flavor, so I look forward to hearing about others experience with founding.
     
    Last edited: Feb 1, 2018
  8. raider980

    raider980 Warlord

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    Where'd you build 4 cities?

    Spoiler :
    I just resigned - I only had two cities and Indonesia took the ideal spot west of the mountains. No good spots left. There's not much room on this map so Liberty was the wrong decision.
     
    Last edited: Feb 1, 2018
  9. beetle

    beetle Deity

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    Inspired @KingVercingetorix and @raider980 (and I suppose the Fastest DV thread), I restarted this map from scratch. I researched AH first, skipped the early Shrine, and bee-lined Construction. I mean, the same tech for the UI as for CBs? Killing the neighbor seems like natural play for Polynesia! I hit a culture ruin on T7 and opened Liberty. Not much later, a ruin gave me 40 faith (for a Pantheon) and I pretty much by accident allied Kathmandu, so I got a religion! I opened Tradition after CR, and Hanging Gardens was still available, so I delayed NC for a try at that, but got lucky there too.

    TLDR, I am trying another peaceful game. I think just six cities though, as one of the remote island spots I was expecting to pick up was snagged.

    I pretty much always wait on CR to start building settlers, so 1st Liberty settler is after my 1st Tradition settler. That does makes the early land grab more of a gamble.
    Spoiler for specifics, and I name terrain features :
    First settler west to Uluru for sure. I got a better spot with my Tradition game, but it made an enemy out of Gajah Mada. My Liberty CR settler still picked up Uluru, but not the dyes. On the plus side though, Gajah has been a real pal. One settler to south edge of initial continent, then third settler (and last one before NC) to the middle of the close island to the north. It has a nice shape and three sheep. Plus those four spots lock up all the Crabs, of which there seven, so plenty for trades.
     
    Last edited: Feb 1, 2018
  10. KingVercingetorix

    KingVercingetorix Chieftain

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    Culture Victory Turn 231

    Spoiler :
    I couldn't make wide Liberty work on this map. I had plans to settle around 10 great/decent cities (unique luxury, horses/iron, Natural Wonder) and then a further 6 pretty poor cities (fish, sheep, deer). As long as the poor cities could build up to universities I was happy. I wanted them producing faith and a tiny bit of science. They also would provide extra Moais for culture. My religion included God of the Sea, Interfaith Dialogue, Pagodas, Religious Centre, and Holy Order. The plan was to eventually convert all the cities and keep happiness in check.

    I ended up bailing this attempt around turn 130. I went for a 4 city NC and spammed Settlers afterwards. I settled an extra 6 cities in some good locations (Mt. Kili, Sri Pada) and still had Settlers embarked getting to their location. However I wasn't at all happy with how lengthy this process was and how my capital city suffered as a result. These Settlers were taking about 20 turns to reach their location. Maybe it is better to go for a later 6/7/8 city NC and then settle extra, I'm really not sure. I love the idea of playing 'Shaka/Hiawatha' wide Liberty game but executing it is near impossible for me.

    My winning game I went for a 3 city NC with the desire of capturing extra cities. Hopefully these cities would be filled with Wonders and Great Works. I settled in place and spammed scouts, this map is just full of ruins. I made sure to screenshot every ruin I got. I think this is significant as they drastically improved my early game

    Turn 6: 70 gold
    Turn 7: map
    Turn 10: Archer upgrade
    Turn 12: Animal Husbandry
    Turn 14: 80 gold
    Turn 16: barb activity
    Turn 17: map
    Turn 21: 20 culture
    Turn 22: 20 faith
    Turn 29: 75 gold
    Turn 31: pop increase
    Turn 33: Archer upgrade and 20 culture
    Turn 36: 85 gold
    Turn 40: map
    Turn 45: barb activity
    Turn 48: pop increase
    Turn 49: 85 gold
    Turn 58: 20 culture
    Turn 70: Archer upgrade x2
    Turn 77: 60 gold
    Turn 83: barb activity
    Turn 88: pop increase

    24 ruins in total giving gold, culture, faith (pantheon), extra pop, and archers (camp quests). With the 30/15 gold when meeting city states I was able to save up 500 gold and buy a settler. I was able to settle Samoa on turn 35 and Tonga on 43. Production in the capital wasn't great early game so the settler took around 12 turns, jungle hills then slowed down the settling process.

    CivilizationV_DX11_2018_02_01_23_05_05_207.png
    Early game happiness wasn't great. Having to tech both Calendar and BW to get my luxuries online. Sailing wasn't researched as it didn't fit into my early game strategy. My plan was to build The Hanging Gardens in this game. SIP meant I missed out on the nearby river and I really wanted a garden. The 6 food it provides means I can work hills for faster NC/Oracle. Hanging Gardens is obviously rather difficult on Deity, Especially when Byzantium, Venice, and Indonesia all went Tradition.

    CivilizationV_DX11_2018_02_01_23_53_36_550.png
    I was able to finish it on turn 66. I believe it usually goes around turn 50-60 so I was pretty lucky. In order to build it I had to work hills and sacrifice growth. Take Monument to the Gods, and Religious Community. Chop all surrounding forests instead of farming. Delay Landed Elite/Monarchy for Aristocracy. Settling just 2 expos and being able to buy a settler was also very important. I wouldn't have had the production to fit in another settler.

    CivilizationV_DX11_2018_02_02_01_57_03_972.png
    I was late on my NC in this game. I really wanted The Oracle and didn't want to risk delaying it. I was able to build it on turn 93 and my NC followed on 103. After Workshops, Work Boats, Cargo Chips, Barracks and Unis it was time to focus on building a navy. Byzantium were my target as Constantinople had a brilliant list of wonders. Alhambra, Angkor Wat, Chichen Itza, Colossus, Globe Theatre, Great Mosque, Hagia Sophia, and LToP all became mine. Globe Theatre was home to some Great Works which was a bonus. I also took Antioch. I was annoyed she forward settled and it would act as a concert tour city in the end game.

    Next on the naval warpath was Carthage. They had built Forbidden Palace and also conquered Borobudur, Parthenon, and Stonehenge from Lisbon. My Antioch Navy went for Carthage and the Constantinople navy went for Lisbon. After this I didn't feel like any more battles. I just wanted to sit bit and relax while getting my tourism going. The extra delegates from FP meant my Enact World Religion proposal went through comfortably.

    Industrialisation was my first Industrial era tech followed by Archaeology and Scientific Theory. I wanted Futurism up and running as soon as possible. I chose Autocracy on turn 169 after bulbing Industrialisation and buying 3 factories. Coal was found and immediately given to me as it was already mined. I needed a small loan from Venice to afford my final factory. In this game I had on purpose limited working my guilds. I allowed one writer before Futurism but accidentally allowed 2 artists. I miscalculated the extra points from LToP and it was born the turn I picked Autocracy.

    From here on out it was a fairly routine CV. Spam Archaeologists, fill Museums and build Hotels. I didn't go Rationalism in this game so never reached The Internet. I didn't tech Radar either. The bulk of my Tourism came from The International Games.

    CivilizationV_DX11_2018_02_08_17_23_26_358.png
    Japan and Indonesia were the culture leaders in this game. Both sitting on roughly 17k. Three concert tours put the game to bed. Like most games I play this one was full of errors. My main ones were forgetting about open border and trade route modifiers. I also picked Cult of Personality despite the fact I never got into a single war after choosing it.

    Social Policies
    Full Tradition
    Full Patronage
    Full Aesthetics
    Full Exploration
    Mobilisation, Futurism, Universal Healthcare, Police State, Third Alternative, Cult of Personality

    During the World's fair bonus I peaked at around 1200 culture. I had a couple of GW so I used them for a treatise. Globe and Oxford had their theming bonus so I didn't feel it was necessary to make a great work out of them.

    Wonders I Built
    Broadway
    Cristo Redentor
    Eiffel Tower
    Hanging Gardens
    Louvre
    Oracle
    Prora
    Taj Mahal

    Indonesia built Sistine Chapel and Uffizi. We had a DoF for most of the game so I didn't feel like going to war with him.

    Religion
    Monument to the Gods
    Interfaith Dialogue
    Religious Community
    Feed the World
    Just War

    I missed out on Pagodas on purpose. All my faith pre Industrial was to go on Missionaries. I've been enjoying Interfaith Dialogue recently, in this game Antioch was a science farm. Carthage would convert it and then I'd swim my Missionary over and convert it back. Feed the World was the best choice once available when enhancing. Unfortunately Holy Order was chosen but I felt Just War could provide some use.

    Polynesia are a very fun civ. Being able to plop the Maori Warrior in the water straight away and explore is very exciting. Those Moais are also fantastic. Once Flight came online and a GA was present they were very powerful. Putting Moais over luxuries and resources wasn't as bad as I thought It'd be. Thanks for this map, suits Tradition perfectly. I'd like to role a map as Polynesia where the Islands/Continents are a bit closer together. That would make it better suited for Liberty.

    How do you guys feel about CDG #27 to be late February/early March. If everyone likes the idea of Korea I'd role some maps!









     
  11. beetle

    beetle Deity

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    Nice write-up @KingVercingetorix, thank you. I need to post my own screen shots and stories. I just played peaceful all the way, so kind of boring. But I like the early exploring and building the Moais. The CDL map was okay for Polynesia, but this one is better.

    Let’s discuss the Korean map in the CDG Series Discussion Thread.
     
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2018
  12. vadalaz

    vadalaz King

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    I've been dabbling in Deity CVs a bit recently, so I'm playing this map now and it's been very enjoyable so far.

    I settled on the riverside grassland tile, opened with 3 scouts and rush-bought one more as soon as I could. The amount of ruins you get as Polynesia on water maps is ridiculous. Really makes me wish you'd also get pathfinders to select the perfect rewards, but I can't really complain, as I got my pantheon with a 40 faith ruin, 2 or 3 pop ruins, 3 unit upgrades for easy barb camp quests among other things.

    I actually barely managed to get a religion and was the last one to found around turn 55. I got OwN, +15% production and +15% food, which I don't think I'll bother spreading. Byzantine religion looks fantastic - production from boats, production from specialists, Pagodas and Sacred Sites. Hopefully she sends some missionaries my way soon.

    A bunch of AIs went Piety and Gajah was the only one chose Tradition. I checked his cities and saw he wasn't building HG, so I went for it and finished it really late on turn 85. Now that should just never happen on Deity, but I'll take it.

    Late NC on turn 98 but the tech rate is solid. This is a very, very nice map, the only unfortunate thing is the lack of iron nearby, but I don't know if I want to kill anyone here anyway. Perhaps I'll try Futurism, or maybe a couple of different approaches and see what works best.
     

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  13. vadalaz

    vadalaz King

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    Won on T210 with the low-risk Tradition/Aesthetics/Rationalism/Freedom approach. The finish time was tied to the completion of International Games more than anything else, so to really improve it I'd have to win without IG somehow. Perhaps I'll try World Religion and embrace the hate I get for proposing it. I think WR + Radar should be enough to beat T200 here.

    I thought it was odd that the AIs never converted any of my cities despite half of them going Piety and sharing open borders with me. I wonder how they'd act if I had spread my own religion to my cities. The AIs seemed to do quite poorly on this map in general, e.g. I won the World's Fair with 1640 hammers and the second best was Enrico with 465.

    20180916205445_1.jpg

    Edit: T195 with World Religion, Futurism and Hotels with some mistakes, such as very late National Epic. I also should've focused on faith some more to get at least one more 1000 faith GP, with all the religious city-states on the map. An engineer for Broadway in the end would've been nice, or a second GMu. T185-190 should be very doable.

    20180917145731_1.jpg

    Futurism gave me 1250 or 1500 tourism I believe which was 3-4 turns of passive tourism. That's not too bad, but if you can get enough policies in time and/or there's a culture runaway you're probably better off with Freedom.

    Thanks for the map. Now I should try this with a civ/map combo that's not quite as OP. :)
     
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2019
  14. beetle

    beetle Deity

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    Thanks for the write-up @vadalaz! It is amazing to me how you can win like 100 turns before I do!
     
  15. Nizef

    Nizef Warlord

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    I am late to the party. But what a party it has been so far! I am now on t142 in my fifth try with a classical 3 city tradition turtle. My first two tries ended on t27 and t29 respectively, when Gajah settled the NW. Then I five-moved my settler and settled Honolulu on the sweet spot south of the NW. And my third try ended when Maria sailed in and settled PORTO(!) next to the initial starting location on t31. On the fourth try I captured Marias settler and thought: "yippee a free worker" only for Dido to settle the same spot on t34. So now I am trying a fifth time, starting with the horror five-move opener and building a settler at pop2. This worked well enough to secure both spots and then I had my three cities up and running on t45. But even I know that this was more than suboptimal and I was more or less hopeless, having to play catch up from there on. But the piety-party meant that no one built the HG, so I built it on t105! (is that record late for deity?). And now on t142 I am still last in science but only 3 techs behind the leader. What gives me hope, though, is that I am third in pop (21+12+11) and that Surabaya and Jakarta both look very promising conquest targets.
     
  16. beetle

    beetle Deity

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    Glad to see this map getting some well deserved love!

    Just for the record, the map was not cooked — I was just looking for a craggly start.
     
  17. Nizef

    Nizef Warlord

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    I have to correct one thing: I got it wrong with the HG build… it was even later! As the picture shows, I built it on t110. On deity. Crazy!
     

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  18. Nizef

    Nizef Warlord

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    And then to the report.
    I won a SV on t329. In the earlier update I was quite hopeful of going for CV and it all looked promising: I was first to ideologies and chose Freedom and I was building moais all over the place and I also made some freedom friends like Venice, Indonesia (even after I took Surabaya from them) and Portugal. But the rest of the pack went Order (and Denmark Autocracy) with Theodora and Dido being cultural powerhouses and Oda and Harald doing most of the dirty work. So they started eating my friends one by one and in the middle of the process Theodora and Dido attacked me. This led to several lengthy wars and I needed a new strategy. So I went for the easiest way out, I went for SV. But it was not an easy trip. For the last 50-60 turns Venice, Indonesia and Portugal were all out of the game and the remaining bunch played 4 vs. me.

    All in all a very interesting and entertaining game on a very interesting map. The final screen is attached.
     

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  19. Nizef

    Nizef Warlord

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    I tried again, but it still took me until t314 to secure a CV. Both Oda and Dido were close to 50.000 culture so it took time, annoyingly slow actually.
     

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