Condensed tips for beginners?

[yanner39]

Having a security bureau has the same effect as having a sleeping spy in a city - they don't stack. There's no other passive defense, but the most efficient espionage defense is the counterespionage mission in enemy cities.

So the spy is still "protecting" the city from espionage if it's "sleeping"? Sorry if this is a stupid question but I always leave them in a city and every turn, click on "skip" turn for each spy. It gets pretty long when you have 8 or 9 spies.

 

[Silu]

So the spy is still "protecting" the city from espionage if it's "sleeping"? Sorry if this is a stupid question but I always leave them in a city and every turn, click on "skip" turn for each spy. It gets pretty long when you have 8 or 9 spies.

Yes, you can F them and they still give protection against the tile they stand on (the city if they're on a city tile).

 

[adrianj]

A question about corporations. What's the benefit from them? Whenever i spread a corp i lose money.

Yes, you pay an up front cost to establish the corporation branch, and then paying an ongoing cost for the corporation. These costs can be reduced by running the Free Market Civic or increased by running Environmentalism. The ongoing costs can be more significantly reduced by building a courthouse. But you are right, they can cost you money.
IF you founded the corporation Headquarters in a city with some good multiplier buildings (eg, Banks and Wall Street) it's possible that the money you make in the HQ outweighs the ongoing cost in the branch city.

BUT: The real benefit of corporations is the extra little bonuses they give. Eg, Sid's Sushi and Cereal Mills give a good amount of extra per turn, which is extremely versatile for converting to hammers (you can workshop over some farms, mine some windmills), commerce (cottage over some farms) or anything you desire by growing the population and assigning specialists. Basically, corporations can turn a mediocre tundra/desert city into something very worthwhile, or a normally great city into a real powerhouse.

Also...Merchants. Recently, i scored 6300 with one. What's your biggest?
Too bad it takes long to make one.. What happened to caravans...?

I'm guessing the value from a merchant scales with map size, game speed, etc? Directly comparing output from a merchant mission for different games probably isn't that valuable. My best is probably only something like 2300

 

[BufordTJustice]

[...] commerce (cottage over some farms) [...]

Absolutely agree with your post, but does it make sense to start a cottage at the time coprorations become available?

 

[adrianj]

Absolutely agree with your post, but does it make sense to start a cottage at the time coprorations become available?

Meh, probably not, just thought I'd throw it in there
I guess the cottages could become useful in double quick time if you're running emancipation, and even then it would still only really make sense with cities that can efficiently convert the commerce into /.
Otherwise you're likely better off with workshops and building research/wealth, in which case you'd be better off with Caste System if you can afford the unhappiness.

Everything is situational

 

[Sisiutil]

Oh, there's synergy. It takes ages to build, and with IW it takes less time

He did say "if he's considering corporations". Meaning he will found the corpos in this city. Obviously if you have a huge shrine then WS goes there, but it's not too common (on the high levels, where founding religions is stupid). Running merchants without Repr is very overrated and you are probably in US at this point.

Well, first off, I almost never found religions, but I will happily conquer holy cities and later build Wall Street there.

Second, yes, the IW will help build WS faster, but so what? My IW city inevitably becomes my late-game unit/wonder/SS part pump. So it isn't working cottages (its citizens work watermills, mines, and workshops instead) and it isn't running merchant specialists (rather, engineers)--which are things your WS city should be doing.

So with all due respect, putting IW and WS in the same city is counter-productive and I wouldn't recommend it.

 

[Silu]

Well, first off, I almost never found religions, but I will happily conquer holy cities and later build Wall Street there.

Second, yes, the IW will help build WS faster, but so what? My IW city inevitably becomes my late-game unit/wonder/SS part pump. So it isn't working cottages (its citizens work watermills, mines, and workshops instead) and it isn't running merchant specialists (rather, engineers)--which are things your WS city should be doing.

So with all due respect, putting IW and WS in the same city is counter-productive and I wouldn't recommend it.

I didn't mean I actively seek to build the two in the same city. Just that it's a pretty common lategame scenario to not have any shrines, plan on founding corporations, and just wanting to throw WS somewhere to benefit from the HQ income. In the IW city (or any good production city) it's fast to build both WS and executives. It's also a common scenario for WS to be pretty useless outside from direct gold income, if you're running a high slider then doesn't do much good, and in the late game working towns rivals running merchants well enough for me to not actively seek to build it in a food-rich merchant farm.

The "Condensed tips for beginners" jist behind all this is to avoid the "perfect city syndrome" - going out of one's way to combine those perfect National Wonder combos with those other perceived favorable conditions. A WS city with shrine(s), corporations and running max merchants is one such utopia. While it's very good when set up properly, trying to set it up can be detrimental and less "ideal" choices could be better under certain circumstances.

A simpler example is the "perfect military city", which many want to force-build as the HE+WP combo at the first opportunity, even when building units instead of WP would be much better for one's situation. Another commonly seen example is the GP farm. I used to always aim getting one with tons of food and the NE very fast, usually swapping to Caste System early to maximize that Perfect City -ideal (when Slavery would have been much superior overall). Wasn't until quite a bit later I realized that while these Perfect Cities look cool and all, they might actually be bad idea sometimes.

In a nutshell: Having perfect model cities doesn't necessarily mean the empire is perfect.

 

[shpeka]

First of all - Nice to meet you everyone. I am glad to have found such an active civ community.

I have been lurking around for the past couple of years but it was only recently that I gave Civ IV a serious try.

Anyway - to the point. I am trying to understand the mechanics of healing, i.e. healing time in city, outside a city and inside enemy cultural border, as well as the effect of the % modifier (healing units) and the meaning of the "heal while moving" upgrade.

Thanks in advance, I hope to see you soon in the Immortal University, if/when I feel confident enough.

EDIT: Found http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=157954&highlight=Healing. RTFM FTW...

 

[fichot_c4]

I'm guessing the value from a merchant scales with map size, game speed, etc? Directly comparing output from a merchant mission for different games probably isn't that valuable. My best is probably only something like 2300

I always play marathon on huge maps. And the chosen city (size:20) was ~18 turns away with a galleon.

Thanks on the info on corps.

Silu, you too for the spies.

 

[Sicky]

I have a question:
How early should the first Settler be produced?
Or
When I have just founded my capital, what should I start producing, and in which order? (apart from the obvious worker)

And then something a little off-topic:
I only have the standard Civ4. A few days ago, I noticed I could get Beyond the Sword and Warlords expansions, only 6 euros each. What do you think, should I get them?

 

[Silu]

I have a question:
How early should the first Settler be produced?
Or
When I have just founded my capital, what should I start producing, and in which order? (apart from the obvious worker)

And then something a little off-topic:
I only have the standard Civ4. A few days ago, I noticed I could get Beyond the Sword and Warlords expansions, only 6 euros each. What do you think, should I get them?

There's no single best build order, but the most usual one is

1. Worker
2. Warriors while growing to size 2-4 (depending on how many good tiles there are to work)
3. Settler or Worker->Settler

Definitely get Beyond the Sword. It drastically improves the game, and has all the content (except some scenarios) of Warlords, so you don't really need Warlords.

 

[kcd_swede]

I have a question:
How early should the first Settler be produced?
Or
When I have just founded my capital, what should I start producing, and in which order? (apart from the obvious worker)

And then something a little off-topic:
I only have the standard Civ4. A few days ago, I noticed I could get Beyond the Sword and Warlords expansions, only 6 euros each. What do you think, should I get them?

Its not possible to have a build order that is optimum for every start and every situation and every difficulty setting. Usually it is good to get food resources going asap, and sometimes that means workboat first.

Of course, some people will tell you worker>worker>warrior is always the superior, but I almost never build a second worker (or a settler) at size 1.

6€: BtS worth it, Warlords not (unless you can't get BtS). imho

 

[Sicky]

There's no single best build order, but the most usual one is

1. Worker
2. Warriors while growing to size 2-4 (depending on how many good tiles there are to work)
3. Settler or Worker->Settler

Definitely get Beyond the Sword. It drastically improves the game, and has all the content (except some scenarios) of Warlords, so you don't really need Warlords.

Ok, thanks a lot.
Hmm... I just might get BtS

 

[TheLazyHase]

Tips : barbarian city are usually played smarter than AI cities.

I just had 2 maceman destroyed because the 4 longbows and 2 warrior in here decide to attack. I never, ever seen the AI cities do something as smart as that.

 

[Sisiutil]

Tips : barbarian city are usually played smarter than AI cities.

I just had 2 maceman destroyed because the 4 longbows and 2 warrior in here decide to attack. I never, ever seen the AI cities do something as smart as that.

I don't know the inner mechanics of it, but I agree that the barbarians seem more inclined than rival civs to take bigger risks.

 

[Silu]

There's a property for each leader called "attack courage", which determines how much risks they are willing to take when fighting (Nappy and Ragnar are the craziest). Barbarians don't have the same concept, so they never chicken out and willingly attack a Modern Armor with Warriors.

 

[Rooftrellen]

One very important tip, or something I have found to be important, anyway.

Get astronomy and chemistry early! Priviteers in pairs can ward off any lesser ships, even if they attack by the boatload (bad pun) and their ability to blockade does a great job of denying important money to your enemies and really helping you out in any way you might choose to spend some extra income.

 

[god056]

How do you do a blockade? Is it just putting in your ships into enemy coastal cities?

 

[Shafi]

How do you do a blockade? Is it just putting in your ships into enemy coastal cities?

you put your ship on an enemy coastal tile near their cities and then select the blockade action for that unit. (just like you would select fortify or patrol options for other units)

 

[kcd_swede]

How do you do a blockade? Is it just putting in your ships into enemy coastal cities?

No, you put the ship on an ocean or coastal tile (as close to opponet's city as you can is most effective) click the icon that looks like a cannon. Starting next turn, all tiles within a certain radius will be denied to the oponent: this means that no trade route that relies on these squares will work, none of these tiles can be worked by citizens of the city (if lots of seafood, they usually start starving), and you can gain some loot every turn (somewhat random whether and how much you get).

Note, blockade option is only available in the Beyond the Sword expansion.