Discussion in 'All Other Games' started by SouthernKing, Nov 10, 2011.
Excellent updates! Makes me wish I'd conquered more of the steppe.
The result of invading the Aztec conquests, then being guardian to the heirs of the empire...
1118, eh? Have the Knights Templar been founded yet?
Managed to get going in the end.
So for like 4 generations I had no progress. I had schemes to inherit a couple of counties but those went nowhere. But from the third generation on I had the hellene secret society running, and it got almost 100 members in the end. But with the fifth guy I got stuff running with a bunch of merceneries I was able to declere independence from the duke of Hellas (in 769 Byzantium controls only one county in the duchy of Hellas. The emperor had then essensially no other choice but to grant it to me as a viceroyality, but I lost it when more de jure territory was conquered) (also that's why he got known as "the traitor") and got my wife to be duchess of Achea.
In the end the only part of that that mattered was getting to become a direct vassal of the emperor though (at one point I was the vassal of a duchess that was a vassal to the king of Trebizond, so many steps away from the emperor). When I noticed the emperor had secretly converted to hellenic, I decided to openly adopt the religion. With that I guess I got a lot of popularity, and with only a few bribes I became the leading choice to inherit the empire. I didn't waste time and got the emperor assassinated and inhereted the empire. At the same time, the Abbasids collapsed due to decadense.
I then started to reconquer a lot of land (the previous emperors had even managed to lose Constaninopel) and revoked territories where I could, and placed relatives there to ensure that no matter who got elected it would probably be someone in my dynasty. I got a long way, but in the end there was a massive "overthrow ruler" revolt. I then decided to give in to that, because that just makes me play as my heir.
However then, there was a slowpox epidemic and I didn't get to shut the gates. The prompt said I couldn't do it while doing special activities, which I mean I wasn't doing, but I ended up dying shortly after that. I had managed to get the Traitor to be elected heir, but he suffered the same problems and also died of slowpox soon after (he also ended up getting morbidly obese (in general I've had a lot of fat characters this game, but only like a couple in the zun game)).
Now was the problem: even though a lot of people had converted to hellenic, not everyone had. And this new guy I got was Iconoclastic. I sort of ragequitted then (again not seriously, I had played for several hours and felt like taking a break anyway). I'm conflicted on whether to try and restore a savegame, or kill my wife, get a hellenic one, and use that to convert to hellenism.
Also I've never had the imperial diadem. I've found some guy in the realm has it, related to one of the previous emperors. I've wanted to try and get it, but I've not prioritised it and have focused on warring and installing family members to titles instead.
Also made a stupid custom family seal because I only started with a generic one (unlike for example the zunbils who get a unique one)
however, more important than any of that is that the duke of Abkazia identifies as a horse
(I've gotten about all of Anatolia since this screenshot was taken)
48 years for one basileus and then three in the the space of 15 months? That really is some next-level Byzantine shenanigans.
Polykarpos the Traitor was just a count the first 30 years of his adult life, so it's not as janky as it seems
anyway I did end up reloading and changing a bit:
Being forced to abdicate and then rewin the throne is now my new favourite thing lol
anyway you can see I got the huge country of Serbia that used to be north of me. That was a bit unexpected, because I simply used the "take an entire de jure duchy" casus belli, but apparantly that makes the holders in that duchy your vassal if possible, and it was, since I was an emperor and he only a king. So half the country is now tengri.
Unfourtunatelty, Hellenism doesn't get holy war casus belli, so I can only take one province at a time through war. I've been trying to favour invite claimants, but haven't had any luck with that so far. This has been an issue with trying to reach 50 % religious unity, because Alexandria is far away. Also I've gotten religious unity malus because of raiders looting temples at the edge of the empire, which I hardly notice when are around.
Additionally, after all this time, I've only managed to convert a single province to hellenism. Not sure how to get better at that. With religious reformation I did cosmopolitan nature last time, but managed to convert so little, that I'm thinking about doing maybe prozelytising this time.
In neater news though, Polykarpos the Bone-Squeezer created the olympian fighters society, so that was cool.
Anyway this kid is the son of a horse mayor:
I've unfourtunately not been so dilligent in trying to preserve the horse culture that was beginning to form in Georgia. I think Only one province is ruled by a man with horse culture at this point.
Manx has destroyed Byzantium.
By that mean the Forth Crusade happened.
It ended with my then Emperor's sister being granted the throne of the newly forged Latin Empire.
Gogoniant i Dŷ Manaw!
Bill the Pony's father was culturally a horse, I don't know how Bill the Pony became georgian, though
A real horse lord, eh?
Unfourtunately I think this was the last of the georgian horse lords
Anyway I've now reformed Hellenism. I get heir designation, but the imperial elective overrides that. Also the pontifex maximus title is kingdom-tier, which goes to my son no matter if I get another one of my dynasty to be successor. I can try changing the pontifex maximus to imperial elective too (haven't done so so far because I've been at war) or work around it by granting it as viceroyality to some old dude when I get old, but all that would've been avoided if it was duchy-tier instead
the guy I'm in that screenshot was a fairly distant relative I chose to get elected only because he had managed to get the imperial diadem in his inventory
eh I'll screenshot this too. He looks pretty neat with the pontificial scepter
Ended up giving the Pontificial College to my chosen successor, which for most of Kyros' life was the eldest son, but I changed it to another one, because he got a weak claim on the holy roman empire (which is about the best I could do.
Also got to restore the Roman Empire
Annoyingly that makes the imperial diadem unusable
Also created the stoic intelligensia (so roman culture will appear soon) and burned down all the churches in Rome
Anyway, a tip from me I guess: There're two ways to convert to hellenism. The first, like I did, involve holding one of the holy sites, delving into the classics and then secretly converting to hellenism. You'll then have to secretly spread the religion, and work from 0 % moral authority and upwards.
The other is that you get the option tio convert when you restore the roman empire. I'd recommend doing this instead, because then you'll have all the holy sites, and get to reform hellenism immidiatly (more or less, I reckon). I think this is the better choice, because unreformed hellenism is really weak, you don't get holy war casus belli, and can't demand conversion (reformed hellenism gives you both of these (unless you choose peaceful or cosmopolitan nature, maybe)). So use the more powerful orthodox religion until then.
Also horse lords dissapeared from Georgia, but reemerged in Serbia
I know it all is less impressive than my last game, but I've kinda checklisted world conquest now. And it might still happen, because I'm working to get my children claims on the huge hispanic empire
Time for a screenshot of my Horse Lord game! I'm still a human - the same human - but my horses are conquering the steppe!
I am the Yabguid clan of the Oghuz Turks, in central Asia. It may not look like a ton yet, but we've gone from four provinces to the mid-20's in the current Khagan's lifetime. I'm currently expanding in almost every direction except northeast, where the Uyghurs have conveniently made all their neighbors other than China tributaries, rendering themselves a non-threat. I'm currently adding a province at the time while awaiting a big opportunity - perhaps the Khazars (suzerains of the Byzantines), perhaps Tibet, perhaps even the Abbasids if they continue to run into internal difficulties. But those provinces are adding up.
I find being a Horse Lord to be a fairly good life. Lots of quick wars, no complaints from vassals about levies being raised, and relatively quick recovery after missteps. Gold is plentiful through pillaging, if rare within the empire - only recently have I started accumulating settled vassals for a more steady supply of gold.
In the greater world, the big news is the Magyars settling down as Vitebsk, and, hot off the parchment, a newly-converted-to-Islam warlord conquering Pannonia on Christmas Day, 808, after the failure of the Catholic Bavarians to do so earlier in the same year. None of the Pannonian provinces are Muslim - the vast majority are either Slavic or Tengrii - so it's hard to say whether it will last, but it certainly introduces an interesting religious variable into the picture in Europe.
It seems pretty good considering how little time has passed
I tried playing nomads a couple of times, but couldn't really get into it. One pretty annoying thing was the fact that you only get the good casus bellis when you get so and so much population, and it's hard to get to that point without those casus bellis.
Anyway I ressurected roman culture:
However I am a bit tired. I'm over the vassall limit after taking over HRE, even though it was hardly more than France, and I've given out as many viceroyalities as I can
And even though I've got like 9 children with claims on Hispania (although all daughters, my one son died) and a vassal with claims on all the Muhallabid kingdoms, I'm kinda tired of dealing with it all
started a bit as doge of venice in 1066, but felt kinda like nothing really happened there (little room to do stuff, and hard to seize other's tradeposts)
so I dunno, maybe I should just take a break from the game. It's kinda annoying how the game is kind of a rush when things go well, but a drag when thing doesn't
Yeah, I've only been using the one-province-at-a-time CBs, because of the pop requirements. I am starting to approach the 30K Invasion casus belli as my max pop, but it requires quite a few good provinces, and it takes time to acquire those.
It's kind of funny how you have such a large empire, but due to the vassal limit can only raise about 7000-8000 troops. But I know what you mean about becoming tired of it all after awhile; I've never finished a game due to that.
Update: Conquered four more provinces around (and including) Samarkand in the next four and a half years. I now have two horde armies raised at the same time! I like how as a horde, I can just invade whoever I want without having to fabricate claims first; it makes expansion speedy, and it not only doesn't cost anything, but is profitable. I have 1500 - 2000 gold stored up, even after continual upgrades to our capital and spending several hundred on a couple core heavy cavalry brigades for my shiny new army.
I'm running out of small neighbors, though, so Khagan Dogan is considering a large war. Will it be against the Tibetans, who have a moderate-sized army, but enough gold to hire quite a few mercenaries; the Taids in Persia who are weak, but tributaries of the powerful Abbasids, who in turn are fighting a defensive Holy War near Armenia; or Bashkiria, who along with their overlord Khazars are locked in a large and bloody war with the Uyghurs, but still have many troops? Or perhaps we shall bide our time a bit longer and expand against the northern Caspian against our remaining weak neighbor.
Pannonia continues to be a hotspot; they've repulsed another Bavarian invasion, but are fighting an indecisive defensive war against Saxony, and the Chieftess of Poland just declared war along with her husband the Chief of Slavonia. And to top it off, their conquering Islamic King died a natural death at 61, leaving his teenage grandson in charge; if it weren't for the Defending Against Foreigners bonus, there may well be civil wars, and some of the vassals are quite unhappy nonetheless. And there are civil wars in Byzantium, which appear likely to succeed and could call the Khazar tribute into question.
It would perhaps trivialise the game a bit, but I'm considering turning off vassall limit in future games.
I've already changed to very easy, turned off defensive pacts and shattered retreat (although that one I maybe should turn back on), so it's not really that huge step
should probably have mentioned turning off defensive pacts when I posted the Ming empire. Maybe I did and just forgot. Anyway that's like something I've hated ever since it came out, but at the same time as that was introduced they started to let you decide what game rules to play with, so.
Also @Quintillus you probably already know but I think that even as a horde you can build silk road tradeposts if you're concerned with getting steady income.
That's honestly what's bothered me a lot with playing hordes or vikings. Having to go out and do stuff to get money instead of just generating it
I also have defensive pacts turned off. I started playing back in the 1.x days, and to me it always seemed like a feature that was backported from EUIV for multiplayer balance purposes, rather than one that made sense in the timeframe. After all, the main "defensive pacts" - nearby nations of the same faith having the option to join defensive holy wars - has always been in the game, and I have a hard time thinking of other good examples from the time period. Even when the Mongols invaded it was not common for former enemies to band together against them.
The main other deviation I have from the base rules (I have Shattered Retreat on; I have mixed feelings on it but prefer it to EU3-style ping-pong) is that humiliation/torture/poetry no longer auto-frees prisoners. Again that rule was not present in early versions of CKII, and I have a hard time reconciling it with the time period. But as <s>Khal Drogo</s> Khagan Drogan is a kind Khagan, the modus operandi with prisoners so far has been pretty humane, and centered around collecting ransom.
I did recently discover Silk Road tradeposts! I just conquered one in Samarkand, and also have started building Yams in my capital. So that's a nice income boost. I've also kept one settled province as a vassal rather than razing it, to help with the long-term income problem. I suspect as I go into the Middle East, India, or the Caucasus, I'll start keeping a higher proportion of settled provinces as-is.
Lack of ability to land a claimant + press claim is one of the drawbacks hordes have.
I was able to get the White Hun achievement. I didn't change any game rules other than disabling defensive pacts, as it usually just winds up as a wait fest. Beating western protectorate for required land with China throwing 150k attrition-less troops in my face was unpleasant but I managed. Fighting off the Seljuks was very easy.
Doing a House Blackfyre run on A Game of Thrones mod for Crusader Kings 2, starting as Daemon during hte Blackfyre rebellion which ended up through my run succeeding with Daemon the Dragon becoming King of the Seven Kingdoms: currently on a regency as a child queen after the grandson of Daemon died at sea, while his father was killed by his brother via dual. The queen I am is the second one; sadly the elder one was assassinated by unknown forces.
I'm playing with some nefarious mods and gamerules that make things relatively eay for me. For the most part I could have gotten to the same territorial extent except turning off vassal limits, that's the biggest thing
You can get more vassal limit via tech. Can hold the entire old world by using king viceroyalties, later giving multiple kingdoms to one guy so he counts as only 1 vassal. Even w/o special tricks your retinues and such are too much for rebellion by then.
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