CTR1 -- Jump Without Looking (the Deity Virgin Sacrifice)

looking at the turn list, this is my ... gulp ... GOT IT post :-O

I'm going to quickly review the game post of up to tomorrow this time (23:30 local, 21:30 GMT), and base my turn on that.

I will be looking to move back to warriors - I've read that the AI bases strength on a formula that effectively means that while 1 spearman may = 2 warriors, as soon as you lose 1 spear, you take a double knock. Also, let's face it, we can get warriors out there faster for exploring/ escorting.

I will try to focus on city building. I too like the DARK BLUE and DARK GREEN spots, and given SIRP's comments, I agree with Shard - let's go 1 N of the orange (and hope that equates to make up for the close BG we lose out on. The Orange+1 city will build temple ASAP to build a cultural growth and bulwark against the expansionist Amer's.

More later, before I start tomorrow.

Ciao
 
OK Good luck Wanderer. No-one seems to have commented on trading so here is my POV:

When you load the game up get writing of the Indians for our two techs and the 60gold. Then buy either horseback riding or mysticism from France (Your call, mysticism would be good so we could try and get polytheism in 40 turns, but hb riding would offer us horsemen). Keep on checking for possible trades and check domestic advisor every turn to try and stop riots :) Good luck
 
On the trading, yes buy as much as you can, it's what we've been saving up for :).
I've seen that there are some good opportunities (sp?) since the sciences don't overlap too much yet.
The additional bonus is when we have gpt deals in place, the AI will have one less incentive to go to war against us.
With all the river tiles we should be able to generate a good income.
 
You may be able to sell contact with the Indians to France if you get writing b4 the americans. Since the french will get that contact pretty quick anyway you may as well sell it to them for what you can get. You might be surprised.

IMHO we need only make settlers in the capital. We need only make workers in second city for at least 3 cycles, and we need a temple in the horses city. If the horses city (which you will found on your turn) gets to pop 2, whip the temple immediately as per Sirps recommendation.

You can't go wrong Wanderer, easy peasy japanesy. ;)
 
I agree with the trading comments - they were my thought's when I saw the last turn.

Mad ? Can't go wrong --- yeah well, that what I thought in GOTM 19 (still playing), and now suddenly egypt are 4 tech's ahead! *sigh*

I will post when I'm done.

CiaO
 
Hmm:

Open game. Change Osaka from Spear to Warrior. down from 8 turns to 3. Look at cities, not much MM I can do there. Need more workers for improving all those lovely flood plains outside Osaka.

Trades: DAMN - I've heard of this elsewhere. You save a game, and when the next guys loads it, it's like the computer gets a free "trading turn". America having writing, Philosophy and HBR. France have writing and HBR. India have writing. Fortunately, India don't have iron and whell - but the other's do. That means contacts we can forget about! Also, we can sell writing on. I can (and will) trade writing and 65 G for IW and wheel.

TR: IW & Wheel from INDIA for WRITING and 65G.

America won't sell philosophy (the only thing they have that no-one else has) so I can't get a bargain there. I can get Myst from Joan for 97G or HBR for 119G. Given that we may well want Monarchy, but since we aren't going to "pointy stick", and HBR is a dead end, I'll leave that for now.

TR: MYSTI from FRANCE for 97G

I could trade Myst with India for 2G (all they have). I will wait and check every turn.
I could trade HBR with France for 83 G and +2 GPT. leaving us with no income and 5 GP in the bank. I don't think so. Mistake ?

As I thought - no contact trading possible any more.

Set Science for Polytheism (40)

END pre-turn (2190 bc)

Turn 1 (2150 bc)

Stand spear. before turn, barb moved next to spear and city(osaka). Since this is Civ 3 1.29 - let stupid barb kill himself next turn.
Move injured war (East most war) West1.
move North warrior north 1.

Check Tading:

India has 27 g, and HBR! How'd they do that- they had 2 G and no tech last turn ! Anyway, good for ys. They don't have Myst, and will trade for HBR for Mysti and 34 G.

TR : HBR from INDIA for MYST and 34G.

We have tech equal with france (55G in bank), india (61 G in bank). Amer have Philo above us and 240G in bank. We have 56 G in bank. France and India polite, Amer annoyed ! (they were last turn as well).

Turn 2 (2110 bc)

IBT : Barb dies against Osaka.

Kyoto builds settler. Set Kyoto to build next settler. Will review MM end of turn.

Move East-War South 1. He will heal next turn.
Move North-war north 1 - france had moved war onto mount! See Karachi - indian city. Will move out of their border next turn.
Since barb dead- move spear East 1, just in case some resource appears, before I decide on moving settler. Nothing special.

Choices choices... 2 of the cities sites are 3 moves away, the other is 4. I can get next to wheat in 3, and wheat will speed growth there, since it is on river, and will be immediately irri'able. But I worry about america's rapid expansion, and wonder if the "Sirp" horse city isn't a better strategic move. Since it looks like I can MM to get next settler from Kyoto in 4 turns, I will go with the one I *think* is strategic.

slider : shift lux to 10%. now 1.8.1. Poly in 38, +6 gpt.

MM : Hmm - decide to move from flood plain to forest. this moves from grow in 2 and settler in 5 to grow in 3, sett in 4.

turn 3 (2070 bc)

IBT: Amer pop hut north of Osaka. No barb's - I'll check to see if he go a tech.

Osaka builds warrior - he'll join settler. Hmmm Build a bit difficult. Currently, to grow in 7. worker would take 5, settler 15. I set to worker- the only extra shields we can get are from those shared with Kyoto.

Worker finishes irrigating flood plains, starts road.

Spear SE1- nothing exciting.

East-war heals.

North-war SE (exit india) onto Mount top.

Settler moves1 NW, will reach site next turn, build the turn after.

Look at MM - should be able to get worker in 4, with no wasted shields.

Amer got LIT !! They have lit and Philo. We have tech equal with rest. Amer have 243 g, we have 64(+7 gpt). They won't trade, even for 64 gp and +7 gpt.

turn 4 : (2030 bc)

IBT : some general moving around.

Settler reacehes site. There are 2 BG N and Nw - that's good. War will reach site next turn, when city built.

North-war goes West, see if there's anyhting "beyond and above" france.
West-War goes West.
Spear goes East- Hmmm - see a deer on forest. Recalling gotm 17 (16?), we should aim to chop and irrigate this ? That was on grasslands, this one is plains.

Kyoto to grow in 1, settler in 2. Must check lux next turn.

nothin new on tech scene or contacts.

turn 5 (1990 bc)

IBT : Americ demands 22 g. We cave , but store in memory bank. He goes from Annoyed to Cautious, but still won't trade.

east-war moves west.
Niorth-war moves west.
War moves to new city site.
settler builds city - Sirp-Orange. We want temple asap, so I've set city onto forest. Moves temple build from 30 to 15, moves growth from 10 to 20. The way I see it : temple costs 30 shields. We can get 1 shield for 10 rounads (10), and then city grows- best improvement in terms of shields, we woould move to 3 hields, and still have 20 required, hence the temple takes 17 turns, as opposed to 15. Chopping would improve either route.

Spear moves west. There is fish near here. Hmmm - I'm beginning to wonder about Dark green city site. If we moves NW 1, the city, after growing, could get wheat, deer and fish. Or should we concentrate on tighter cities, and get antoher city near the other side of the deer ? Dark gree would get fish after growth.

Kyoto grows. shift lux to 20. slider now 7.1.2 We are making +8 gpt, poly in 35. man, this min science feels scary to me!!!

MM Osaka, shift flood plains to forest, improves woker from 5 turns to 4.
MM Kyoto - push extra food from available flood plain to granary - settler build in 1 either way.

No new tech or contacts avail. still have tech equal, except Amer.


turn 6 (1950 bc)

IBT : nothing

Kyoto builds settler. Don't think any amount of MM will get next settler out in 4, we will have to use 5 turns. Based on that, I leave using flood plain so we grow 1 faster , and our shield for settler should be closer to optimal (4+4+6+8+8 = 30, that means fp, fp, grow, add forest, move fp to another forest for last 2 turns).

Osaka worker in 1.

Set current worker to move to FP - next turn to start on irri next FP.

East-war moves West - sees amer scout.
North-war moves south onto hill - nothing
Spear moves East - we notice in area above 4 dyes, there is both Iron!!! and cow. seriously need to grab that site!

Looking at next city site ? Dark blue or Dark Green ? Dark blue would "pop" hut, but since I see 2 french warriors beelining for it, and they'll get there in 4 turn, whereas it will tkae 5 turns to build city, they will beat us. and the last thiung I want is an undefended settler having barb's popped next to him. I'm going for dark green, aftger deciding re: deer etc.

Settler moves SE 1.

close one- Kyoto built settler, so is smaller. decrease lux to 0. will need to up in 2 turns when kyoto grows. slider in 9.1.0 64 G, +9 gpt.

turn 7 (1910 bc)

IBT : nothing - but french are heading to huts.

Osak builds worker. We can get a worker to wheat in 4 turns, so I've sent him there.

Set "old" worker to irri flood plains.
Move settler East - closer to dark green.

move north-war west.
move east-war west.
move spear NE.

MM Kyoto - since it will grow in 1 turn, should I get the extra shields, as extra food doesn't "carry over" when growing, or does it? I decide to stick to plan so don't change it.

Tech and contacts - nothing new, but france and inda have more money - must have popped money huts/ barb settle's.

turn 8 (1870 bc)

IBT : nothing

North-war west.
East-war west- finds lake/coastline.
Spear east.

shift lux to 10% - kyoto now size 4. shields for this turn will be 6.

move settler to dark green site.

no new tech or contacts.

turn 9 ( 1830 bc)

IBT: nothing.

Dark-Green founded. Bonus! we will have an extra fish after expanding! Set to build warrior- but someone may want to change that to temple to grow asap ?

North-war west- finds coastline.
East-war south, sees pink border. they're far from home ? Popped hut ?
Spear mvoes to mount nort - see more coast, and another deer and fish. looks like coast goes round corner here - we want to try and makes this ours, I think.

MM Kyoto - move FP to forest to speed up settler grow from 3 to 2 turns.

no new contacts or real cahnge in tech status - still won't trade (try ever turn).

turn 10 ( 1790bc)

IBT: nothing- apologies - looks like I was wrong about french going to pop hut near dark blue.

Spear north.
North-war south
East-wat NW 1.
worker reaches wheat - I think he should irri

MM Kyoto - forest to FP = settler in 1 , grow in 1 :)

NOTHING NEW on tech scene BUT GIVEN WHAT HAPPENED MY TURN, next player review tech more end turn! maybe they trade out, and we can trade.

Hope I didn't mess up too bad. I felt I had good reasons to go for Dark green before dark blue site.

CiaO

save game here :

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads4/CTR1--1790_BC.SAV
 
Good turn Wanderer. Just one thing though, weren't we going to found one square north of the orange dot and then whip a temple out? We will probably need to whip a temple now anyway to try and stop America flipping our city. Good trading early on, maybe I should have done the trades before saving, but anyway I live and learn.

We look like we might still be alive to see Jesus' birth :) (0AD)
 
Earp is Up, Infoman on deck

I'll need to take a look at the save, tho, before commenting :)
 
I've got it. I'll play tomorrow evening. I want to review what has been done so far and get suggestions on our next course of action before starting.
 
@Wanderer: Good turns, Sid even says we're advanced! So, min-science has worked so far :).
Regarding the hut: it is quite possible the hut is already taken but we still see it because we didn't come near it anymore.
Point for the next leader: if we want to whip Sirp-orange we need to MM it for food, it could grow in 8 when we do so.
 
I have had an unexpected emergency come up with my job and I have to go out of town for a few days. :( Please skip me this turn and hopefully I'll be back by the time my turn comes up again.
 
I am up in three different SG's . I will try and play and post my turns before Sunday. Sorry for any delay.
 
@shard - I think sirp-orange is 1 N of orange dot - per my understanding anyway. Looking at the BG N and NW, I thik it is in the right place ... but please comment guys - I need to learn what I could have done better, and what I did wrong.

ciao
 
Ah Ok Wanderer, I haven't actually looked at the save so I didn't realise what you meant by Sirp-orange :). In that case it is in a good position. If you want me to I will load it up and make a few comments however they would most likely be wrong as I am no more experienced than you when it comes to Civ :)
 
I welcome any input. Escpecially regard the reasoning to go Dark Green before Dark Blue (site locations), builds orders etc. For example, I'm a tad concerned that Osak is down to size 1. Should we be trying to get it to 3 and then pump workers, trying to maintain size 2 to 3, or not ? An advantage of size 1 to 2 is the lower impact of unhappiness. If we want SOaka, with it's FP's, to be a worker/settler factory, shouldn't we get a granary there ?

Are people happy with me pushing to Monarchy? I figured america was on it's way to republic, so we'd better go the other way...

Should I have sent the worker 4 moves from Osaka to the wheat outside Dark-Green, or rather "worked" his way there ? I figured we wanted the improved wheat asap to speed the city growth.

Other things ? Did I make a mistake in the directions I sent out Wandering Warriors ?

CiaO
 
trying to attach a dot map:

1790_bc_dot_map.JPG


the "pink" are areas I think we need to try and ensure we get. Of the two pink "spots" NW, I think 2 is probably better, to try and get a larger font, but we don't know if that will reach that lake and "seal" the line. It also means wider city spacing, something I think we want to avoid ??

CiaO
 
We might also want to try and grab those Gems in the jungle too. They will help our own happiness and they are a useful bargaining chip with the AI.

For example, I'm a tad concerned that Osaka is down to size 1. Should we be trying to get it to 3 and then pump workers, trying to maintain size 2 to 3, or not ? An advantage of size 1 to 2 is the lower impact of unhappiness. If we want SOaka, with it's FP's, to be a worker/settler factory, shouldn't we get a granary there ?

I would like it to have a granary if it is going to be a settler/worker factory, and I think size 1 is probably too low. It will be far more efficient if it is bigger.


Are people happy with me pushing to Monarchy? I figured america was on it's way to republic, so we'd better go the other way...

I'm not sure this will really matter, we will probably have to buy techs anyway, but it sounds like the best thing to do. I doubt we will beat any of the AI to Monarchy but we may as well try :) (at min science of course.

Should I have sent the worker 4 moves from Osaka to the wheat outside Dark-Green, or rather "worked" his way there ? I figured we wanted the improved wheat asap to speed the city growth.

This seems fine to me, he can work his way back with roads at least sound that it is connected to the rest of the cities, but going for growth first sounds like the right thing to do.
 
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