I am on that side that strongly prefers post flight CV (and suprisingly, beelined flight is not such a late tech!) simply because early strong tourism is not always workable and quite RNG. Depends too much on starting position and has a opportunity cost of expansion, which can be a huge price when unexpected war breaks up (or any other factor).
I am aware, there are some civs that CAN do very early tourism victory, but not every game suits it, so it is a restart. And I consider resterted game as LOST game. Restarting because eart goddess was taken counts to me as LOST game. Restarting because Russia, Kongo and Eleonor are as opponents counts to me as LOST game. So in my understanding, I have much bigger chance of winning culture victory with a civ that is fairly good in adapting to most condition and explode tourism a little bit later, than with a civ, that has too many "IFs".
I just see, what shape I am in the start of medieval era (and I play so long even with barb spam pre t15) and evaluate if the game is promising. And because of MY playstyle I can see I am in good / very good shape in nearly every game as Cree (though I would never go for CV as them), and among remaining civs: America, Persia, China, Japan. This four civs, bacuse of the ability to do well in every starting condition with my playstyle are safe in my votes for a long time.
On the other side - "bad shapes" - I have Canada (obvious reason) and suprisingly Greece, mainly because hill bias and disability to grow to more than 2 district slots. I can do great, but most of the greek games are pure restart for me. With Gorgo I always do better. But my undisputed king of "restart, until you found good condition" is Kupe, so again my downvote to Maori (even though it is post-flight civ, still Kupe's post flight has less IMO tourism potential than others)
Kupe -3
Upvote for Persia as a civ which is very stable in my hands. And pairidaezas are not only tourism tool. This UI is worth working (in opposite to sphinx) from the earliest stage of the game, granting (combined with satrapies) significant civic progress and enough gold not to feel the difference, when buying great works early instead of generating GWAMs
Cyrus +1
Catherine/France (Mag) [20]
Cleopatra/Egypt [13]
Cyrus/Persia [18]
Gitarja/Indonesia [4]
Gorgo/Greece [18]
Hojo Tokimune/Japan [10]
Kristina/Sweden [21]
Kupe/Maori [14]
Menelik/Ethiopia [23]
Pericles/Greece [23]
Peter/Russia [22]
Qin Shi Huang/China [25]
Teddy Roosevelt/America (BM) [21]
Wilfrid Laurier/Canada [19]
I am aware, there are some civs that CAN do very early tourism victory, but not every game suits it, so it is a restart. And I consider resterted game as LOST game. Restarting because eart goddess was taken counts to me as LOST game. Restarting because Russia, Kongo and Eleonor are as opponents counts to me as LOST game. So in my understanding, I have much bigger chance of winning culture victory with a civ that is fairly good in adapting to most condition and explode tourism a little bit later, than with a civ, that has too many "IFs".
I just see, what shape I am in the start of medieval era (and I play so long even with barb spam pre t15) and evaluate if the game is promising. And because of MY playstyle I can see I am in good / very good shape in nearly every game as Cree (though I would never go for CV as them), and among remaining civs: America, Persia, China, Japan. This four civs, bacuse of the ability to do well in every starting condition with my playstyle are safe in my votes for a long time.
On the other side - "bad shapes" - I have Canada (obvious reason) and suprisingly Greece, mainly because hill bias and disability to grow to more than 2 district slots. I can do great, but most of the greek games are pure restart for me. With Gorgo I always do better. But my undisputed king of "restart, until you found good condition" is Kupe, so again my downvote to Maori (even though it is post-flight civ, still Kupe's post flight has less IMO tourism potential than others)
Kupe -3
Upvote for Persia as a civ which is very stable in my hands. And pairidaezas are not only tourism tool. This UI is worth working (in opposite to sphinx) from the earliest stage of the game, granting (combined with satrapies) significant civic progress and enough gold not to feel the difference, when buying great works early instead of generating GWAMs
Cyrus +1
Catherine/France (Mag) [20]
Cleopatra/Egypt [13]
Cyrus/Persia [18]
Gitarja/Indonesia [4]
Gorgo/Greece [18]
Hojo Tokimune/Japan [10]
Kristina/Sweden [21]
Kupe/Maori [14]
Menelik/Ethiopia [23]
Pericles/Greece [23]
Peter/Russia [22]
Qin Shi Huang/China [25]
Teddy Roosevelt/America (BM) [21]
Wilfrid Laurier/Canada [19]
Last edited: