Current (SVN) development discussion thread

[Leoreth]

New commit:
- I'm in the middle of the stability rewrite so it's disabled with that revision
- civic adjustments*
- blockade range reduced to 2
- the number of resources that can contribute to corporation yield is capped at 12 per type

*Specific changes:
- Dynasticism happiness cap increased to +4
- Totalitarianism happiness cap reduced to +4
- moved hurrying buildings with gold from Public Welfare to Capitalism
- Industrialism now requires Steel
- Free Market now gives +25% corporation commerce
- moved missionaries without monasteries from OR to Scholasticism
- increased Warrior Code upkeep to low
- Levy Armies now converts food to unit production

(Not sure if I should move +50% improvement speed to Agrarianism now.)

 

[Leoreth]

Another one: all Europeans start with Calendar now.

 

[civ_king]

Another one: all Europeans start with Calendar now.

That's absurd, next thing we know they will also start with monasticism.

 

[Mr_Hobo]

"Free Market now gives +25% corporation commerce"

Meaning yield, correct? Like a 25% increase in science, gold, culture, or production, not actual commerce.

 

[NerfCothons]

(Not sure if I should move +50% improvement speed to Agrarianism now.)

I agree that Agrarianism can't hope to compete with slavery as it is but I don't understand how being an agrarian society improves one's ability to build non-agrarian improvements other than a family-guy-esque reverence for Amish construction abilities (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wKu65rYK_Vk).

Levy armies are now fascinating but might be a touch OP. Perhaps decrease the experience of constructed units.

Environmentalism is such a silly name for a civic, maybe Sustainability? Green? Someone help me out here.

 

[Leoreth]

"Free Market now gives +25% corporation commerce"

Meaning yield, correct? Like a 25% increase in science, gold, culture, or production, not actual commerce.

It means commerce types, i.e. science, gold and culture. Food, production and raw commerce are yield types and not affected by the civic.

I agree that Agrarianism can't hope to compete with slavery as it is but I don't understand how being an agrarian society improves one's ability to build non-agrarian improvements other than a family-guy-esque reverence for Amish construction abilities (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wKu65rYK_Vk).

I can't either, which is why it currently doesn't have the effect.

Levy armies are now fascinating but might be a touch OP. Perhaps decrease the experience of constructed units.

Huh, that's an interesting idea. You would break even combined with Vassalage.

Environmentalism is such a silly name for a civic, maybe Sustainability? Green? Someone help me out here.

Green Economy is the best I can think of ...

 

[NerfCothons]

I can't either, which is why it currently doesn't have the effect.

Maybe +1 hammers for farms. Give players operating in low food environments that need to build farms some hammers to compensate for their inability to whip.

 

[Leoreth]

Instead of the commerce, or on top of it?

 

[NerfCothons]

My instinct is to say instead of, but if it still feels UP with just the hammer, adding the commerce as well still makes sense.

 

[iOnlySignIn]

Huh, that's an interesting idea. You would break even combined with Vassalage.

Agreed. This is a good idea.

I however cannot wait to bring my -2 XP units into battle.

What was the blockade range of naval units previously? Is it possible to give different range to different units?

My instinct is to say instead of, but if it still feels UP with just the hammer, adding the commerce as well still makes sense.

>>> in this game. 1 is equal to at least 2 .

+1 from Farm for Agrarianism would be perfect, IMO.

But I feel Slavery should also give bonus to Quarries and Mines to represent the cheap slave labor there. This is especially relevant in Egypt and Mesopotamia.

 

[Leoreth]

Agreed. This is a good idea.

I however cannot wait to bring my -2 XP units into battle.

Haha, XP are capped at 0 of course, so this would only counter barracks and similar effects.

What was the blockade range of naval units previously? Is it possible to give different range to different units?

Three tiles, and currently it's a global constant.

>>> in this game. 1 is equal to at least 2 .

+1 +1 +1 looks a bit too versatile for my tastes. Especially compared to workshops during the intended era.

Edit: yeah. Slavery already is powerful enough though, from the hurry effect alone. Quarries don't make much of a change but mines would be really strong.

 

[NerfCothons]

+1 commerce for quarries kind of has a historically appropriate feel to it.

 

[iOnlySignIn]

+1 +1 +1 looks a bit too versatile for my tastes. Especially compared to workshops during the intended era.

Agreed. What I meant was +1 +1 only because that 1 extra is already very powerful.

I'm of the opinion that Workshops should never decrease in the first place.

Edit: yeah. Slavery already is powerful enough though, from the hurry effect alone. Quarries don't make much of a change but mines would be really strong.

Still, consider adding +1 for Quarries due to the resource distribution in Egypt and Mesopotamia. Egypt/Babylonia/Arabia need some extra incentive to stay in Slavery given that they are no loaded with Plantations like India and China are.

The hurry effect can be balanced with an improved, reasonable Slave Revolt mechanics (one that only triggers when you hurry too much).

 

[NerfCothons]

The hurry effect can be balanced with an improved, reasonable Slave Revolt mechanics (one that only triggers when you hurry too much).

Aren't those annoying slave revolt events already tied to the civic? Just monkey with their chance of occurring or if possible increase the chance of slave revolts the more you whip.

 

[Leoreth]

Yeah, I think that's a good way to counterbalance it. Event redesign is on my to do list anyway so I'll make sure to give slave revolts etc. some harsh effects.

 

[iOnlySignIn]

Aren't those annoying slave revolt events already tied to the civic?

Yeah, but the problem now is they occur even if you've never whipped anything ever and your approval rating is over 70%.

Which is the main reason I usually don't bother with Slavery.

 

[NerfCothons]

Yeah, but the problem now is they occur even if you've never whipped anything ever and your approval rating is over 70%.

Which is the main reason I usually don't bother with Slavery.

Just running the civic means your society still has slaves even if you've never worked them to death. People just want to be free man :deep inhale:

 

[Cosmos1985]

In 600 AD starts, Vikings have Warrior Code as Civic, but not the pre-req. tech Horseback Riding. Also, turns out I was wrong about Warrior Code; it does indeed provide the double speed of barracks, the text is just red when you see the tooltip in the city screen - like when a wonder can be built at double speed with a resource, but you don't have it. So it appears to not provide the intended effect, but it DOES do that.

 

[BenZL43]

Another one: all Europeans start with Calendar now.

every civilization that spawns after Islam is founded should.

 

[Tigranes]

Sometimes AI does unusual things

But moving the capital is strictly tied to that 1 tile north. However, as you can see game still call that unusual city Carthage! Perhaps any city founded in Tunisia must move capital there?