Deity cookbook I: Gilgamesh from Sumeria

[Turinturambar]

But i frown on the GA, i don't understand why you would do this and i think it hurts.

The reasoning behind the GA was to get into the tech race again from the commerce boost, because I desperately need currency and calendar and to make the switch to monarchy/org religion without anarchy. It was not a great option, but I think it was still sound play once the prophet was generated.

I had counted on getting monotheism in a trade from someone in time, but that did not work out.

 

[Dirk1302]

Edit: Crossed Turin's post and altered the contents to include his vote and the consequences

Votes i have now

silverbullet
----------
1) ABigCivFan 3
2) Dirk 2
3) CellKu 1

CellKu
------
1. ABCF - 3 pts
2. Dirk - 2 pt
3 Shyuhe 1

King Morgan
------------
1. ABCF - 3 pts
2. Dirk - 2 pt
3 CellKu 1 pt

Earthling
--------
Dirk 3
ABigCivFan 2
Snaaty 1

ABigCivFan
-----------
dirk 3
Shyuhe 2
Turin 1

RRRaskolnikov
-------------
ABC 3
CellKu 2
Dirk 1

Dirk
----
ABigCivFan 3
Cellku 2
Earthling 1

Turinturambar
-------------
ABigCivFan 3
CellKu 2
Dirk 1


Totals now:
ABigCivFan 20
Dirk 14
CellKu 8
Snaaty 3
Shyuhe 3
Turin 1
Earthling 1

Gliese and Snaaty won't vote this round.

CellKu and Earthling have to redo their vote but it doesn't really matter:
ABigCivFan has won the round

Did i miss someone? Since it's certain that ABigCivFan will win this round i'd like to open the next playing round asap instead of tomorrow night to save time and to help players pressed for time. I have all the votes i need and the winner's certain.

But put in an objection to this idea if you'd like to vote/alter your vote but haven't the time today to look at the various saves (or have other reasons why this is a bad idea that i haven't thought of).

If there aren't objections tonight and things don't alter i'll close the voting and open the next round end of tonight.

 

[CellKu]

Dirk1302, I adjust my vote as follows:

1. ABCF - 3pts
2. Dirk1302 - 2 pts
3. shyuhe - 1 pt

 

[Turinturambar]

My vote is buried at the bottom of the previous page.
I have already played ABiGCiVFan's round to 1010AD, since I forgot to stop at 1000AD:

Spoiler :

My goals for the round were pretty boring: win liberalism, build infrastructure, settle the remaining cities and tech towards a modern/infantry war. Since the empire is pretty large (no 2 on the demographics chart) with excellent tech and safe diplo, this should be a sound winning strategy.

Everything went peachy, I got the University of Sankore and liberalism(took nationalism), built the Taj Mahal for a still ongoing golden age and will revolt to free trade before it's over. A Jewish Apostolic palace was built, so my religious buildings all net me +2 hammers/+2beakers. Sadly I lost the Economics GM. I also built the NE in the capital.

Current economic situation: 419 beakers at 100% with -85gold/turn, a total of 85 pop. Civics are rep/bureau/caste/pacifism, but can be changed for free next turn.
Two filler cities can still be founded for some grassland tiles, but the 9 core cities are up and running. A Caravel just started to sail around the world, Oxford building can start in ~10 turns.
Diplo is safe, altough everyone(except Shaka with two cities) is at pleased, which means no tech trades at the moment.
I settled two great engineers, built a second academy and bulbed one GS for Philo and one for Education.

 

[Dirk1302]

@Turin, did you have alpha? you'll get to currency fairly easy with production converted to research (at the cost of infra for sure let's not forget that), monarchy wasn't so important imo since there were enough resources. You didn't have ivory,but besides i could trade in my game for fur and wine paying with some health that i didn't really need if i'd wanted to ( i didn't but that's another story).

Problem is later civic switches might cost you 2 turns. And the empire sure gains some production but not much commerce since there isn't that much. I'll have to admit that my GA in which 3-4 civic switches will occur probably won't profit too much either. I''ll try to have all the calender resources plantaged before i do the switches.

 

[Dirk1302]

@CellKu, edited the voting post.

@All It's not totally official (in a few hours, save objections) but i think it's quite save to continue ABigCivFan's save or your own from this point.

 

[Gliese 581]

I think it's fair that those who don't vote can't have their own games elected. In a close race that might otherwise be the deciding factor between two or more top saves even if it's unintentional and not voting should never be rewarded.

 

[Dirk1302]

Ok, you feel like Snaaty. Maybe in the next cookbook we'll implement it as a rule. Next round is officially open now. We saved a day, i suggest we play until wednesday 17 december, vote thursday/friday since we can apparently do it in 2 days, so we can play over the weekend again. If this schedule is too tight bring it up in the discussion thread. I'll also take it up with Rusten who likes to join the game, i value his contribution and so do others i think, so if he can't make it by 17th i'll make amendments and we'll agree on a later date.

 

[Earthling]

Really torn on what I'm going to do here...ABigCivFan has a great game of course so I'm happy that looks to be winning the vote. I was a bit surprised on how many people are playing through already but I wish you good luck (even though some have just played the turnset, but w/e).

So, basically I'm wondering how good of a comparison we're going to get playing out this save (how many others are going with the elected save). Out of all the games, mine certainly was kinda different and I saw some of encouragement for me to play it out. If you want to see how that turns out in the long term I could do that (potential strategy at the end of the post) but doing this would mean I wouldn't be competing to get the best results from ABCF's. I haven't read ahead/played further/spoiled anything for myself yet but you only get to play it once and then it would be spoilered, so I'm still looking to decide. Lastly, I have no objections to the next round/timeframe for this set of turns; I'll find time enough myself anyway. Thanks again Dirk!

So, if I was to continue my own save, strategy would be:

First, just fighting Pacal in the short term is pretty obvious, keeping my economy afloat, taking what I can, and finagle-ing some sort of peace. I hope to control the Jewish shrine and AP building quite soon and will have to get control of the AP diplomacy myself (without Pacal I probably have a blocking vote). Both Shaka and Sal are relative weaklings in my game, but I'll keep them as allies cause I'll need all the help I can get taking Sulei down as the next target, if at all possible. Then, I could backstab the Hindus for their land anyway and to teach them to trust a warmongering lunatic like me.

All indications point to another continent out there, but they won't be able to compete with me once I consolidate a large empire. Assuming things work out in the very near short term, my empire will be quite the juggernaut. Domi - no, scratch that, even if I have to just raze everything left -Conquest Victory will be achieved, no less can be expected of Earthling the Hopeless.

 

[ABigCivFan]

Thanks for the votes guys, looking forward to another fun round.

I can understand Earthling's feelings; everyone is trying to learn from these threads, and possibly the best way to learn is to play your own style, then compare the result with other's and have others point out your strength/weakness. Even if some games fail, but the players would gain more insight about how the game failed, what are the key mistakes to avoid the next time. That is why I suggested a while ago to allow everyone play from best save or own save for all rounds.

With the current system, if a player invested hours to play his own save for 2 rounds only get trashed after that; his learning, long-term planning and possibly the fun stops cold; it might be a very discouraging fact.

I am not arguing for a change at this point, but since this is only the first game in the series, it could be something to consider for the next game.

 

[ABigCivFan]

Round 2 report to 1000AD:

Spoiler :

1AD: Researched Meditatiion in 1 turn, and bulbed Philo the next turn

225AD: burned 1 GS for a GA during which:

1. Switched to Burea/Pacifism + existing HR/Caste
2. Starving Eridu running scienties so that I get 2 GS in rapid succession (Uruk then Eridu), the GS from Uruk is waiting to bulb Education
3. Before the GA is over, switch back to OR+Slavery to rush infras



The AIs wont trade Currency/Calendar which is very annoying, I had to self resarch them, but only took like 3-4 turns each.


660AD: 1 turn to Lib, had 4 univerities built already. 2 more unis for Oxford, Capital delayed on Uni because it built the UOS before. All cities have AP buildings and lots infra buildings.



Plan is taking Nationalism as free tech and build Taj in Lagash which has flourished as a major prod powerhouse, I plan to put HE in here later.

660AD: Sulei and Pacal are both friendly i was able to whore many techs from these guys. The diplo situiation is very easy in my game since they both favor HR and are both Jewish.




~860AD: built Oxford in capital.

1000AD: techs. After Lib, I put a few turns into Constitution, but when i say Pacal could res it in a few turns, I went banking, economics. As a result, I won Economics race, got the free GM and got constitution from Pacal by trade. Later I got Astro, gunpower by trade from Sulei i think. The tech situiation were almost perfect.

I met everyone from the other Conti, boosted trade routes, negotiated some good resource trades and netted good gpt to boost research

Now going for corporation to further boost commerce and then Chemistry/Steel (about 16 turn effort from now without any trading)




~920 AD: built Taj, started 2nd GA during which:

1. Switched to rep/Burea/Caste/Pacifism for immediate research boost
2. Before it is over switched to Rep/Vasslage/Caste/Free Market/Theo for mass troop building.


1000AD: Empire view. Lots beakers come from scientists, wont drop too much after GA. Settled some filler cities, 4 (intercontinental) trade routes make them much better. Extra workers can bring them up very quickly.



1000AD: Demagraphics. Manufacture already ranked #1, will lower a bit after GA.



1000AD: Civics, ready for war build up. If i kept Burea, research would be higher.




1000AD Cities:

Moai city: Can build naval units quickly if needed.




Marble/Ivory city. Had Jewish cathedral+hermitage for the culture war. now a prod powerhouse.




HE City:




Capital: 1 GM waiting. He can net 1900 gold max from a capital on the other continent. a ship is sailing to take him there. This gold will be used to mass upgrade my trebs to Cannons later.

Building NE here since it is best used as a super science city and temporary GP farm and the GL scientists. But will use it as a prod city soon when near Steel.





Summary:

1. 9 cities with 80 Population, 11 workers
2. High science rate
3. 6 production cities cranking out 7xp units and 9xp mounted units soon

Invasion plan.

* no AIs near rifling, as soon as cannon on line, will make the war very easy, I will tech Mil science after steel to get Grenadiers on line and enable Military Academies.

1. Caputure Mutal first to gain Iron.
2. Caputure Lakamha for the 40gpt Jewish shrine
3. Kill/Vassal Pacal
4. Invade Turkey to trim its power and caputer good cities/wonders
5. There is much to gain since the AIs have a large nubmer of matured cottages

 

[obsolete]

Hmm, wish you guys would hurry up. I'm itching to return back to the community for a while and crush some more deities.

Anyhow, anyone noticed that the city 'UZ...?' close near Pacal's Iron source is a bit weird. The first tile south is only 99% under your culture, yet the next southern tile is for some reason, 100% your culture. Despite it is closer to Pacal's Border/Capital.

Hmm....

 

[CellKu]

obsolete, why don't you join this game? Rules permit you to enter whenever you want. Just take the best save.
Moreover, IIRC - but you should ask Dirk1302 for clarification on that, since I am not 100% sure - you could even still start your own game and play up to 1000 AD.

 

[silverbullet]

Obsolete, CellKu:

Yes, rules permit joining late (Dirk needs to confrim). Technically you could also start from 4000BC. You are allowed to play your own save twice in a row, so you still have the chance to get voted if you submit a 1000AD game of your own.


CellKu: are you planning to play from ABCF's 1AD save or your own? I really wish to see how your own game develops and learn how to beat this map without marble.

 

[Dirk1302]

yes,as it stands now Obsolete is permitted to play his own game until 1000 AD. Also as the rules stand now his save has to be elected to play further from it as his save couldn't be voted for 1 AD. In this respect it might be wise just to take ABigCivFan's game unless you have a special strat in mind.

 

[CellKu]

@ silverbullett: Since you asked me to continue, I will try it. Thanks for motivating me!

 

[obsolete]

Hmm. Starting from the first turn would be like cheating as I've now seen the terrain and what to expect. I think I may just wait for the votes to finalize for the 1000 AD saves and then start from there.

I"ll take a closer look at the posted saves tonight.

 

[Snaaty]

@ Obsolete:
Welcome on board obsolete

...

@ all:
I think with this kind of ruleset and gameplay, we should pick a more difficult start next time. With voting and picking the best save for each round I guess we might win (almost) any start and with a hard start we can see and learn better some trick in desperate situations...

 

[Bed]

I am not a fan of drafting as it costs 2 pops per draft and takes much effort to set up the Globe, I could use those pops to work caste/hammer enhanced workshops. So i guess i would consider drafting only in an emergency or in very rare cases when my empire is extremely hammer poor.

first drafting is 1 pop with rifle (2 with infantry and 3 with mech inf)
second you don't need Globe to be used in an efficient way

The way i usually use it : as soon as i get rifle i switch at the start of a GA into nation and start drafting 1 rifle in each city (-1 pop and +3 for 10 turns) and come back to bureau or HR at the end of GA
Sometimes i stay in nation, build Globe and draft 1 more troop each 10 turns in my cities then almost each turn in globe city, it certainly is strong for war but is hard to put in place in immortal/deity difficulty so i often use it only to draft like 10 rifles and come back to usual civics.
They key is to have a GP (or 2) to start a GA to prepare for war.

 

[Dirk1302]

I agree with Snaaty, i'd be very surprised if we don't win this one. We're a bit unlucky that i rolled a very easy one here. I asked remoulado to make some maps that were a bit easier to post as challenges here. Maybe we can ask him for some though ones too.