[BTS] Emperor Shadow Game with Alexander; Help me get better at Emperor!

[Fippy]

I would Agri - Pottery and go straight for wet corn with the first city (1N so floodplains are also in).
Yep it's further away, but by far the strongest spot here imo, and can grow onto 3 river cottages quickly (then slow build workers or settlers at size 4, while keeping commerce so no whipping).
Worker can afford building some more roads there meanwhile cos not much to do.

 

[CGQ]

@CGQ

Spoiler :

I think wheel first is good. It's rare to build roads this early, but I think here it is useful to connect first two cities, because is so low. I would settle 3E of capital (or 3E1N) so this requires only two roads. It's important to keep 1N of eastern corn open for next city. There are decent spots in the north too (especially the plains hill 5N1E of capital, catches corn on 1st ring and oasis after capital pops 3rd ring), but I think those spots can wait. 2nd city has only a plains cow, so it's not very strong, but it can remain at size 1 building workers for a while.

I think it's a pretty important concept to look how many good tiles your city has available and then mostly stay at that size. Here it's 2 for capital and 1 for 2nd city, which is not great, but not much you can do about it. When you can lay down cottages your cities can grow to work them.

Spoiler Played to Turn 32 :

Turn 24-25: Warrior got attacked by wolf. He heals up while capital finishes settler.
I build the roads towards the capital to connect the future city. Bear with me, as roads are one of the things I'm not as good at in this game haha

Turn 26-27: First road complete:

Turn 28-29: I build road towards the new city site:

Turns 30-32: I finish settler at T32, same time as agriculture. I set beakers to pottery; Settler heads towards the city site the workers are building roads towards:

 

[CGQ]

I would Agri - Pottery and go straight for wet corn with the first city (1N so floodplains are also in).
Yep it's further away, but by far the strongest spot here imo, and can grow onto 3 river cottages quickly (then slow build workers or settlers at size 4, while keeping commerce so no whipping).
Worker can afford building some more roads there meanwhile cos not much to do.

Spoiler :

Good point, do you think I could settle there instead, then slow build a settler at size 4 to settle in the spot sampsa originally suggested?

 

[Jellybug]

@sampsa and @Fippy thank you for looking at these. As you predicted, this game is in purgatory for me, stuck at AD1200 in a three way war that's going nowhere. I'm going to think about and apply this next game: "Look how many good tiles your city has available and stay at that size."

 

[sampsa]

Yes I thought about that too, Fippy. In general, it's good to settle strongest sites first. However, there won't be many turns between settling these cities, cow-spot is easier to connect and it building another worker at size 1 seemed to time nicely.

 

[sampsa]

@CGQ

Spoiler :

Yeah your roading was not very optimal. Roading cows is not important at all, you are not going to need that health for a long long time. Some of those turns could have been spent better I think. For example, if you could road in a way that allows you to settle 1T earlier?

 

[sampsa]

@CGQ

Spoiler :

I don't think it's good to build a worker in capital. You can't chop so worker can't do much. Better to go straight to settler.

 

[Fippy]

CGQ, if you head for the further away city first, optimizing roads towards there would have been important.
Sampsa pointed out how his suggestion is easier connected, this shows you that making not needed roads is not a small mistake early.
Imo corn city could also be connected rather easily (cos worker has time), but not if he spends that time on other roads

 

[sampsa]

I think completely connecting corn city is 12T of roading and one extra T since worker is out of position? Of course, worker can partially road that way. But then the question arises if settling cows first is just more efficient. 33 is a lot worse than 6, but winning 2 per turn for several turns makes up for something.

 

[CGQ]

I think completely connecting corn city is 12T of roading and one extra T since worker is out of position? Of course, worker can partially road that way. But then the question arises if settling cows first is just more efficient. 33 is a lot worse than 6, but winning 2 per turn for several turns makes up for something.

Spoiler Played to Turn 41 :

I went back and redid my last couple turns. Is this road better?

Settler is finished and heads towards the corn/floodplains site. My worker also heads that way. The road gave an extra movement for the settler, now I see why it's important haha

(Settler is with the warrior next to corn)
I finish one warrior in Athens then set to make another settler. Should I have just gone straight into making another settler?

Sparta is settled on Turn 34:

Worker improves corn:

Turn 40: Worker finishes corn:

Turn 41: 2nd settler is out and thanks to the road I settle Corinth same in the same turn. Also Sparta reaches size 2.

What to do with worker now? Should I leave him there and build cottages on FP or rivers or improve the cow near Corinth? Also I have a question: Why isn't Sparta getting the cows from Athens even though there's a road connecting to the river to the capital? That's the thing I've always been confused about efficient roads.

 

[CGQ]

Spoiler Redid Turns 32-41 :

Went back and realized I forgot to binary research. This turn I also went straight to 2nd settler. Still settled Corinth on turn 41 but I got pottery 1-2 turns earlier allowing the worker to go straight to cottaging the floodplain

EDIT:
Redid it since I forgot to fix roads. This one I was able to settle Corinth at T40, but I don't know what to do with worker.

 

[Fippy]

Looks good
Growing Corinth to size 2 might be slow, but imo a good call. Can take one green river cottage from Sparta.
They will soon pull their weight for beakers, worker from Athens badly needed now yup.
Cottaging with the one you have now also good, cows can be done with worker #2.
Would dump the warrior in Corinth for granary switch.

Research i'd put on mining - BW, cottages will make this possible and you will want chopping next, there are many more worthwile spots around here so should be the next target.

 

[CGQ]

Looks good
Growing Corinth to size 2 might be slow, but imo a good call. Can take one green river cottage from Sparta.
They will soon pull their weight for beakers, worker from Athens badly needed now yup.
Cottaging with the one you have now also good, cows can be done with worker #2.
Would dump the warrior in Corinth for granary switch.

Research i'd put on mining - BW, cottages will make this possible and you will want chopping next, there are many more worthwile spots around here so should be the next target.

Spoiler Alternative Turn 42 :

Out of curiosity, I redid the turns once more, this time settling Sparta by the cow first before settling my next city (Corinth) by the corn at Turn 41. I feel this might put me in an even better position since I'm closer to making a 2nd worker and a 3rd settler but I'm not sure. What do you think? Was the other way better?

 

[Fippy]

Probably better, but you skipped the cows north road there, which would also have boosted corn city first.

 

[sampsa]

The road to the 3rd city is not so useful, because it adds only +1 in one city, while connection between cities 1 and 2 adds +1 in both. It's important to always improve the only -resource available ASAP.

T42 situation looks good. Though do you have a spot for 4th city and is it secured?

 

[CGQ]

Probably better, but you skipped the cows north road there, which would also have boosted corn city first.

How would it boost corn city?

 

[CGQ]

Spoiler Played to Turn 48 :

Went with my last save at T42, except I didn't complete the road to Corinth and went straight to the corn to improve it.
2nd worker is working on cottage that Sparta is going to share after Corinth grows.

T47 first cottage done, workers move on to cottage FP and riverside grasss. Corinth will work that first cottage until it grows into the floodplain that worker #1 is working on (City grows to size 3 in 4 turns either way)

T48: 4th settler done. Sadly Sampsa, I don't think I know where I want to put my 4th city. I see some good spots in the north but they're kinda far. Could I settle near or on the stone? There's no food there so that'll likely be a problem, unless there's a city that can share the corn, I'm thinking one that will get corn and elephants south?

 

[sampsa]

I think you've played pretty well so far. However, lack of planning becomes quite obvious now. Your settler is out, but you don't know where to found a city? I think you should never be in that position. One way to do it is to tentatively mark city spots in the order you are planning to settle them.

I think the plains hill up north is a good spot, as cap is popping borders soon so the oasis would be within borders immediately. The bad part is that you don't have a unit in that area. I think the stone-area is not great at all, having a city there stuck at size 1, even lacking masonry won't do you any good.

 

[Harv]

Is it my imagination, or does the starting land just look terrible?

I think replay 1st turn.

At first, I thought you were suggesting to re-roll the start!

It looks like the choice at the start was the plains hill with a food surplus of 4 and 8 hammers at size 2, or get 3 cows for a food surplus of 5 and 10 hammers at size 3. That might be good for generating settlers to settle better land.

Also, I thought the map generator gives you a couple of food sources, but counts Plains Cow as a food source.

Good luck!

 

[CGQ]

Spoiler Played to Turn 54 :

Sampsa: I sent the settler to your suggested location. I also had the scout go NW to meet with the settler to do last-minute spawn-busting:

Thebes is safely settled on T51 just as the border popped:

Worker #3 is making his way to farm Thebes' corn. Warrior from south moving up to protect Thebes too and another warrior is headed to Corinth for MP happiness. Are these good moves? I don't feel too sure about them, since I feel the worker could've cottaged the riverside grassland west of Athens first (So Athens can work it in 5 turns at size 3) then Thebe's corn. It confuses me since I know food is priority but then again we need more commerce. This is where I always get confused. What do you think?

What do you think? So far with this game I feel I can really handle any poor/bad starts the game can throw at me and I don't have to be scared of'em anymore!

Fun fact: Before I rolled this map I was playing another no huts/events continent one that I could've used here. That one had WAY better land everywhere (Basically like the land around Corinth except everywhere) and almost regenerated this map but I'm glad I chose to play it. I've been spoiled by good starts lately and I feel a map like this is really going to challenge me! I've already learned things so far I never knew!