Ethanol: the golden calf of energy policy
- Thread starter Neomega
- Start date
I'm trying to remember the name of a cellulosic plant that I heard of. The founder was feeling pretty confident that he could supply ethanol at the same price as corn ethanol from biomass. However, his big claim to fame was that his biomass wasn't being produced using the same massive subsidies that corn ethanol was being delivered by (since corn is so heavily subsidised, it's not a surprise products developed with it are cheap).
As well, his process was chemical, not biological, and so he thought that converting to biobutanol production would be easier (but there's not much infrastructure for it ... but there isn't really one for ethanol right now, either).
As well, his process was chemical, not biological, and so he thought that converting to biobutanol production would be easier (but there's not much infrastructure for it ... but there isn't really one for ethanol right now, either).
Interesting, but how would they do it?
It's a chemical system. They heat and pressurise the biomass with water, and turn it into a type of vapour (CO and H2, IIRC). Then they add a catalyst which encourages alcohols to form. They then fractionate the alcohols; but the conditions of the catalyst determine which alcohols are favoured.
nihilistic
Intergalatic Delivery Boy
In english please
His comment is perfectly clear. Don't attribute problems caused by your lack of knowledge of chemistry onto other people.
Moderator Action: In a round about way, I believe he was pointing-out that he doesn't have knowledge, and was wanting a simpler explanation.
Be useful, Nihl. It's better for everyone.
Where's the breakdown?
Biomass is the plant material (corn stalks, wood chips, etc.) that going to be turned into ethanol.
The steam and pressure turn the biomass into gaseous chemicals (carbon monoxide - the stuff you don't want to breathe, and hydrogen gas). These gases would normally just coexist just fine.
They then introduce a catalyst (which encourages a reaction). This reaction involves combining the CO and H2 with each other, in various combinations (to form alcohols). Each type of alcohol has a different boiling temperature.
These different boiling temperatures means that we can fractionate the alcohols (all the more volatile alcohols boil off first, and can be collected elsewhere).
The plant manager believes that if he changes the initial conditions (when the catalyst is added), then different percentages of each alcohol will be produced. He'll want to produce the alcohol that he can sell for the most. So while he can produce ethanol, he hopes that eventually people will buy butanol instead.
In english please
Where's the breakdown?
Biomass is the plant material (corn stalks, wood chips, etc.) that going to be turned into ethanol.
The steam and pressure turn the biomass into gaseous chemicals (carbon monoxide - the stuff you don't want to breathe, and hydrogen gas). These gases would normally just coexist just fine.
They then introduce a catalyst (which encourages a reaction). This reaction involves combining the CO and H2 with each other, in various combinations (to form alcohols). Each type of alcohol has a different boiling temperature.
These different boiling temperatures means that we can fractionate the alcohols (all the more volatile alcohols boil off first, and can be collected elsewhere).
The plant manager believes that if he changes the initial conditions (when the catalyst is added), then different percentages of each alcohol will be produced. He'll want to produce the alcohol that he can sell for the most. So while he can produce ethanol, he hopes that eventually people will buy butanol instead.
Abaddon
Deity
Rips off ideas for dissertation cheers!
...a huge part of my job with my local government was working to get an ethanol plant in town. I understand that nationally, it isn't a good answer to our energy needs. However, it would bring in 300 high paying jobs, spark industrial and commercial development in a downtrodden region, and the pollution is minimal enough that it wont drive down home values.
As long as there is enough corn, maybe it could be used to augment local market energy supplies?
As long as there is enough corn, maybe it could be used to augment local market energy supplies?
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