Firaxis: Patch coming next week

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Ragnoff said:
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The advice posted here directing even the casual user to learn and perform basic system maintainence, how to change out relatively simple parts such as video cards, and even checking to see if there is a BIOS update is sound and well founded. Anyone with a junior high education can follow the AMPLE directions about how to do this that are easy to find. VIdeo cards even contain step by step instructions and warnings (such are your carpet example). Most BIOS updates from major computer suppliers or manufactures now come with programs that do most of the work, and updating a BIOS so configured is no harder and in some cases easier than updating a video driver.

While we all know people who should not handle such things themselves, often they are the exception that proves the rule (My mom is one such, and she would NEVER act on this advice because she is uncomfotable doing anything with the computer). Most of us making these suggestions are crediting folks with the basic ability to read and the interest to learn Perhaps you are the one insulting them, as you presume these WILL UNDOUBTABLY end in disaster based on the users incompitence.

You keep making a big deal out of the fact they should not need to do this to play a game, yet games stress many systems and components in ways surfing the internet, using basic office/word processing applications, and reading email/discussion boards NEVER do. IF you joe user does not wish to ever learn anything about system maintainence, then they sould go buy an X-Box for gaming and jsut use their PC for mundane tasks.

Finally, the hyperbole you engage in in the post above is one of the best poor argumentation examples I have come across in a long time. It commits a good number of falicies of argument in a very short amount of time. With your permission, I would like to strip it of identifying marks and use it in the public speaking and priciples of argumentation classes when discussing claims, support and fallicies. Actual examples are always more useful than contrived examples.
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So raggy, what exactly are you saying here. Unless you can work on your PC you should not be PC gaming. Or are you supporting someone with no knowledge should just dig in and learn. Frying multiple systems in the learning process.
Have you ever seen a agp card shoved into a pci slot? Have you worked on a machine that the wrong bios was added to? Have you explained to a customer that with that last mem upgrade he did himself, he some how fried his mobo?
No I am guessing you have not. None of these people should have been in the computer. But all of them wanted to play a game that should have worked on there system. They all followed directions given to them and in some cases the directions that came with the Hardware. They did this to the best of there ability and failed. And it cost them.
All I was saying was that some people should not be giving advice they can not back up. Which includes walking these people through things and or paying for there bad advice.
As for programs taxing existing hardware. If on the side of the box, I read my system must have this that and the other, and I have more then this that and the other. Then there is no reason I should have to upgrade my system. Then there should be no reason to think that program should not work on my system.
As for my debate skills. Sorry, I had more important things to do in High school then be a total geek in every sense of the word. Football track basketball parties and girls. You remember that stuff.... oh wait, you don't do you.
As for you using my words. I could care less. Knock yourself out there champ.
 
Padma said:
Indeed. And if they would release games like Civ4 for Linux, they could see their profits increase even more! ;)
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Perfect world. ahhh perfect world. :goodjob:
 
Consumers shouldnt be force to gamble if the tech specs are matched or higher then the recommended or minimal. People bought the game to play it, not struggle with the developer's mistakes.
 
Borgholio said:
Bad idea. Then you'd have people whining about how the beta patch messed up their system and blaming Firaxis for relasing it before it was ready. :-/ Seriously, these people will whine about anything, so don't give them yet another excuse.
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Sorry but I agree with this. At least the part that says don't do it. Cause this game needs to be tested in house. So results can come quicker and the patch will then be released sooner.
 
Sadan01 said:
I think you make good points here. However, there is one thing that has always kept the PC gaming industry going and that is the speed of technological improvement. Example:

I'd say between February and April next year, nVidia will release their new chippy that will surpass the 7800GTX (or RSX in PS3). In fact, based on paper, the RSX has already been surpassed with the 7800GTX 512Mb GPU.

In as far as the XBOX360 and Xenos, ATI will surpass it soon to keep up with nVidia's 7800GTX 512Mb. They'll release an X1800XT PE Ultra, Super-duper, ultimate, insane version. Don't believe me? Just wait... ;) I think ATI is almost ready to go with their next gen chipsets too.

Just think where PC's will be in 5 years time. That is when you'll be seeing the XBOX720 :)lol:) and the PS4 - if Sony is still around then (as long as they dont rootkit themselves to death).
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Yet this is also the whole problem with PCs. Even if a card more powerful than 7800 only a extreme few will actually have this card so you can't develop a game only those with the lastest card. As Sony and Microsoft has admitted games production cost are getting a lot more expensive with the new generation of consoles so this increases the risk which is why we will likely to see more Socom 4, GT 5, HL 3, Doom 15, Civ 25 in the future. With higher cost the game has to reach more people. A developer can use the full power of a console knowing everyone has the same specs. So IMO more powerful graphic cards will not keep PC ahead consoles in this new generation like it has in the past. (It's amazing how well PS2 games looks and runned with only 4 mb of video ram.)

With higher production cost, patches maybe the one thing going for PC gaming. That way the producer can start to make some profit quicker from their investment knowing the game can always be patched later on. (unlike consoles) While it's true that a few here can't run Civ4, it's also true many can. So the majority can enjoy the game now (instead of waiting to find all those bugs) and 2k has already started making a profit to bring "Civ4 cost" itself out of the red.
 
On make it stop, please just close this thread and put me out of my misery

Everytime I see a new post to this thread in my mailbox I hurry over to see if the patch has been released.

I'm waiting (not very patiently I'll admit) but I'd rather it be right later than wrong now. Since I'll be gone for the long weekend, it doesn't really matter to me if it comes out before the 28th. I doubt the patch will be released from 11/23 pm through 11/28am
 
Fastest growing maybe.... longest, not at all. ( I believe that the hot chick's thread in the off-topic section is longer)

so, my 2 cents...

If you want to buy the latests, super-duper game for XBOX, you know that you have to buy the XBOX360 since is not gonna work in your old XBOX (I am guessing, I don't own an XBOX) That is good, and is bad. It is good because you KNOW that the game marked as "only for XBOX360 is not gonna run in the old XBOX, and it is bad because you have to buy the last console, and that's big bucks.

What happen with PCs? It is more blurry, If you want to play the latest game, you need updated components. If you have a 32 Mbit grafx card you might have problems with running your last acquired game. Luckily however, you only have to update one or two components (I had to update my video card, i bought an ATI Radeon X800 for $300 bucks, ouch!!!) . If the computer is very old, then you have to update the whole system, bad news, but IMHO, not as bad as if were a console. Consoles are only for games, they are not upgradeable and they become old quicker. When did they release the first XBOX? Not long ago, i think, And they are releasing XBoX360 for the upcoming Christmas. So, if you wanna the ultimate game this chrismas, you'll have to buy the game AND the console.
 
X-box 1 was released in 2000/2001 making it almost 6-7 years old. Xbox 360 is 300 bucks for the lower end one, there is 2 out, 1 looks like it has some graphics booster or something on it, it is 400 bucks.

Simply based off what was said to alot of people in the first few weeks here, once a computer hits 4 years old its junk. So based off those numbers, the Xbox outlived the PCs that came out the same year it did. ((as IMO it still has plenty of gaming capabilities and the release of 360 could still be put off for another year or two easy, given there was no competition race.))
Considering most people aim for systems like Dell/HP/Compaq and the like for prebuilts. Person A buys X-box the day it comes out ($400 US) and person B buys a computer the same day at a decent price ($1500 US) After 4 years, person B is 'suppose' to upgrade to play new games so we will pretend he gets a trade-in 'deal' ($1500 + 900 = $2400) Person A still gets 2 ,almost 3, years out of his X-box. Xbox 360 is released and he buy it again on release. ($400 + 400 = 800) He has now spent 800 bucks and stayed completely up-to-date and high tech as every other has the capabilities to do so for probably at least another 5 years. Person B has to upgrade again in a year or 2, (before Xbox360 goes obsolete) So:

Person A -Xbox- : $400+400 = $800 on systems for about 10 years
Person B -PC- : $1500+900+900 = $3300 on systems for about 12 years.

Now, I know some of you can get better deals on the PC but most common users don't know where to look and go for Dell because of the "Dude.." guy. It's just the way it is in all out honesty. Games cost the same on release and is therefore irrelevant.
This is all going off of the common attitudes on the board. "Maybe if you weren't running a 4-year-old computer the game would work. I know some people are running this game on 6 year old machines, but upgrading is around the corner I think they are willing to admit. And as I said this is aimed towards the 'usual' computer gamer/user.
 
Comparing cost of ownership of computers to dedicated game boxes is comparing raisins to grapes.

XBox can do one thing: play games.

Computers can be used to: play games, run office applications, internet communications, email, research, programming, small business apps, run home accounting apps, control home entertainment centers, control household utilities, shop on line, online banking, pay bills online, yellow pages, friend finder, geneological research, online education, download software patches for our favorite game so it will run okay, yaddayaddayadda....;)
 
Ok. As I stated in my last post. I don't own an XBOX, so I didn't know when they released the first one. I though it wasn't so old :blush:

Even though, I knew that consoles are way cheaper than PCs (even if you don't include the price of the monitor on them ;) ) But they are also more useful. even for playing the type of games i like to play. ( I wonder if you can play epic games and save your games in the console (I guess you can) or substantially mod the games (I guess you cannot))

Man, I can even record my favorite TV programs when I am out and burn them into a DVD :D

Nice post, anyway. Very good points, I guess that a console pays off if you play a lot certain types of games, like sport ones of first person shotters.
 
Efexeye said:
That has got to be the most....um....interesting....math I have ever seen.
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Not doggy years...hmmm....:lol:
 
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