Fox08 - The Bad Joke Continues

r_rolo1 · Oct 29, 2007

If Imhotep does not pick it in 24 hours I'll play it ASAP....

I have to agree with pholk. I thinked that we would be dogpiled without mercy in Immortal, but he're holding quite well.....

GreyFox · Oct 29, 2007

Looked at the save, here are my recommendations, feel free to ignore:

- Remove the HE. It is a waste.

- I would consider going for optics after Gunpowder to get harbor unlocked, before going Philo.

- I would remove any pop working on mines/forest except the iron mine, silver mine, and the mine that gives 5 hammer on the NE. These 3 mines is giving us more than enough hammers, coupled with Maoi Statues. Instead either put the pops on coastal tiles or hire merchants.

- I would've consider going Buddhist for a while to coax Izzy and JC into a war with Charlie, but the fact that JC seems to be pleased with his holy cousin make this move less attractive.

- I may consider selling Drama away for some spare cash to upgrade forces

--

·Imhotep· · Oct 30, 2007

@rolo:

Go ahead, you're welcome ! :hatsoff:

r_rolo1 · Oct 30, 2007

Ok, will play and post in 6/7 hours ( I'm not in my civ computer :cry:

)

r_rolo1 · Oct 30, 2007

Bad joke aproaching....

Spoiler :

Turnset

Turn 0 Once in a lifetime, I decided to follow Grey Foxs advice.... Putted people working in water tiles instead of mines and removed HE from queue and queued X-bow ->spear, mainly because of this:

Spoiler :

Not big enough to scare but it looks that our marble is toast for now.....

Turn 1 We lost a farm to a spy and HRE is piling units around the empire...

Finished Gunpowder, stared Compass

Spoiler :

Turn 2 Compass in bag, started Philo

HRE troops in our ground, knowed reinforcements are behind ( 1 mace from north, another HA and a CR2 treb)

Turn 3 Gilga wants deal:

Spoiler :

I thinked about it ,but declined. Gilga stopped the war with JC in this turn ( lost a city with a barb name ) but it is still his worst enemy ( -4 ) and we dont JC with a You traded with our worst enemy red tag on us ( the guy is wanting to win by dom/conquest, so sooner or later well come at our door ... I prefer later )

HRE troops seem to be gathering in Spains territory west of us... And the guy is still unwilling to talk with us ( we already passed the 10 turns since DoW... Charlie is preparing a big attack most surely... )

Turn 5 - Farm destroyed by spy again ( same farm )..... Got philo and our first musket. Started Lib ( will finish in turn 1 of next player turnset, if desired ) and a harbor ( 1 turn ) musket. Started Lib ( will finish in turn 1 of next player turnset, if desired ) and a harbor ( 1 turn )

HRE troops are forming a SoD ( strange choice for gathering spot )

Spoiler :

And we got a completely useless event:

Spoiler :

Traded feud for 30 gold with Toku ( he was going to finish it next turn anyway , so why not bag his little pocket money? )

Turn 6 HRE troops entered our territory and pillaged our sheep. It looks that is the big one....

Finished Harbor, another musket online

Traded Drama for 60 gold with Izzy (again she was going to finish it next turn )

HRE wants paper for peace... Lets see if he changes his mind after his stack is down

Turn 7 - IBT HRE lost all units except a HA that retreated... and we catched a Spy, but other destroyed rice farm

Toku wants us to cut deals with Izzy. No way, oh Tokugawa waste of space Ieasu

We got a GS... will store it for team decision ( now will partly bulb PP, a tech that we dont have big need )

Cleaned HRE HA with our 1 st spear

Contacted Charlie... now he only wants 215 gold for peace :lol:

Turn 8 HA tries to sneak attac our cottages. Cleaned with a brand new musket and got another GG, promptly settled.

Turn 9 HRE wants paper again... he has knights now... Changed research to Eng ASAP ( 4 turns )

Turn 10 IBT Knight killed spear in bush and gave GG to Charlie. Killed offending Knight... but we have another mini stack in the south ( 1 lvl 4 x-bow, 1 HA and 3 CR2 trebs ), in the jungle dye

Spoiler :

State of the world

Power

Spoiler :

City screen

Spoiler :

Glance

Spoiler :

Tech table

Spoiler :

Thoughts

We have two unfinished techs, Eng ( 3 turns ) and Lib ( 2 turns ) . I should had researched Eng before ( I can already ear the cracking of the whip.... ) , but i believe that finishing it is our top priority if we want to continue the war.
As you can see in the Power graph, Charlie started upgrading his HA to knights in the two last turns.... if we have pikes the thing will be managable. But if we want peace, we need to give anything ( now he wants Paper, but after we finish that mini-stack that is on the jungle dye, maybe the price gets lower ).... he wants to win something out of this war ( probably to clean out his face because of the fact he couldnt finish a 1 city foe... )
Lib race is in the bag.... we should start to think how to maximize it. Astro, Natio, something more exotic ( but not too much... remember Fox 7 pretending to be 6 ? )
And we still have the GS....

Wont post a roster because dont know if our legendary builder friend wanted a skip or a swap.

Good luck!

pholkhero · Oct 30, 2007

we came through that alright. It always seems like the AI loves to bring overwhelming force, and then completely mismanage that into a ridiculous stalemate ~ must be taking lessons from . . . er, nevermind.

and, Izzy's boobs?!? i mean, if you're gonna spam up a thread, at least make it funny

GreyFox · Oct 30, 2007

Agreed on the Engineering research, with Knights appearing, we need Pikes. Actually pikes isn't a good counter, but it should suffice for now.

Have you actually finished the University and the Oxford? I don't think so, seeing as you build the harbor and spears.

There's no hurry to sign peace. Let him keep contributing GG points to us for a while. He may be Immortal, but let see who gets wear down with war weariness first

... it will take an eternal war of infinite losses to add a red WW face to Munich

I am still pondering if it is worth it to revolt to Buddhism to secure Izzy and JC's friendships.

The GS should be settled. All other options are all sub-optimal at this point. In fact, IMHO, pre-Modern Era, the only great person we would need to discuss before an auto-default settle is GEngineer (yes, even GMerchant. Although the trade bonus may seem lucrative, esp if you can find the Temple of Artemis city, but the +1 food override anything).

Lib Race: Astro is good enough for now, me think. We still need calendar & Optics to enable Astro.

Timmy is UP, Pholky On Deck

--

·Imhotep· · Oct 31, 2007

Playing now...

·Imhotep· · Oct 31, 2007

The bad joke:

What does a Fox08 player say after reading this report ?

Spoiler :

I settled the Scientist an then traded with the chick for some tech, shortening our Astro grab. Oh, and I killed off Charlie's stack tutti completti.

Then came the reason for my bad joke:

I tried to convince Izzy she should close borders with JC, but she doesn't like us enough. *sigh* (Did I hear anyone talking about converting to Buddhism?)

We got a GA I left in the city - we may use him for a Golden Age.

Liberalism in.

Astro in.

Peace with Charlie in.

Potential ass saver in.

Giant SoD in.

Troops all have movement left, maybe we can block the stack in the woods. JC is likely to grind us into dust with that stack anyway, our best bet is the AP vote...

Imhotep

Spoiler AutoLog :

r_rolo1 · Oct 31, 2007

Man, we're so screwed...

... but sometimes I don't understand AI. Of course that we are weak ,but we ( by all AI standarts ) were winning the war vs Charlie.. why the dogpile? ( P.s I know: JC is pursuing a dom/conquest win... he wants all the others dead ... )
Let's see what the pope says.... if not bush in and hope for the best *chews nails furiously*

shyuhe · Oct 31, 2007

at least I'm not going to be the one playing the valiant end on this one :lol:

I don't think the AP will save us since JC will probably defy any peace resolution if he's going for domination/conquest.

GreyFox · Oct 31, 2007

Yeah, revolting to Buddhism is a difficult call, and the nature of SG are that difficult calls would usually get delayed until it is too late because nobody want to make that call. The problem is that if we had revolted, we may not know if it was helpful. All we would know is we lost 10% research bonus and suffered 2 turns of Anarchy.

We may still prevail in this roman war, depending on how "smart" the AI really are. If we can survive to Rifling, then I think we would be okay until Charle starts showing up with Grenies (he is already researching military science).

On the immediate affairs, settling the Artist is still the correct move, me think. I would also turn science all the way to 0 or sell some techs to gt money and upgrade all the axes/swords to maces.

Pholky is UP

Cabledawg · Nov 1, 2007

I havent caught this thread since my last post and can really see how you guys ignored my advice. I have allready played this game out awhile ago and by your last save...1400AD, I had trimmed Toky and HRE back with ongoing wars.... and JC and I were whipping up on Izzy. Once you get the Globe up, you can war constantly with backward civs...the idea is to keep them backwards all the while getting generals and hopefully getting massive kill/death ratios.

You should be fine keeping JC back...for now. If he asks you in the future to help him out in a war...do it. Meanwhile, after you get peace with JC, go trim back (war)the other AI's.

Then again, i could be wrong....but Im only wrong once a decade and the last time i was wrong was when I thought plaid was coming back.

pholkhero · Nov 1, 2007

Cabledawg said:
can really see how you guys ignored my advice.

i can't seem to find the post where we were asking for your advice? :rolleyes:

will do re: the Artist, and upgrading. luckily, war is my specialty ~ i've been beat on in every single SG i've been in lately :lol:

got it, for tomorrow at some point.

pholkhero · Nov 2, 2007

Turn 200/500 (1400 AD) [02-Nov-2007 12:12:15]
I convinced Homer to stay on in Munich, and settle down:

i threw on a bunch of merchants, too, at Munich for some added gold. We're still only getting 56 gpt @ 0% so not much hope of upgrades.

Turn 201/500 (1410 AD) [02-Nov-2007 12:15:35]
Pliny compiles a list:

. . . eh . . .

The resolution comes in,

JC goes to Cautious with us . . . now.

And the war ends, mostly due to JC's having voted for it :crazyeye:

The Romans are seen here on Spanish lands heading east, back to Rome (I shadowed them to make sure). I fired all the merchants, hired back 6 scientists

Turn 202/500 (1420 AD) [02-Nov-2007 12:18:01]
Munich finished its Pikeman, and I started on Walls (1 turns)
I want to build Oxford, but i'm not 100% sure it's on the list of approved nat'l wonders, so i'm going w/walls for now, and some other small builds, while I wait.

Turn 203/500 (1430 AD) [02-Nov-2007 12:20:46]
Walls > Castle (2 turns) I like the walls and castles now since the changes to both how siege works and their 1/2ing effet on it. We will be seeing olfashioned siege in the near-future if we get attacked again, and the longer siege times will help us spam more units ~ hey, Im trying here

Turn 204/500 (1440 AD) [02-Nov-2007 12:22:18]
PP came in, and Im not entirely sure what to research next. I went with guilds>banking for the commerce bonuses; we're losing money now @ 100%

Our castle is done; Observatory (4 turns) > Market next

Turn 205/500 (1450 AD) [02-Nov-2007 12:24:17]
Scratch that, i slotted in an Aqueduct (3 turns) to alleviate some health issues and let us grow a bit faster. With good results Munich grows: 20 :lol:

Turn 206/500 (1460 AD) [02-Nov-2007 12:25:00]
Islam is FIDL, and Ernest Ruthrford is born:

I settled him, thinking that was the best move for him.

A couple turns later, in 1480 AD, Guilds is in, and Charlemagne comes to visit:

I said yes for the forced peace, and that buy off from Charlie let's us go up to 80% (from 70%) losing 2 gpt.

In 1500 AD, Banking is done, and I set our wisemen onto Economics (4 Turns). I initially started a Market, but then I swapped it to a bank; 25% more bonus for one extra turn.

I also got a message that our peace treaty ended with Justinian, but we should be still covered from my trade.

Turn 211/500 (1505 AD) [02-Nov-2007 12:29:35]
Our peace w/Jc ends on the next turn. I think we should put out a handful of spies strategically placed to keep an eye out for incoming stats, replacing any that are captured.

Turn 212/500 (1510 AD) [02-Nov-2007 12:30:20]
The Apostolic Election takes place for leader, and i decide to back Isabella in the election simple for spite.

Turn 213/500 (1515 AD) [02-Nov-2007 12:30:58]
We hit a population milestone:

looking good for immortal, no? Hopefully, if we survive and keep that techrate lead, well be ahead for the space race.

And the election has been decided:

Bah ~ JC wins it

Turn 214/500 (1520 AD) [02-Nov-2007 12:32:46]
Our money jumps from - 4 gpt to + 13 after the bank is done, breaking even now at 90. I get started on a Grocer (3 turns) next; if we can trade for one of the resources for it, we can clear some more unhealthiness.

Turn 215/500 (1525 AD) [02-Nov-2007 12:33:57]
Good news!

Research begun: Replaceable Parts (5 Turns) for lumbermills, and industrialism. Which German leader are we? Isnt our UB around there or cheap factories or . . . something??

Also, JC' begins a Gage.

Were at - 1 gpt @ 90%; RP is in 5, grocer done in 1. We could go market or oxford depending on "The List of Approved-National Wonders

We've also got a GP due in 3 turns:

Let the begin!

GreyFox · Nov 3, 2007

Funny AI behavior ... and they say the AI has been improved? Declaring a war and then voting yes for peace must be one of the Year's Most Meaningless Act Award.

:whipped:

BUILD THE $%#@'ING OXFORD!! It is one of most important nat wonder after the Globe.

I was abt to whip you for the Charle trade, then noticed a previous screenshot where he was already 3 turns away from Gunpowder. So the trade was probably a good call.

Got it.

German UU is damned late ... Panzers (no, not Panthers, Ozzy). UB is pretty late too, the Assembly Plant.

GreyFox · Nov 3, 2007

And Your BIGGEST whip:

:whipped:

WHERE IS MY JOKE?

shyuhe · Nov 3, 2007

We should vote wisely in the AP elections. If you vote for a candidate either for AP leader or diplo victory, you get a +2 "you voted for us" modifier that sticks around for a while. IT's a quick and easy way of pushing a leader to pleased with us. Of course, you have to check the vote counts and the relations before you start tossing your votes around on the diplo victory. But unless the AI are sharing religion, I doubt anybody will get enough votes for a diplo victory so I think we can pick up some free modifiers there.

Castles weren't really necessary. You just obsoleted it 5 turns later with economics :lol:

Although I think it retains its ability against catapults and trebs even if it's out-dated. It's one of the few buildings that provides more than just culture after being obsoleted. If only this would work for monasteries and the AP...

GreyFox · Nov 3, 2007

In view of our recent war, the following joke is along that theme:

Spoiler :

More gripes for Mr Pholky, or whoever that decide to fortify the workers and set governor automation and have forced specialist. While I understand the need to use these mechanics in normal Civ game, I cannot agree with employing them in an OCC. If you can't even find time (or if you find it tedious) to perform micromanagement of a one-city-empire, then pardon me for being blunt, but you should save yourself all these trouble and put your Civ4 DVDs on eBay instead.

Please, no governor, no forced specialists, no nothing. Make it a point to check the city screen every turn.

Also, never fortify workers ... they should be doing something every turn. Even in war time, it really doesn't take more than a few second to skip them.

We have rice and floodplains unfarmed, the cottage floodplain has yet to be converted to farm, and the dye not planted, yet the two workers sit there in the city fooling around with the soldiers?

I attempted to correct all these, except the cottage has yet to be destroyed since we are working on a forest and the workers are building lumbermills there.

But, that is jumping the gun a lot, since my first action is actually to make the hard decision and plunge our tiny city-state into two turns of revolt:

I think it is worth the loss of 10% research. Izzy immediately jumped to pleased, and to make JC please as well, I opened borders with him:

The problem with JC is he is not as big a religion-nut as Izzy, and I am curious as to why we did not have the favorite-civic bonus with him. We have been in representation since god-knows-how-long. Did they change it such that the AI must also be in his/her favorite civic for the bonus to come into effect? Anyway, I voted for him when the next Apo Palace election popped up (he is bound to win with over 300 votes anyway), and sure enough, we gained +2 brownie points and he is now Pleased.

In the other news, we got a scientists who was immediately merged.

And some tension occurred between our friends, according to the spirit of random events anyway ... well, not much effect I have to say.

I stopped at 11th turn, as we have decision to make.

We are one turn away from SciMeth, which will obsolete 40% beaker multiplier from monasteries and another 12 beakers from Great Library. However, it is a crucial tech to enable Physics (which gives us another great scientist which can replace the 12 beakers and add an extra hammer), and Biology with immeasurable benefits. Biology do need Chemistry, however, so if we intend to pursue Biology first (instead of Physics), then maybe we can put SciMeth on hold and go for Chemistry first. A yet another alternative is to go for Rifling.

Personally, I would go for SciMeth and Physics. But I would like to hear the team's (or lurkers') opinion. I am not opposed to going Chemistry first, but I think we don't need to go Rifling now until we got declared.

Speaking of which, I checked our new found Buddhist buddies, and they are demanding quite a lot to go to war:

By the way, you'll notice I am building a Bud temple. With the Apo Palace built, all Buddhist buildings will yield a +2 hammer. That's the sole reason why I am building it.

>>> The Save (1580 AD) <<<

Spoiler :

GreyFox · Nov 3, 2007

Roster
-- GreyFox == Merciless Rants
>> Shyuhe == UP
-- Feedback == autoskipped
-- Imhotep == Welcome back
-- r_rolo1 == Got declared
-- pholkhero == where is my joke???

Fox08 - The Bad Joke Continues

King of myself

Make it so ...

Legendary Builder

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King of myself

Deviant Mind

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Legendary Builder

Legendary Builder

King of myself

Deity

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King

Deviant Mind

Deviant Mind

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Deity

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