Get it on...Bang a Gong Diplo thread

Sorry for crashing in with an irrelevant question (do I ever do anything else?(wait, that too was an irrelevant question)) but I opened the save and saw everyone was a republic but Gong, which are FEUDAL. What's up with Feudalism? Have they all not read AK's Feudal SG?
 
Hot off the presses, my immediate respone prior to discussion first then their post. Not the most brilliant suggestion I guess? They should know better after what has happened to include SABER in anything that has us as part of the plan...
I noticed this mail and though I do not speak for the team now i think it is safe to say that this will not go down nicely among BABEs. We only stayed in the game so as to possibly act as Kingmakers and sort of make sure you had a better than average chance at winning, We are going to wreak havok among Council in a few turns (hopefully) and have asked for an extension to talk things over about how to speed this up. One idea woudl be to ask you to build Galleys and GS/MI and send to FREE. In time for you to take the leap across from the resource island north to FREE we would transfer possession of The GLH so you can do it risk free. later, when our forces on Council islnad has expired to be a force to use we would sell our total assets for 1 gold or any price you find to be more reasonable.

But should SABER now enter the picture that sole purpose we percive will disappear so everything is put in a very awkward position I guess. We do not wish to have anything to do with them that is absolutely positively something i am sure about and feel I can say swithout any need to confer with the team. But should they be invited into teh warmth again it sure require a lot of discussions and please be advised the outcome might not be positive.

Wotan


On 8/20/07, niklas greback <go.gongshow@gmail.com> wrote:
Hey Partners,

Although we here in Gongdom think Saber's tactic to block their shores was fairly cheap it's not deterring us from working with them however we can to counter the AoD.

Saber has asked for contact w/ Free and I think we'll be able to accommodate them the next time around.

I would like to propose that we work out a long'ish term peace treaty w/ Saber that would include the following...

Bring them up to technological parity w/ us.
Share in researching new techs equally.
Provide their free tech as we enter new ages free of charge.
Freely trade luxuries at 1 to 1 w/o markups.
Agree to join prohibition to provide AoD any material support whatsoever.
Treaty will have an end date and termination provisions and will not be a treaty until the end of days.

We could try and get them to pay a premium for sucking but I would think they would just go to the AoD w/ the proposal and ask for a better deal.

We're on the cusp of seeing a race to Astro while teams Gong and Babe have two tiers to research. We may have the better infrastructure and/or forces but I would like to reach Astro first and still have a source for the lower teir.

Nothing says ya'll can't still despise these goobs and still look to the future when the AoD is dead or wounded and the BaG (Babe and Gong) can again isolate Saber and deal with them at our leisure.

Without your consent we'll still try and utilize Saber but I think they're only utility would be as a footstool.

Last thought... should an unseen force tear into either Free or Council the AoD will look to cut Saber a deal to regain the edge. I would like to take that option out of their hands should such a catastrophe come to pass.

Thoughts?

jb, Gong's official rambling fool... :p
 
This is from our agreement with GONG, I cannot understand how they even think we would agree to this and the "Without your concent we'll..." is bloody abusive I think. So they plan to go ahead even if we do not say yes and in breach of our agreement????
-Teams Gong and Babes will collaborate in research of new technologies. No third team is to be part of this collaboration unless teams Gong and Babes both agree on that.
I am absolutely against it so my vote is cast, NAY!
 
I agree that we should not get into any deals with Saber. Honestly, what can they achieve with their uber-unit cost and lousy government? Let's take on Free and Council and once they suffer, Saber has nobody to support them.
 
From Council to GONG
Hiya guys...

I've been chattting up The Council about possible treaty/trades (all bogus) and this is what I got in return...

Need to follow up w/ you re: Glight sharing later.


Quote:
Dear jb,

We appreciate the candor in your last letter. Your proposal isn't very appealing to us &#8211; but it may very well serve as a starting point for more meaningful talks.

The gold you offered us on the tech &#8211; 25% of current/trade value seems awfully stingy, especially for a Feudal government that, as you've noted, has less need of gold.

We've crafted 3 Alternate Proposals for you to consider.

In all cases, our offer is the same &#8211; We'll give the secret of Invention [indirectly, if needed], and agree to a guaranteed peace treaty for 40 turns.

In return, we'd like:
Option A:
40% of the Monopoly Beaker Cost of Invention = 528 gold
Treaty agreement to not then sell or trade Invention to anyone.
Treaty agreement to not attack or materially support anyone in an
attack on The Council or team FREE for 40 turns.

Option B:
60% of the Monopoly Beaker Cost of Invention = 792 gold
NO restrictions on selling or trading Invention to anyone.
Treaty agreement to not attack or materially support anyone in an
attack on The Council or team FREE for 40 turns.

Option C:
GONG researches Music Theory immediately after getting
Education, and then immediately upon discovery gives it to The Council
GONG agrees to forgo building of JS Bach's Cathedral
Treaty agreement to not then sell or trade Music to anyone &#8211; but
allowing trading of Invention
Treaty agreement to not attack or materially support anyone in an
attack on The Council or team FREE for 40 turns.

Any of those catch your fancy?

All the best,
General_W, speaking with the voice of The Council
 
From GONG:
Re: MTDG

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Oh and another update: Free was strong to us, but after building a Longbow, some spears, and warriors, they are average again. So... they should be on the upper 20% end of 21 warriors, and a few spears and archery units. We can give a more exact calc if you can find time to invade.

We dont know whether we should upgrade and invade council with you or concentrate on Free. Would you prefer us poking around in weak spots too on Council?
 
I'd think concentrating on Free would be a better option. We have the upper hand on the seas with Council so they'll have to scramble either way.
 
From GONG:
Saber has approached us about buying tech from us rather than Council. Council is offering 33% of monopoly tech value for Education. We can probably sell for 25% of value and split the gold with you. What is your take on this? They also say they can provide Banking in exchange for something.
 
Hmm...I'd be inclined to consider it to destabilize Council.
 
Building an internal conflict on their side would cause more damage than the good it would do saber, that is for sure.
 
I told JB to go ahead and trade. Here's the outcome.
The total came out to 1400g,

As we get payments we'll send you the 50% cut.

I would like to put a peace treaty in place w/ Saber for the next 40 turns or so to concentrate on FREE. Any objections?

jb
 
It all looks good to me. If gong can put pressure on free then we can just keep hammering the council
 
Question is if a deal between GONG/SEBER is not opening up an attack on us by SABER. So if GONG/SABER has peace deal that should be dependent on peace between SABER and us. GONG cannot be allied with us and have peace with SABER if they attack us. A peace deal with SABER would require GONG to have a defense pact with us.
 
We can let GONG know that they should communicate with Saber that any war against us would be a big problem for Saber since we have a mutual defense pact iirc.

We could also sign a peace deal with Saber, as distasteful as it sounds, too.
 
We can let GONG know that they should communicate with Saber that any war against us would be a big problem for Saber since we have a mutual defense pact iirc.

We could also sign a peace deal with Saber, as distasteful as it sounds, too.

I guess its time to be pragmatic about it and get a deal with Saber. That way we can go and kill free and council, then we can deal with saber after that.
 
If we go with Robi's idea, which I'm far from being against, I'd take the occasion for a 6-incher (if you don't play hockey, I can explain that one later) on SABER and mention that playing as an agent swapping between either side is dangerous business. This thing is an act of good will, but we can't just let our guard down like that.
 
My pm exchange with JB.
Whomp said:
jb1964 said:
Whomp said:
jb1964 said:
The total came out to 1400g,

As we get payments we'll send you the 50% cut.

I would like to put a peace treaty in place w/ Saber for the next 40 turns or so to concentrate on FREE. Any objections?

jb

JB,

I can't remember but do we have a defense pact? If we do can you make Saber aware that they shouldn't monkey around with our plans and attack us.

If we don't we should have one. Do you think we should sign a peace deal with them?

W

We Don't have a defense pact. How would that look? We agree to help each other out if landed upon? I would still like to maintain as much of the good cop/bad cop appearance that we can to take advantage at a letter date.

I was just toying w/ the idea of signing up Saber to a peace deal for 40 or so turns.

Getting Saber to leave you alone shouldn't be a problem because we're openly tech partners and if they want us to continue to undercut Council/Free then they need to not screw us over.

BTW, we got 1400g coming our way for the tech sale so you'll be getting your cut as we go.

Anyway, let's keep this thread going and come up w/ something.

jb

I'd prefer we don't have any surprises so that's my concern. Maybe I'll send them a 20 turn peace proposal.
 
If we go with Robi's idea, which I'm far from being against, I'd take the occasion for a 6-incher (if you don't play hockey, I can explain that one later) on SABER and mention that playing as an agent swapping between either side is dangerous business. This thing is an act of good will, but we can't just let our guard down like that.

Don't play ice hockey but i think i get the meaning. We shouldn't do it on an assumption or goodwill, but put a deal in writing to keep them out of the way so we can deal with free and council.

The only thing we have to be careful of is gong teaming up with saber afterwards
 
From jb1964:
Don't accept Education if you want to take advantage of the GLib swap....

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hey guys, I sent you Education but Cane has pointed out to me that there we were going to bestow the GLib to you to get a tech dump from Frouncil.

My question is... How long do we and CAN we wait to do this? At some point it will put us at a big disadvantage.

jb
 
I love the term Frouncil.
 
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