GOP about to pass secret health care bill while they think no one’s paying attention

[onejayhawk]

Know of any other rabidly paranoid anti-communist nutcase politician? I just chose McCarthy off the top of my head.

These days rabidly paranoid nutcase politicians are mostly anti-nazi not anti-communist. Same genus and species, different variety.

Iam pretty sure there was "death panels", free healthcare for "illegals" and "government tyranny"

I never saw anything about free healthcare for government tyranny. I give you the other two.

J

 

[Cutlass]

These days rabidly paranoid nutcase politicians are mostly anti-nazi not anti-communist. Same genus and species, different variety.
J

Well, no. The rabidly paranoid nutcase politicians are themselves nazis, or at least apologists for and allied with nazis. The rabidly paranoid nutcase politicians are all on the far right.

 

[Wastl]

If I compare the US and the EU, roughly similar economical size, the amount of states/members not that different.
The members having a National health care, but would these members, their peoples, favor an EU European health care ? Now or in the next decades ? I think not.
And looking at social security and laborers protection.... would the EU members/peoples favor a identical system for all in the EU paid by EU taxes ? I think not.
The amount of solidarity asked to EU citizens would be too much. The solidarity would for the majority of the EU citizens substantially overstretch their feeling of identity coupled to a smaller region, being as of now historically their country.
Whatever visions there live about a more federal EU.... besides centralising the minimum state features, as defence, security, foreign policy, Euro/interest strategy, trade agreements, an umbrella law system, high level domestic rights, monitoring/auditing bodies for tax and budgets.... How much more will be acceptable for the majority of the members ?
How much more will be possible without the members risking internal populist sentiments, generating shouting populists instead of governing politicians, that overall only brake the very slow cultural process (taking generations imo) of a sustainable EU unification?

From there... why would a National health care, like for example Canada, be sustainable in the US ?
Sustainable meaning, that the system has such a bipartisan and peoples support, that it is not tweaked or more structurally changed every other election, every other exchange of the power balance.
Perhaps allowing more tax freedom for the states, enabling more domestic diversity in state solutions regarding solidarity have more chance to be sustainable and match the state citizens feelings about what is right.

I don't think your comparison works at all. The USA is one country, bound by one constitution and a federal law that applies to all states. The EU is a lose assembly of independent nations, all with their own constitution and their own laws, with completely different approaches to how laws should be applied. While there are some differences between US-states as well, it is not nearly as pronounced as with EU-members, who often do not even share the same background. The EU gives a loose umbrella, and all EU-laws have to be implemented by the nations through their own parliaments. Not only that, but the EU impacts far less national laws than the federal laws of the USA do.

It does give a certain symmetry.

No one understood ACA before the vote. That also is symmetrical.


Don't make jokes about McCarthy because his ghost does not rest easy. Right now he seems to sense nazis under every rock.

J

That is a flat out lie. ACA was well understood and had countless meetings to dicuss every detail. Not everything worked out as intended, but that also had to do with certain politicians trying to sabotage it all the time. Comparing a law like ACA, which went through the proper processes and saw hundreds of hours of dicussions and plenty of amendments, to the empty shell of a law that the Republicans try to force through again and again (doesn't matter which version) is disingenuous. Republicans whined about democrats ignoring the democratic process when ACA got implemented, even though all rules were followed and endless discussions where held. Obama even went out of his way to talk thrings through with Republicans multiple times. Now, none of this has happened at all, republicans don't know what is in their law, even some people who are supposedly writing it don't know. Republicans couldn't have been bigger hypocrites if their lives depended on it. One would have thought that McCain's wake up call would have helped, but nope, still the same anti-democratic behaviour as before.

The comment about McCarthy isn't one bit better. It's a disgrace to suggest that what happened under McCarthy is in any way similar to today's situation. McCarthy went on a witch hunt and hurt innocent people, nothing like that is happening today. As a matter of fact, no one is "seeing Nazis under every rock", though certain people love to pretend that white supremacists don't exist or that they aren't thriving under Trump's less then stellar leadership. People like Gorka, Miller and Bannon had (or still have) quite a bit of say in the current government, and famous neo-nazis are happily and openly cheering Trump on, something that should be a shame to any true conservative.

 

[stinkubus]

Got news for ya bruh, "true conservative," has always implied racist in USA #1. The conservative movement in the US arose in direct opposition to things like the Civil Rights Act and the Voting Rights Act. Trump is actually the perfect embodiment of what they've always stood for, he's just the first politician in a good long while to make their intentions so explicit.

 

[FriendlyFire]

Welp enjoy Red states

AARP: Older Americans to pay $16K more under GOP ObamaCare repeal

on average nationwide, a 60-year-old making $25,000 per year would have to pay as much as $16,174 more per year for health insurance.
A 60-year-old making $25,000 per year in Alaska would have to pay as much as $31,790 more per year, and in Arizona, the person would have to pay $22,074 more, according to the AARP study.

http://thehill.com/policy/healthcar...ns-to-pay-16k-more-under-gop-obamacare-repeal

 

[Cutlass]

The Graham-Cassidy Obamacare repeal bill is still just shy of the 50 votes it needs to pass the Senate, and Republicans are getting desperate as the September 30 deadline gets nearer.

One of their main targets is Sen. Lisa Murkowski of Alaska, who has solidly voted against previous GOP repeal bills, but who has publicly remained undecided for this one.

Republicans have apparently had no luck getting a commitment from her so far, because their latest tweaks to the Graham-Cassidy bill are clearly and pathetically engineered to buy her vote.

Under the latest revisions, Alaska gets to keep the Obamacare tax credits while they are phased out elsewhere. The state is also exempt from the drastic changes to Medicaid cost structure, like block grants and per-capita caps, that the rest of America gets.

And for good measure, Alaska and a few other small, rural states will have their Medicaid matching rates increase.

https://shareblue.com/senate-gop-ac...ccessful-by-offering-it-to-alaska-as-a-bribe/


So Obamacare works so bad that states which have Republican senators opposed to repeal can keep Obamacare instead of taking the Republican replacement if they vote for the Republican replacement for the rest of the country.

 

[metalhead]

Shouldn't all of the GOP Senators be coming out against the bill, then?

The irony in all of this (well, one of many) is that a few months ago, Lindsey Graham was going around saying that any health care bill that included special deals for specific states would not pass his muster and would lose his support. Now he's one of the two top named co-sponsors for a bill that does exactly that.

 

[El_Machinae]

You should make a youtube clip of that soundbyte so that it can be shared.

 

[metalhead]

Here's the best I can come up with.

http://www.msnbc.com/morning-joe/watch/is-graham-walking-back-principles-for-alaska-1052507715740

 

[civvver]

In principle I like the idea of granting funds to states and letting them sort it out. The problem is this is really just disguised as that in reality it's a big spending cut accompanied with a tax cut for the wealthy. Not that I really care all that much, this is the individual market of which I'm not a part. At the end of the day I only care about my employer provided health care and where my premiums are going.

 

[Lexicus]

At the end of the day I only care about my employer provided health care and where my premiums are going.

Doesn't seem like a very good attitude for a citizen of a democratic society to have. Aren't we supposed to care about each other as Americans or something? I mean I'm not a nationalist but I thought most other US folks around here are...

 

[warpus]

At the end of the day I only care about my employer provided health care and where my premiums are going.

Isn't this one of the reasons the U.S. got in this mess in the first place? People only caring about their own situation and nobody elses?

 

[Perfection]

Republicans should shut up and enjoy their RomneyCare

 

[Perfection]

McCain says

http://www.cnn.com/2017/09/22/politics/john-mccain-health-care/index.html

 

[civver_764]

Well, no. The rabidly paranoid nutcase politicians are themselves nazis, or at least apologists for and allied with nazis. The rabidly paranoid nutcase politicians are all on the far right.

You need a bit of a reality check there m8. Congress just unanimously passed a resolution condemning “White nationalists, White supremacists, the Ku Klux Klan, neo-Nazis, and other hate groups”. Seems like an odd thing for a bunch of Nazis and Nazi apologists to do, eh?

 

[Cutlass]

You need a bit of a reality check there m8. Congress just unanimously passed a resolution condemning “White nationalists, White supremacists, the Ku Klux Klan, neo-Nazis, and other hate groups”. Seems like an odd thing for a bunch of Nazis and Nazi apologists to do, eh?

Not at all. Those that are nazi apologists and sympathizers aren't willing to admit it openly.

 

[Perfection]

 

[civver_764]

Not at all. Those that are nazi apologists and sympathizers aren't willing to admit it openly.

Ah. So you're a mind reader then?

 

[FriendlyFire]

Ah. So you're a mind reader then?

Did you even read your own article ?

Trump was roundly criticized by lawmakers of both parties last month after he blamed “both sides” for the Aug. 12 violence that resulted in the death of counterprotester Heather Heyer, as well as his suggestion that some “very fine people” were among the white-nationalist marchers. Trump “failed to condemn white supremacists and erroneously blamed ‘both sides’ for the violence.” The resolution calls on Trump to “speak out against hate groups that espouse racism, extremism, xenophobia, anti-Semitism, and White supremacy”

That was a deal-breaker for Republicans, and negotiations fell apart only to be revived last week when Warner and Kaine offered their own resolution with bipartisan support.

 

[plarq]

Failure to criticize neo-Nazi group doesn't automatically make someone closet Nazi. Should we say, "fascism with US characteristics", or "reborn Confederacy"? They believe in decentralization and militia oppression.