GOTM 08 Pre-Game Discussion

[DynamicSpirit]

Accoording to Central European time it is just about 8am July 1st.... Where is my save

Midnight must have passed all over the globe by now?

Nope. It's still 30 June here in California (just)

 

[godotnut]

Let the games begin.

And good luck to all!

 

[British Blue]

Urgh! Here's me only just making the transition to Prince level and they go and land a Monarch map in me lap. Not sure whether I should go for Adventurer class or normal settings. Adventurer is mighty tempting since I don't wanner get creamed by the hike in difficulty level. Either way from that screen shot I'd personally move West to grab both the pigs and fish plus the gold resource. Probably upset me early production but I'm a sucker for coastal cities.

 

[British Blue]

But that was on Noble... this is Monarch... a whole 2 levels above... I expect to lose. Lose badly.

You're not the only one mate! I'll see you on the rubbish tip of (civ) history.

 

[Big Pig]

The criteria for the 1st spoiler (on the Saves Available thread) seem to suggest our starting island is a large one..... - which means we probably have neighbours....

Spoiler 1
Opens on July 7th.
Requires full view of the starting island.
Requires that you have reached (at least) 0 AD.
No discussion of events post 500 AD.

 

[Jove]

It's all pretty much been said already. I still can't decide whether to build a worker first or grab the cheap Fishing and take a workboat first. What's the rule when faced with two attractive options? Do both simultaneously?
Where to found the capitol hinges on what the scout uncovers. Archipelagos can just be teeming with fish and crabs. 1W is still discardable I guess.
But for sure: I've been drawn to the metalcasting->money-wonder strategy for the past two games, but haven't tried it yet. This time I'll give it a go. And why not hope for 4 early wonders? It's not like being disappointed in the GOTM before ever killed me.

 

[toller pretzl]

GOTM8 Motto

Three wonders

Collssus
Great Lightouse
Oracle

Pick Two

I wonder what is good about the Colossus. Does it offer one extra gold per water-tile, just for the one city where it is built ? Surely that is nothing to get enthusiastic about ?

 

[Big Pig]

I wonder what is good about the Colossus. Does it offer one extra gold per water-tile, just for the one city where it is built ? Surely that is nothing to get enthusiastic about ?

No, it gives an extra commerce per each water tile in your empire (until Astronomy) - on an archipelago map that's a lot of water tiles and a lot of commerce

 

[toller pretzl]

No, it gives an extra commerce per each water tile in your empire (until Astronomy) - on an archipelago map that's a lot of water tiles and a lot of commerce

Thanks, that explains it

 

[jimbob27]

Arrrggh! This looks nasty!

I can only beat monarch when everyones on 1 continent. I've played about 3-4 continents games on monarch and lost all of them, and archipelago is even worse that continents!

I think I'll start a practice game tonight with similar settings. I don't really like bismark either, so I'll have to work out some tactics to use with him.

 

[The-Hawk]

Why are you fine civfanatics so wild about the Civil Service slingshot? I don't think it's that big of a deal at all, just another strategy. The Oracle provides a very short-term gain compared to the other early wonders. And there are many situations where Civil Service is definitely not your best bet, even if you do go for the Oracle.

I've finally gotten around to reading through this pre-game thread, just read it from beginning to end in one sitting. I must admit I share this sentiment. I read "I'm going for the CS Slingshot" so many times that I almost went to my manual to see if I had missed a victory condition called "CS Slingshot".

Okay, I tried another run at the Oracle for Metalcasting & early forge, followed by Great Lighthouse & Colossus.

Armstrong, with the caveat that I haven't studied them in any detail, I must say I really like your posts in this thread. I think your approach has great potential for this map type. At the very least, you get bonus points for not following the herd and thinking out of the box!

BTW, before anyone gets riled up, I have no problem with CS Slingshot! I might even go for it too! But only after I decide on an overarching objective (victory condition)... and only if I conclude CS Slingshot is supportive of that objective, fits the map conditions, etc.

 

[malekithe]

BTW, before anyone gets riled up, I have no problem with CS Slingshot! I might even go for it too! But only after I decide on an overarching objective (victory condition)... and only if I conclude CS Slingshot is supportive of that objective, fits the map conditions, etc.

The nice thing about the CS slingshot is that it supports almost any stategy aside from an early axe rush.

 

[Strobe]

Thanks to Stormreaver for the test game.

Thought Id give founding Oracle (CS), GL & Collosus while performing some semblance of settling. After much testing and quite a few mistakes I secured all 3 for 75AD with maceman coming online and 3 cities in place

Here is some tips for the less expert among us.

1. You will need to fog bust as military will be low. 2-3 warriors + 2nd city should do it. Remember to let barbs attack you while on jungle or jungle hills.

2. Only settle a 2nd city not a 3rd before you start Oracle. The 2nd city should have food and several hillls to produce your military.

3. Do not whip the settler, you can produce it easy enough and want to grow (or not shrink shoud I say) to ensure pop for scientists.

4. Tech order.
Fishing-AH-BW-Writing-Wheel-Myst-Med-Priest-COL

5. Build Order.
Worker-WorkBoat(when fishing researched)-FinishWorker-warrior-warrior-settler-warrior-Library

6. Worker build.
Pigs,gold,road gold,road pigs,chop library, mine hill, road to 2nd city.

7. Chop rush library and assign scientists. You always want to work the gold, fish and pigs. Work gold when it is available even if leaving pigs ( I prefer extra commerce from fish)

8. Keep scientists in place while building Oracle. Keep an eye on COL research and if it is behind move a citizen to work a coast tile. You have to get COL before Oracle. You can finish both on the same turn for complete efficiency but ensure you do enough micromanagent to get COL first. I found AI to complete Oracle regularly at 1000AD so you cannot leave any micromangement.

9. Try to prepare 2nd city for production of military.

10. As soon as a GS is born place Academy in Capitol.

11. After Oracle you can research Metal Casting and produce a 3rd settler in capitol. Change scientists for mined hills.

12. Build 2nd settler and found 3rd city using capitol at size 6. Again do not whip.

13. Let capitol grow to 7 or 1 turn before. Whip Lighthouse.

14. Build Great Lighthouse.

15. After collosus research construction and easily wipe out your neighbour.

Notes

I did not normally need to produce a 2nd worker until very late
Make it a priority to steal workers in first war.
I also founded Great Library in Capitol
Received 2 Great Merchants early in the game which I added to capitol.
I completely ignored exploration and let the AI come to me.

In the end I settled 6 of my own cities and wiped out my neighbour.

Some other notes that contain spoilers for the test game.

EDIT: Missed out 2nd settler build !.
EDIT: Altered point 8 to correctly state Oracle and COL research can be completed at the same time.

Spoiler :

You are on an island with Monty which caused several problems. One test game I tried settling a total 3 cities before Oracle, one near to Monty. He attacked me fairly soon with 6 archers !.
Therefore Keep any aggresive civ happy, change to their religion if possible and certainly dont change to confu yourself until you have military.
Also dont expand against their borders.
As you will reach Maceman so early you can teach them a lesson later.

 

[civ_4_rox]

ok this is really off topic but ive never played an official civfanatics game b4 can some 1 fill me in plz that'd be great

 

[AlanH]

Have you visited the GOTM site yet? Try this link then come back if there's something you don't understand.

 

[drkodos]

I still have not decided if I am going to play the Adventurer class or the Contender class on this one. Although I normally play Noble, have recently been playing more on Prince, I have gotten quickly eviscerated the few times I have ventured into Monarch territory.

However, having played through a number of practice games using Stormreaver's awesome contribution I have learned a few interesting things for myself:

~ Having the extra settler, worker, and archers from Adventurer class was a double-edged sword. Founding an early 2nd city all too easily became an albatross around the neck. I am not sure the extra "bonuses" will be that helpful for me (not knowing how to play at this level).

~ Games without the infamous CS Slingshot found me lagging behind in tech's by 1,000 AD. Getting Bureacracy into the capital to boost science rates seems important.

~ There was no way for me to keep up with military build-ups by other Civ's. I managed to eke out a few spaceship wins, but each time was getting pummeled in the later game by superior civ's with superior numbers. The only tech path that keep me "in the game" was beeline to astronomy, then beeline to Rifling then artillery.

~ Using the Forges in conjunction with the Organized Religion building boost seemed to work best to keep some production going in all the water-logged cities.


One more practice game ( I swear! ) and then I will dive into the real pool tomorrow.



PS: Any hint when the final results from GotM 6 will be posted? Thanks!

 

[mushroomshirt]

Thanks to Stormreaver for the test game.

Thought Id give founding Oracle (CS), GL & Collosus while performing some semblance of settling. After much testing and quite a few mistakes I secured all 3 for 75AD with maceman coming online and 3 cities in place

Here is some tips for the less expert among us.

....

Strobe, thanks for this. I have been meaning to try a GOTM where I am in strict builder mode for the first 1/2 and then switch to military mode in the 2nd 1/2 for a domination win. Previous GOTMs I have been 100% war all the time, but I think I need this first builder phase to take my game to the next level.

I will try one of the practice games following your prescription & then take it to the official GOTM game.

 

[Conroe]

It is important to get COL 1turn before Oracle and you will need to micromanage to do this efficiently.

FYI -- research will complete before production. So, you can MM to bring them in on the same turn if you like.

 

[bigchief]

Since the site is now talking to me:

Hello bigchief it appears that you have not posted on our forums in several weeks, why not take a few moments to ask a question, help provide a solution or just engage in a conversation with another member in any one of our forums?

I thought I'd just say hello, and that I am playing this month's GOTM. This will be my first one. Having played the Civ3 GOTMs and SGOTMs, I am looking forward to this one, even if I don't have much hope of doing well, as this is about my 10th total game of Civ4, and I'm still just learning it.

 

[The-Hawk]

I've finally gotten around to reading through this pre-game thread, just read it from beginning to end in one sitting. I must admit I share this sentiment. I read "I'm going for the CS Slingshot" so many times that I almost went to my manual to see if I had missed a victory condition called "CS Slingshot".

I spent some time today looking at start options. Stormreaver, thanks for the sample game!

And, in spite of my previous post... time to join the pack! CS Slingshot, here we come! (I think Armstrong's strat has some real merit, but this capital site is just too good.)

For some odd reason, even though this setup is screaming for a launch, I'm inclined to go for a military win. Might as well take the slow path! . Given the map, I think this will be more of a marathon. Hence a strong science foundation is needed... can't slip behind in techs. Besides, if war is taking too long, it might be nice to be able to fall back to diplo or spaceship. Hence, I'll try to get Berlin cracking with a library, academy, and bureaucracy.

However, since Bismark was nice enough to learn mining already, I'm definitely gonna pick up BW early... I'm really hoping there is copper nearby and another AI on our island to supply some cities .

Tomorrow is a holiday, no work. Great time to give it a go... best of luck to all!