Goz11- 5CC-Deity

[gozpel]

Not too shoddy.

The gpt deals doesn't really hurt us, since we have 20 turns to Writing anyways. But WC? Come on, we need to know where the resources are so any deals with BW and the Wheel would've taken us to that.

But still I'm not unhappy. If a neighbour decide to do something silly, we can at least build archers now. We are NOT going for Monarchy btw, we're going to be Republic, nothing else matters.

We're in a dilemma here, concerning city placements.

I can find one good spot, on another BG mind you 1SW and 3S from Delhi. This will be another sea town and we'll lose productivity. Still it's good enough because of the hills.

I really wanted a town N of Delhi, but the location of the deer makes that spot pretty useless. If I could have my mind on this, I would send a settler to the hills 1NW of the warrior, just to grab those silks. To have 2 luxes to trade may be worth its while. Corruption in that town can be sorted out with a courthouse later.

I want those luxes and don't care about corruption at this stage. We need leverage for trading. So I want next settler to go straight there. And the last settler to the spot south of Delhi.

Agree or disagree now.

Just one point for you that wonders about a FP. We can NEVER have more than 5 cities, so no quick taking more towns just to make us build the FP and the same goes for armies. We will only have one, for the rest of times. Well, if we get a leader that is.

 

[gozpel]

And I noticed now, that we have another settler in 3 turns. Excellent, send him to the silks. (well, if not the whole team objects)

The worker NNW of Delhi should be scheduled to just connect cities after he finished his task, we will get enough workers soon to improve stuff.

Thinking about city placements and corruption, in worse case we can relocate the Palace to Madras later. Delhi has no improvement yet, all we have to do is to get Madras up to pop and the other towns low, plus a few military in that town and we can jump. It would take out the corruption factor quite well.

What do you think?

 

[Mathias]

To be brief, I'll just say that I totally agree with city placement and palace jump.

 

[gozpel]

I better make a graphic explanation:

Later when we jump Palace to Madras, even the calcualtors on this team should be happy?

 

[gozpel]

To be brief, I'll just say that I totally agree with city placement and palace jump.

Thank you, Mathias. Too bad we'll get too much waters to work on, but this is the lands we're given.

 

[Own]

The corruption looked bad, but the lux and hills make up for it. If we only have five powerhouses, why would we abandon one to make another slightly more effective? How about just buidling a palace?

 

[Smart]

Would we not want France to build the GL for us?

On pangaea it doesn't matter - we could sign RoP with our neighbours, and move SoD to the target civilization.

I have no idea where the other two cities should go, though somewhere in the south near the two silks is one place, and in the north near that deer and now incense is a possible location.

City near silks will get high corruption and waste (45%), better is to build it on coast, using OCP (22% corruption). Other city will be NW from the deer to get incense.

Dotmap:

 

[Own]

ooh, I smell incense to the north. I can't decide now.

 

[Smart]

I saw only page 3 when wrote the post. Jumping the palace is bad idea, better is to build city on incense

 

[Smart]

I really wanted a town N of Delhi, but the location of the deer makes that spot pretty useless.

We can irrigate those plains, watch to the river near incense hill

 

[Own]

I think he meant there's no practical way to get it coastal.

 

[zerksees]

If we go with gozpel's picks we can overcome the corruption with a courthouse (I have not done the math to see how close to 22% it could get), and have an extra silk to trade - could be big.

If we go with Smart's city placement, we have the option to make clearing out the land to our southwest our first conquest, as long as France doesn't get it. Maybe we could put the cities down their ourselves and give them to someone else? Also, this gives us more mountain tiles, increasing our chances for saltpeter, which could be way more important than an extra lux to trade.

I lean toward Smart's pick though only by a little bit.

No monarchy? It is only a one turn anarchy since we are religious. We could go to republic later. Oh well I guess my 5CC inexperience showing through here.

I was on the fence about WC, but could not think of a compelling reason to get the others. I doubt I could have pulled off the same trades for the wheel, and since we don't need horses I did not think it that important. Next time I'll get some opinions. (Now I am realizing if we had horses we could trade them.) I am sure I could have traded for BW instead, wasn't thinking about iron working yet - my bad for sure. I did save the game before the trades if anyone is interested to try other trades. Next time I'll get some opinions.

Also I need your opinion about boating through AI territory during this phase. Is it something you do? I know it subtracts from an AI's attitude toward you, but I did it in Japan territory anyway in the name of exploration. There are still two more AI to meet.

If we take the GL, will we have to abandon one of our cities if we want to keep it for a turn? How does this fit into your definition of 5CC?

If a city deposes and pedges allegiance to us, can we accept it then raze it as soon as the IBT is over?

 

[Own]

The last question depends on whether it's relaxed 5CC or not. Relaxed means at the end of a turn you can't have more than five cities, stressed 5CC means no more than five cities ever.

We could colonize the silks, but it probably wouldn't last long. I'd like to go north. Maybe we can get a bunch of warriors to surround it, preventing it from being settled on.

 

[Own]

I took a peak, and we'll definately get the incense, as the french town's first cultural expansion won't get the incense, the second will, but our cities first will overrule it. I'm all for north. That 5th city will take too long to develop. Plains aren't that bad really, and we shouldn't trade our luxes anyway (a lux usually means one or two less clowns per AI city, not good). We can buy other luxes cheap for gpt anyway cause we're so small.

Edit: Smart, you're up

 

[Smart]

The last question depends on whether it's relaxed 5CC or not.

We can NEVER have more than 5 cities, so no quick taking more towns just to make us build the FP and the same goes for armies.

If we are going to abandon one city after capturing GL, we can build it on silks, and then resettle it in the first ring with less corruption

Edit: I got it, will play after completing turnset in SM2

 

[zerksees]

we shouldn't trade our luxes anyway

There are two silks down south so one to keep and one to trade. There is only one incense right?

And someone who crunches the numbers could tell - there is a chance that trading a lux and increasing the lux slider to offset might be profitable, since we will be so small compared to the other AI. If this were the case then we might have two lux to trade, though I still lean toward Smart's pick.

gozpel - you know my opinion but I will go along with whatever you decide. In either case our next settler should go to one or the other.

 

[Own]

I meant because it makes the AI more powerful. A lux to the AI might get us 20 gpt, but won't make up for the tons more production, growth, and gold the AI gets from being able to fire some clowns.

 

[Smart]

Also I need your opinion about boating through AI territory during this phase. Is it something you do? I know it subtracts from an AI's attitude toward you

When I start with alphabet I usually travel through AI territory to get contacts with others. Attitude will restore back, when you leave AI's territory.

 

[zerksees]

I meant because it makes the AI more powerful. A lux to the AI might get us 20 gpt, but won't make up for the tons more production, growth, and gold the AI gets from being able to fire some clowns.

OK I am a little slow but I get it now. I typically would not want to trade those things with the #1 or #2 AI, as it could speed up a runaway AI.

But, trading a lux to a #4 AI for important techs or resources is hard to ignore. If that production is directed at another AI then that effect is negated. Maybe #4 can bear the brunt of #1 while we are taking cities from#1.

Have you considered that these types of trades can figure into the decision process on who will be attacked next? Could reduce the AI extortion rate and the number of wars we involuntarily enter.

 

[Own]

Good point. But North is still a better city spot IMO.

Also, a cool trick in XCC's you can do is trade a lux (0 extra) for two luxes and maybe some more.