Hereditary Rule - do you use it much?

[LlamaCat]

I've found the more I play that I am using Hereditary Rule hardly ever anymore. I guess the reasons must be that I get the Pyramids about 50% of my games then switch right into Representation, which I consider a more useful civic under most circumstances, early or late game.

I also was thinking that human players might not find it as useful because it requires keeping troops in the cities and we are typically using them for taking it to the enemy. And I don't need the happiness from troops early on, because I might have a couple really large cities that grew quickly, but mostly the other cities are smaller. So the happiness in 3 largest cities is good, plus resources, and whipping keeps the population down elsewhere for a while.

What are your thoughts and are there some good situations where this civic is better than, say, Representation? And is this civic basically worthless if you are using Slavery for most of a game?

 

[Garand]

I tend to play a defensive game and concentrate on growth, research and diplomacy. Therefore I find heriditary rule useful when I have rather large cities with happiness problems, and I usually keep a garrison of at least two units in each town, and more in border towns.

I'm sure though that if I used a more offensive approach to playing the game, that heriditary rule wouldn't be quite as useful - but if you don't have the pyramids, I think it's a good alternative to no civic at all until something better comes along.

 

[r_rolo1]

HR plays well with cottages: "happy warriors" means more citizens in your cities , hence more cottages worked and for a longer time, hence more $. Of course if you are more inclined for a SE, Rep is by far a better choice.

 

[DaveMcW]

Of course Representation is better.

But HR sure beats Despotism, unless you retire when you miss the Pyramids.

 

[Fold]

I generally find myself taking a tech path that doesn't include monarchy, so it's difficult to justify diverting resources just to get HR. Generally by means of expansion and conquest you can get enough happy resources to keep early unhappiness away, and calendar is on or near the typical tech path for later.

 

[Dan Quale]

I prefer Happy axemen/ stacks of doom in every mega city, having 15-20 pop cottaged cities is great before AD 1, The support costs are also low, for both the city and the units because of size and sheer income. Your powergraph also skyrockets using this technique, and if anyone is stupid enough to attack me, well a few turns of unhappiness is worth most of their lands.

 

[Roxlimn]

Actually, these days I find that I'm using HR more and more, especially as I transition into Monarch.

Basically, whether I opt for early war or not, I usually get a bunch of units fairly early for fogbuster, scouting, or anti-unhappiness duty, plus a few to deter barbarian attacks and to discourage AI attacks. I get even more units if I stage early war.

Long story short, I usually get at least two units per city early on, sometimes three or more.

This translates to moveable happiness points that I can use to grow my cities really, really big, especially if I have lots of health from Expansive or a lot of health resources. This helps even more if you avoid founding religions and have yet to acquire one.

I like to grow cities large and then have those extra guys work hills or forests for production rather than relying on pop-rushing. This is extremely effective once you can "pop off" the happy lid with units.

All of these hold true whether I'm going for Pyramids or not. While I'm also partial to Representation, if I'm not Industrious, don't have Stone, have Wine, and have good reason to make lots of units early (Monty somewhat near), then HR is a nice enough Civic and Monarchy is a very attractive tech.

 

[Defiant47]

Of course Representation is better.

But HR sure beats Despotism, unless you retire when you miss the Pyramids.

Exactamundo!

 

[Krazikarl]

HR is kind of important for many whipping strategies.

Unless you are playing a leader with a very specific trait, its hard to get Pyramids consistently on high levles. If you only play leaders that are capable of getting Pyramids, thats nice, but most leaders cant consistently (at least not without sacrificing more than they are worth), hence HR is very important.

 

[LuckyAC]

I go for HR pretty much every game.

 

[kniteowl]

lol it really dependent on a lot of things, try playing a game where you're not nearby any happy resources as in calender, Ivory, Fur Gold, Gems or Sliver nearby. You're not Charismatic, you don't have a UB that gives you Extra Happiness so that leave out the Ottoman and Mayans and don't go for the Pyramids and play at a high level Preferably Emp and higher.

HR becomes a life saver, because it's the only thing to increase you're pop and ultimately research rate.

Obviously you'd use the Culture slider instead of HR for the SE.

 

[gettingfat]

HR means big cities = lot of cottages and/or lot of specialists = quick research

If you play fair (ie. don't keep S/L), half of the time you won't get the Great pyramid. HR is the life safer.

 

[futurehermit]

HR is a really solid civic. Pyramids 50% of the time means you're on a low skill level or regen if you don't find stone. If you are going CE then HR is pretty much essential. Combined with expansive you can have some really large early cities.

 

[Brave Jay]

happy resources + religious buildings = hereditary rule.

If I can't get the resources and religious buildings early enough, I'll divert my tech path to get HR. If i have a lot of wine i will go for it anyway.

 

[vicawoo]

Assuming you're not getting pyramids, which is pretty often, you're stuck at size 3 at higher difficulties. Sometimes I get gold, sometimes ivory, (almost never fur), so usually I'm getting 0-2 happy resources. You're not going to conquer 3 civilizations in your early conquest.
Religion's decent, although sometimes not feasible due to diplomacy. But if you want to really grow your cities, you'll need more happiness.

 

[Morgrad]

I use it a lot. In my current game as the Incans (random generated, Warlords - no BtS yet for me ), two turns of production for any given city = one happy face. Quecha's aren't useless after the initial rush, after all!

Also, by building really cheap, crap units for the happiness, I don't accidentally pull them off with the rest of my stack when it's time to .

In the rare cases where I have pre-calendar happy resources aplenty, I'm much more likely to skip HR - but given that the resource generator usually hates my guts, HR is a lifesaver (or, more accurately, an economy saver).

 

[cabert]

HR is a really solid civic. Pyramids 50% of the time means you're on a low skill level or regen if you don't find stone. If you are going CE then HR is pretty much essential. Combined with expansive you can have some really large early cities.

50% is about the frequency of available stone for a quick second city.
So I guess up to emperor at least you can have the pyramids 50% of the games.
If you play to your strengths (GE from a forge if you're philo, straight building if you're industrious, fast teching towards maths for better chopping if you're financial), you should be able to have it a bit more often than that.
I play mostly "prepared" games (WotM for instance) and this may twist my experience, but when I have decided for pyramids over an early rush, I always got them.
Seems even easier now in BtS. The "better AI" doesn't seem to like starting something that would last over 20 turns. (maybe that's the fix needed about "early wonders"?)

 

[Weird Piggy]

I often play Fractal at times and end up on islands by myself. With nobody to trade with and only two happiness resources (Gold, Sugar), In order to grow cities past 8 or 9 HR is bascially required. By not hooking up Iron or copper I can build warriors well into the AD's and get free happiness.

 

[uncarved block]

Yeah, cabert, the real competition now is for Great Wall. I've seen it built as early as 67 turns in (on Noble), ahead of Stonehenge(!) and Oracle. Pyramids seem lost in the shuffle, at this point-- the only reason I don't get them every game is out of sheer habit of not trying for them.

I'm using HR more than before, because of the decreased happy cap on Noble. My general impression- and it's only an impression- is that the game got a lot harder on Noble, and a little easier on Monarch, in part because us Noble players are having to scramble for happiness, and it's quite a shock. I used to scoff at Monarchy as an AI detour, but now I've even taken it from the Oracle once, just to try and keep the mobs happy. Twas quite a change.

 

[Krazikarl]

You might be able to get stone 50% of the time on your second city, but that means that you are probably going to be giving up bronze/iron and horses, making it a questionable decision.