strategyonly
C2C Supreme Commander
OK you just copy and pasted, if your going to be like that, i will have to get a moderator in here.
Heroes
- Thread starter strategyonly
- Start date
OK you just copy and pasted, if your going to be like that, i will have to get a moderator in here.
Thunderbrd
C2C War Dog
I think ultimately, the point is that they need to be in play for a while. I would personally rather use them right away for their great benefits to the cities than ever risk them in the field. But I'd like to have them be a bigger factor strategically than just build/use. Force the risk to be taken, so to speak.
Perhaps some of the functions we have for heroes, such as the Great Accomplishment and being able to add themselves to the city as a GP, could be unlocked by advanced promotions that require a particular level to be achieved, thus enforcing they must at least be in the field for some length of time...
They could be all made to NOT be combatants and thus not receiving any GG exp (well, once that's setup that Great Military Instructors only add XP to Combatants anyhow...) Hero could mean NOT-Combatant, NOT-Civilian... make 'em work for their promos!
Then we'd have to put them into battle or at least USE them in some of the new XP generating mechanisms on the table here before they can be instantly absorbed into a city for immediate benefit.
Dancing Hoskuld
Deity
Which would make them totally useless to players who don't do war.
Thunderbrd
C2C War Dog
Not necessarily. We're giving units like Storytellers and Workers some XP deriving civil missions... heroes could have access to those and/or perhaps some of their own.
strategyonly
C2C Supreme Commander
I need SOMEONE who isn't a present modder for C2C to help me out.
I need someone to write down ALL the civs that PRESENTLY do NOT have Heroes in their prospective civ.
I need someone to write down ALL the civs that PRESENTLY do NOT have Heroes in their prospective civ.
You mean 'cultures' right?
strategyonly
C2C Supreme Commander
Dancing Hoskuld
Deity
Can't you just go to the pedia and click on each culture and see which ones don't have heroes yet? the first three don't (Aborigine, Ainu and Aka).
)
strategyonly
C2C Supreme Commander
Caution : Very long post in spoiler
Spoiler :
Many many many thx, i didnt know there was that many missing Heroes
OK i was just thinking, now that we have a list for "cultures" we still need the "current" CIVs of THESE cultures that need Heroes??? No sense in making a "Confederate" Hero if there is NO civ that is "playable"??
Hydromancerx
C2C Modder
Not yet. I have been lazy.
I am not sure what you mean. Wasn't the point of having "cultures" in the first place was so we could represent many more types of civs without actually having a playble civ for each one?
On a side note we currently have some playable civs that have no "culture" counterpart (ex. Anasazi) yet.
strategyonly
C2C Supreme Commander
Not yet. I have been lazy.
I am not sure what you mean. Wasn't the point of having "cultures" in the first place was so we could represent many more types of civs without actually having a playble civ for each one?
On a side note we currently have some playable civs that have no "culture" counterpart (ex. Anasazi) yet.
nrvrmd (i wasn't thinking again)
Thunderbrd
C2C War Dog
Not yet. I have been lazy.
I am not sure what you mean. Wasn't the point of having "cultures" in the first place was so we could represent many more types of civs without actually having a playble civ for each one?
On a side note we currently have some playable civs that have no "culture" counterpart (ex. Anasazi) yet.
And do we have cultures without a civ counterpart? I'd love it if we could get the two lined up so that we have parallels on both. Would enable a few cool projects but I'm not ready to work on that anyhow - just sayin.
Hydromancerx
C2C Modder
Well then how else am i supposed to assign a NEW Hero to the game? If it isn't by listing them INTO a civ? Since we dont really play cultures. Or am i missing something here
Heroes should not be linked to a playble civ but linked to a "culture" (meaning a wonder and a resource of the same name)
For instance if you want to build say Thomas Jefferson you need to build the wonder "Culture (Amercian)" which produces "American" resource. Not playing as the American civ.
Uh I listed Anasazi as a playable civ but not as a culture (yet). I think there are a few more like Yangshao, Lower Souix, Chippewa, Argentinian, Croatian, etc. I intend to make them (except maybe Lower Souix) eventually. I just have a lot of other ones to do first.
sgtslicks proposal on heroes seems like a decent idea worth evaluation.
"Regarding Heroes, have you considered making them start with certain promotions which are locked and then excluding them from gaining other promotions? This would balance them imo coz they're quite overpowered, it would also give each hero more of his/her individual flavour."
-It would lock heroes to their specific historical age, meaning a classical hero would not be an effective unit in the late medieval age.
-The drawback is of course a short lifespan for the unit to be used effectively when playing on faster gamespeed.
-Fixed promotions makes every hero strategically more interesting.
-Maybe they should have some limited set of promotions available trough experience like the strength promotions 1-5, everyone loves a level system.
-Perhaps they should even have a larger experience gap between levels to make them harder to train.
-Making heroes balanced units would not be a problem anymore.
Imo a very decent proposal from sgtslick.
"Regarding Heroes, have you considered making them start with certain promotions which are locked and then excluding them from gaining other promotions? This would balance them imo coz they're quite overpowered, it would also give each hero more of his/her individual flavour."
-It would lock heroes to their specific historical age, meaning a classical hero would not be an effective unit in the late medieval age.
-The drawback is of course a short lifespan for the unit to be used effectively when playing on faster gamespeed.
-Fixed promotions makes every hero strategically more interesting.
-Maybe they should have some limited set of promotions available trough experience like the strength promotions 1-5, everyone loves a level system.
-Perhaps they should even have a larger experience gap between levels to make them harder to train.
-Making heroes balanced units would not be a problem anymore.
Imo a very decent proposal from sgtslick.
Thx Toffer90, i'm still playing Skyrim Redone by the way, such a great mod.. Been on revision 1.01 for awhile now, wonder when he'll release next revision.
Regarding heroes, there are currently promotions that heroes can get (about 10 I think). What I meant StrategyOnly, was that rather than all these promotions being available to all the heroes and them starting out with 1 or whatever initially. They instead would have whichever promotion(s) the designer deems appropriate but no more. Meaning you couldn't hypothetically have a hero with 5+ of these promotions running around in god-mode. Also it allows the developer to stylize the hero more specifically, whereby they aren't differentiated merely by strength and graphics but also by which promotion(s) they have.
Extending this idea even more, like toffer90 suggests is possible to; such as giving these designated promotions levels, such as 1-5, 1 being a weak variation of the promotion 5 being where this promotion is much stronger. This way you still have the whole experience and leveling system on the unit but they can't get more than a core set of traits (like what is now possible by being able to get ALL hero promotions hypothetically).
Regarding heroes, there are currently promotions that heroes can get (about 10 I think). What I meant StrategyOnly, was that rather than all these promotions being available to all the heroes and them starting out with 1 or whatever initially. They instead would have whichever promotion(s) the designer deems appropriate but no more. Meaning you couldn't hypothetically have a hero with 5+ of these promotions running around in god-mode. Also it allows the developer to stylize the hero more specifically, whereby they aren't differentiated merely by strength and graphics but also by which promotion(s) they have.
Extending this idea even more, like toffer90 suggests is possible to; such as giving these designated promotions levels, such as 1-5, 1 being a weak variation of the promotion 5 being where this promotion is much stronger. This way you still have the whole experience and leveling system on the unit but they can't get more than a core set of traits (like what is now possible by being able to get ALL hero promotions hypothetically).
strategyonly
C2C Supreme Commander
Sounds like some python to me, which i have NO idea how to do
Sounds like some python to me, which i have NO idea how to do
is there no way to disable promotions in xml?
Dancing Hoskuld
Deity
SO, I think that Sgslick, is suggesting that Heroes are defined with some heroic promotions and then can't get any more of the heroic promotions only normal. Which means that teh heroic promotions are not available through experince at all.
Otherwise each hero will need to be its own combat class and each promotion made available to suitable combat classes.
Otherwise each hero will need to be its own combat class and each promotion made available to suitable combat classes.
Thunderbrd
C2C War Dog
Well... you could group those combat classes a bit at least. Warrior Hero, Healer Hero, etc...
Or you could make them all available to the hero combat class and list off the combat classes that the promotion could NOT apply to, narrowing the field to any degree you'd like. We already have a secondary CC on all heroes and we could narrow the field on these promos in that manner - it might be able to reach the definition level SGT Slick is suggesting anyhow.
Or you could make them all available to the hero combat class and list off the combat classes that the promotion could NOT apply to, narrowing the field to any degree you'd like. We already have a secondary CC on all heroes and we could narrow the field on these promos in that manner - it might be able to reach the definition level SGT Slick is suggesting anyhow.
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