HOF Mod Support/Suggestions

[Moonsinger]

Is it possible for the Mod to keep the combat statistic all the way to 4000BC? That would be really nice! Thanks!

 

[ori]

There is a bug which has been annoying me for a couple of weeks now. I can´t really pinpoint it, cause its not really reproduceable. This does not depend on settings and occurs every couple of games.

Every couple of games I start I get the HOF warning on the Dawn of Man screen:



and the Settings screen says CFCs are missing:



when I then exit to the main menu and start a game with the exact same settings I still get the HOF warning in the log, but not on the DoM or Victory screen:



and when I then again exit to main menu and start a game with the same settings the HOF warning is gone:



Since I can work around this thing by restarting the game twice its not a major bug, but it is annoying and I would appreciate any advice.

 

[azzaman333]

I was playing a game w/HOF mod, and i saved the game and quit. After leaving the game for about a day, i loaded it up and the game was much laggier than when i saved it, and the score was gone. Save attached.

 

[Denniz]

There is a bug which has been annoying me for a couple of weeks now. I can´t really pinpoint it, cause its not really reproduceable. This does not depend on settings and occurs every couple of games.

Every couple of games I start I get the HOF warning on the Dawn of Man screen:



and the Settings screen says CFCs are missing:



when I then exit to the main menu and start a game with the exact same settings I still get the HOF warning in the log, but not on the DoM or Victory screen:



and when I then again exit to main menu and start a game with the same settings the HOF warning is gone:



Since I can work around this thing by restarting the game twice its not a major bug, but it is annoying and I would appreciate any advice.

No really sure what's causing that. There was a workaround added for a Civ4 bug where the CRCs weren't being created. Maybe something to do with that. I would check the game on the start file page (login required). If it passes don't worry about the message. We'll take a look at it for the next release.

 

[Denniz]

I was playing a game w/HOF mod, and i saved the game and quit. After leaving the game for about a day, i loaded it up and the game was much laggier than when i saved it, and the score was gone. Save attached.

I loaded the game up. The score thing is weird but it went away the next turn. I didn't notice any lag, though. I sure if it has anything to do with the mod. If it persists on your machine, I might try deleting and replacing the mod. Sorry, I don't know what else to tell you at this point.

 

[azzaman333]

I loaded the game up. The score thing is weird but it went away the next turn. I didn't notice any lag, though. I sure if it has anything to do with the mod. If it persists on your machine, I might try deleting and replacing the mod. Sorry, I don't know what else to tell you at this point.

I was generating some maps for a culture game today, then playing a few turns in to check the area, and my machine seems to get "angry" when i start a 2nd game. It might have something to do with that. (some kind of scripts error)

 

[drkodos]

Just wanted to stop in and say hello because I recently downloaded the mod to test for possible future GotM's that may require it. So far, so good!

Some observations, if I may:

~ Not allowing Fractal Maps yet you allow Map mining with a utility program? I have not found the thread of consistancy in that line of thinking, yet. Also, allowing No Barbs as a setting seems to me to also be starnge and counter-intuive to the process. yes, I read all the reasoning behind not allowing Fractal and I say: So what? If you allow such manipulation of conditions on Deity games to allow players better results, then Fractal decision seems to fit well outside that school of thought.

~ I get a lot of freeze ups during game play that I did not get before. This is annoying. I am not blaming the mod, but it was not happening before the mod was installed. It could be the Blue Marble for all I know. Either way, I do not want to have to use the auto-save every-move-system and thus fill my harddrive with THOUSANDS of games I need to delete later. I'll figure out a way to cope, I am sure.

~ I do think it can make the game easier and improve individual player results. I am not judging that as either good or bad. It's just my observation.

~ I have not figured out how to use the Map Finder at all. I like shiny objects and am easily confused.

All in all, I have been positively impressed. Totally.

I have officially changed my mind so that if this mod is made mandatory, I will accept it and move forward with its use despite my loathing of mods and additional computer housekeeping. I view PCs like I views cars. I want to drive them, not understand nor work on their mechanics. I am a slacker that way, no doubt.



Last word:

Thanks to all that made it possible. It is truly an impressive piece of work, is easy to understand and implement, and really does what it claims to do.

 

[Kalleyao]

~ Not allowing Fractal Maps yet you allow Map mining with a utility program? I have not found the thread of consistancy in that line of thinking, yet. Also, allowing No Barbs as a setting seems to me to also be starnge and counter-intuive to the process. yes, I read all the reasoning behind not allowing Fractal and I say: So what? If you allow such manipulation of conditions on Deity games to allow players better results, then Fractal decision seems to fit well outside that school of thought.

Since you have already read the reasons for excluding fractal: If you don't like it fine, other people do. Same with no barbs.

Anyone is allowed to manipulate the settings so there's no unfairness here. To manipulate effectively is however a skill that not everyone have.

 

[drkodos]

Since you have already read the reasons for excluding fractal: If you don't like it fine, other people do. Same with no barbs.

Anyone is allowed to manipulate the settings so there's no unfairness here. To manipulate effectively is however a skill that not everyone have.

I agree with both those statements, even though the former has no reason to exist unless it is aiming to imbue a mild level of antagonism and the second statement could be applied to allowing Fractal maps, so it is equally a non-sequitar.

Sorry, but you failed to actually address either issue in your pontifications.

 

[Kalleyao]

Sorry, but you failed to actually address either issue in your pontifications.

I wasn't trying to convince you, I just said my opinions.

 

[drkodos]

I wasn't trying to convince you, I just said my opinions.

No worries.

I thought maybe you was just trying to be a bit provocative. Of course it is always a case of "if you don't like, than don't partake," but if people with divergent POV do not speak up, then a community can become rather myopically charged.

As for Fractal maps, I just think it should be a category that people should be able to compete in HOF because it is one of the most popular map choices. My point was the seemingly apparent dichotomy of allowing a map finding utility to find the best and most pimped out maps to play upon, but disallowing a specific map type because it could create good maps to play on? So great maps are ok? But wait, no they are not!

As for manipulations, I was not judging anything, only making observational statements that allowing some types of manipulations and not others is inconsistant. Your thinly veiled defensive position was rather interesting though and I enjoyed reading it almost as much as I enjoy reading your other exploits, which is to say, I enjoyed it a great deal.

 

[Kalleyao]

No worries.

I thought maybe you was just trying to be a bit provocative. Of course it is always a case of "if you don't like, than don't partake," but if people with divergent POV do not speak up, then a community can become rather myopically charged.

As for Fractal maps, I just think it should be a category that people should be able to compete in HOF because it is one of the most popular map choices. My point was the seemingly apparent dichotomy of allowing a map finding utility to find the best and most pimped out maps to play upon, but disallowing a specific map type because it could create good maps to play on? So great maps are ok? But wait, no they are not!

As for manipulations, I was not judging anything, only making observational statements that allowing some types of manipulations and not others is inconsistant. Your thinly veiled defensive position was rather interesting though and I enjoyed reading it almost as much as I enjoy reading your other exploits, which is to say, I enjoyed it a great deal.

Thanks, I thought I had to go for another heated discussion.

Actually I think all maps should be allowed but that discussion ended months ago. I think it's the players' skill to judge whether the map is good orr not.

 

[Dianthus]

Just wanted to stop in and say hello because I recently downloaded the mod to test for possible future GotM's that may require it. So far, so good!

...

I have officially changed my mind so that if this mod is made mandatory, I will accept it and move forward with its use despite my loathing of mods and additional computer housekeeping. I view PCs like I views cars. I want to drive them, not understand nor work on their mechanics. I am a slacker that way, no doubt.

Kudos (as opposed to kodos ) for investigating this for yourself against your better judgement . It might be worth posting the GOTM specific parts of your observations over in the GOTM thread.

~ Not allowing Fractal Maps yet you allow Map mining with a utility program? I have not found the thread of consistancy in that line of thinking, yet. yes, I read all the reasoning behind not allowing Fractal and I say: So what? If you allow such manipulation of conditions on Deity games to allow players better results, then Fractal decision seems to fit well outside that school of thought.

The intention of MapFinder is to just automate something which many HOF players, especially those with far too much time on their hands, would do anyway. The automation also gives the players with less time more of a chance to compete without having to waste their time on anything except actually playing. With the Fractal maps there is more variation between the "best" and "worst" maps. That means finding the best maps is more beneficial with that map type than the others, and makes it potentially over-powered, especially when combined with MapFinder.

Also, allowing No Barbs as a setting seems to me to also be starnge and counter-intuive to the process.

I agree that barbs/no barbs plays quite differently. We didn't want to force players to play one way or the other. It's true that currently most players are playing with no barbs though. When we get around to starting the Quattromasters competetion (the equivalent of Quartermasters in the Civ3 HOF) we're intending to give games played with barbs a higher score.

~ I get a lot of freeze ups during game play that I did not get before. This is annoying. I am not blaming the mod, but it was not happening before the mod was installed. It could be the Blue Marble for all I know.

Did you just start using Blue Marble at the same time? I don't want to just blame the other guy to get us of the hook, but Blue Marble does user higher resolution textures, so will use more main memory and more graphics memory for textures. Would it be possible for you to try the HOF mod without Blue Marble to see if it's more stable then? If there are problems with the HOF mod we definitely want to know about them.

Either way, I do not want to have to use the auto-save every-move-system and thus fill my harddrive with THOUSANDS of games I need to delete later. I'll figure out a way to cope, I am sure.

I'm a bit confused about that. The HOF mod doesn't change the way autosaves work. It still uses the autosave settings in your .ini file, and saves a maximum of once per turn, not every move within a turn. Note that the .ini file allows setting the maximum number of autosaves to keep as well.

~ I have not figured out how to use the Map Finder at all. I like shiny objects and am easily confused.

I'll leave Denniz to answer that one, Map Finder is his baby. I just did some minor SDK changes for it.

 

[drkodos]

It might be worth posting the GOTM specific parts of your observations over in the GOTM thread.

Will do!

Did you just start using Blue Marble at the same time? I don't want to just blame the other guy to get us of the hook, but Blue Marble does user higher resolution textures, so will use more main memory and more graphics memory for textures. Would it be possible for you to try the HOF mod without Blue Marble to see if it's more stable then? If there are problems with the HOF mod we definitely want to know about them.

Yes, I started using them almost simultaneoulsy. I am currently in the process of unistalling the Blue Marble and trying some games (only 2 so far) without it and so far no freeze ups. It is difficult for me to tell, but at this point it seems it is not HOF related. BUT getting in and changing that file to auto-save every 1 turn is something I have anxiety about. Whenever I try to change settings I mess them up. That is my baggage, no one elses.

I'm a bit confused about that. The HOF mod doesn't change the way autosaves work. It still uses the autosave settings in your .ini file, and saves a maximum of once per turn, not every move within a turn. Note that the .ini file allows setting the maximum number of autosaves to keep as well.

All files saved merely get compressed as they get bumped out of the cue. Even after deleting them with recylce bin, they are merely compressed and stored in another area of the drive. They eventually become a part of the overall sclerosis of a computer.

 

[Dianthus]

Yes, I started using them almost simultaneoulsy. I am currently in the process of unistalling the Blue Marble and trying some games (only 2 so far) without it and so far no freeze ups. It is difficult for me to tell, but at this point it seems it is not HOF related.

OK. I'll cross my fingers and hope it's not a HOF mod problem then. I might just bury my head in the sand as well in case that helps .

BUT getting in and changing that file to auto-save every 1 turn is something I have anxiety about. Whenever I try to change settings I mess them up. That is my baggage, no one elses.

Changing the autosaves to every 1 turn isn't absolutely required. It's just a suggestion for those with instability problems.

All files saved merely get compressed as they get bumped out of the cue. Even after deleting them with recylce bin, they are merely compressed and stored in another area of the drive. They eventually become a part of the overall sclerosis of a computer.

Are you sure they get moved to the recycle bin? I was pretty sure they were just completely deleted!

 

[DaviddesJ]

Anyone is allowed to manipulate the settings so there's no unfairness here. To manipulate effectively is however a skill that not everyone have.

For fairness, we really should have just one HOF category, for all difficulty levels from Settler to Deity. Not everyone has the skill to choose effectively among those.

 

[Dianthus]

For fairness, we really should have just one HOF category, for all difficulty levels from Settler to Deity. Not everyone has the skill to choose effectively among those.

Is that something you really believe? Or are you just trying to cause trouble?

 

[DaviddesJ]

Is that something you really believe? Or are you just trying to cause trouble?

I'm trying to illustrate the vapidity of certain arguments that are commonly made here (the idea that choosing a more favorable map over a less favorable one is a measure of skill). I hope that pointing out how silly that is doesn't create "trouble", but just enlightenment.

 

[Dianthus]

I'm trying to illustrate the vapidity of certain arguments that are commonly made here (the idea that choosing a more favorable map over a less favorable one is a measure of skill). I hope that pointing out how silly that is doesn't create "trouble", but just enlightenment.

Ah, I see. There's definitely *some* skill involved in picking settings, but the skill required to play the game is on a completely different level to that required to pick the settings.

 

[DaviddesJ]

Ah, I see. There's definitely *some* skill involved in picking settings, but the skill required to play the game is on a completely different level to that required to pick the settings.

There's certainly *some* skill, but even if you didn't have that skill, you could just copy the settings other people use. So it's hard to believe that that factor has any influence at all on who achieves high scores. Compared to actually playing the game, which (aside from some degenerate map settings where the game basically "plays itself"), you can't really copy everything from someone else's successful game without having the skill to play it yourself.

Just as, even if you couldn't figure out which of "Settler" and "Deity" is easier to beat, you could still just follow what everyone else does.