Homosexuals Get Equal Rights In New Jersey

[.Shane.]

I think they should be given equal rights. Privileges are up for negotiation.

Again w/ the semantics dance.

You either think they should be treated fairly, or you don't. It would appear that you don't.

----

Speaking more generally, I think its funny that so many conservatives who bleat about wishy washy liberals play that exact game when trying to construct an anti-gay marriage argument out of their trainwrecks of tortured logic. Have some balls. Just say it, "I don't want gays to be treated the same way I am."

 

[Elrohir]

And what if it isn't specified, either way?

Then the courts should urge the legislature to be specific. Not pretend that rights exist that are being violated.

Those changes are as unjust as saying homosexuals cannot get married because they are homosexuals.

No, a homosexual can get married - to a person of the opposite sex. A homosexual just can't marry someone of the same sex, and neither can a heterosexual. I don't care who you're attracted to, but you can't marry someone of the opposite sex.

If that wasn't clear, I can rephrase.

Sorry, but "majority rules" is BS.

The Constitution recognized and institutionalized the rights of the minority in any number of ways. Best example is the construction of Congress. The Senate reflects just the opposite of majority rule. Thus, North Dakota, population ~500k has the same rights as California, population ~30 million. So, California has ~60 times the pop of ND but in the Senate we are equals. Majority rule my ass.

Majority rules, except when that would contradict the constitution. (And like I said, even then you can overrule the constitution with a large enough majority) If you don't like the fact that SD is as represented in the Senate as California, petition your Congressmen to organize a constitutional amendment, or constitutional convention. That's your right as a citizen.

Again w/ the semantics dance.

You either think they should be treated fairly, or you don't. It would appear that you don't.

That depends on how you define fairly. I think under my system they would be treated fairly, but obviously you don't.

 

[Godwynn]

I don't care who you're attracted to, but you can't marry someone of the opposite sex.

Then why are you arguing against same-sex marriage?

 

[GenMarshall]

I do pray that New Jersey would reconsider and only leave marriage between a man and a woman.

 

[Zarn]

Majority doesn't rule. This is a Federal Republic not a true Democracy.

 

[cegman]

You know it is a good thing your GOD doesn't exist CivGeneral so that these citizens who are being treated like southern blacks were are given the same PRIVILAGES. You are as bad as any member of the KKK CivGeneral

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[Mark1031]

I don't think that would be just, no, for either of those things. Banning them from having drivers licenses would, I believe, be legal, though. As for doubling taxes, I doubt it would be, as most tax codes only allow people to pay different amounts based upon whether they are married, have children, how much they give to charity, that sort of thing. It would require a substantial rewiring of how taxes are levied.

Tax code would be very easy to rewrite it is done every year. And part of the greatness of the US and most modern western countries is that I don't have to depend on what you or a majority of citizens think is just. And just to be clear you think it is "legal" (although not necessarily right) to discriminate against gays in anything that is not a fundimental right mentioned in the constitution so it would be legal to deny gays the right to.

housing rental
bank loans and mortages
education
jobs
drivers licenses
proportionate taxation

Basically all of these things would be fine if it were not for the equal protection clause of the 14th ammendment to the US constitution. I personally do not want to live in your country where these forms of discrimination are "legal".

 

[Zarn]

You know it is a good thing your GOD doesn't exist CivGeneral so that these citizens who are being treated like southern blacks were are given the same PRIVILAGES. You are as bad as any member of the KKK CivGeneral

Just what do you mean by 'your God?'

Edit: You know what, just pm me the answer.

 

[GenMarshall]

You know it is a good thing your GOD doesn't exist CivGeneral so that these citizens who are being treated like southern blacks were are given the same PRIVILAGES.

I am sorry to say but God (&#31070 does exist, So lets drop the existence of God and please take it someplace else. No need to threadjack this thread into an argument of the existence of God. In regards to privileges and rights, THEY already have the right to marry, the right to marry someone of the opposite sex!

You are as bad as any member of the KKK CivGeneral

Excuse me? But do I go around killing homosexuals? NO. Do I go around killing African Americans? NO And do I go around killing Catholics, Ops, you forgot the KKK are anti-Catholic so how can I be a member of the KKK when they are hostile to Catholics. its quite illogical for a Catholic to be a member of an anti-Catholic organization. I say to you that I dont do any of the things the KKK does.

 

[.Shane.]

I do pray that New Jersey would reconsider and only leave marriage between a man and a woman.

Yes, and while you're praying ask him for more hentai DVDs...

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[GenMarshall]

Yes, and while you're praying ask him more hentai DVDs...

Newsflash, I don't watch hentai.

 

[Cuivienen]

How many does that make now?

Civil Union:
1. Vermont
2. Connecticut
3. New Jersey

Marriage:
1. Massachussetts

Of course, we don't know yet whether it will be civil unions or marriage in New Jersey, and polls do show that the majority of New Jerseyans support same-sex marriage. (I was rather surprised by the polls, actually. New Jersey is usually leftist rather than liberal. OTOH, it also has more religious minorities than any other state.)

 

[IglooDame]

Then the courts should urge the legislature to be specific. Not pretend that rights exist that are being violated.

Does New Jersey have 'equal protection under the law' in their state constitution?

No, a homosexual can get married - to a person of the opposite sex. A homosexual just can't marry someone of the same sex, and neither can a heterosexual. I don't care who you're attracted to, but you can't marry someone of the opposite sex.

If that wasn't clear, I can rephrase.

Man, there are enough dead horses in CFC to supply McD's with their 'beef' for the next few billion to serve.

But anyway... Would you care to explain why someone has the 'right' to marry a prospective spouse of any race, but not of any gender?

 

[.Shane.]

Would you care to explain why someone has the 'right' to marry a prospective spouse of any race, but not of any gender?

Per my prior posts, you'll never get a straight answer (pun woefully intended). You'll just get these ridiculous semantic posturing where they try and bury bigotry under some kind of "we're defending the Constitution" breastplate of righteousness.

 

[Atlas14]

Bah, they should all be entitled to civil unions but marriage status should be up to the state.

 

[Taliesin]

From the linked article:

"Although we cannot find that a fundamental right to same-sex marriage exists in this state, the unequal dispensation of rights and benefits to committed same-sex partners can no longer be tolerated under our state Constitution," Justice Barry T. Albin wrote for the 4-3 majority's decision.

"Marriage is a privilege not a right," at least as far as this thread goes, is a strawman: the court's decision does not presume otherwise.

 

[Oruc]

Just call it a civil union and be done with it.

 

[sysyphus]

Good for New Jersey! Welcome to the 21st century!

I do pray that New Jersey would reconsider and only leave marriage between a man and a woman.

Don't worry, nobody's going to make you marry someone of the same gender.

 

[Tycoon101]

...No comment...


I just feel that is all that I need to say.

 

[Truronian]

Woohay! Lets hope they keep sliding down the slippery slope . I find the whole 'don't call it marriage' stance a tad... petty... to be honest.

Marriage isn't a right, it's a privilege, and it is perfectly legitimate to restrict it to whoever society thinks should use it.

Rights are what the majority declares them to be, and as such are no different from 'privileges'.

In regards to privileges and rights, THEY already have the right to marry, the right to marry someone of the opposite sex!

They do not, however, have the right/freedom to marry who they love.