Houston, we are not alone..

I started that thread 1 1/2 years ago and it ended about 15 months ago...

And he accused me of not caring to understand his pointless argument... I didn't see an argument, he just told me to accept the consensus followed by his insults.

Now where was I condescending? Where did I tell you to just accept what I say because I know better than you? I dont appreciate his attitude, especially on Christmas. You'd think one day of the year people could discuss a subject without getting nasty.
 
Moderator Action: This is where I point out that if the bickering continues, there will be no more reason to continue this thread. It's Christmas. Be nice to your fellow posters. If you can't, then don't post.
 
It'd be really really really really weird because it means that a whole bunch of incredibly unlikely situations all happened over and over and over

Almost like it was scripted, you know? And that's weird because as far as we know the universe has no cause and no creator

Really unlikely things happening isn't weird though. Would it be really, really weird if there is no other celestial body in the universe that has exactly the same size, shape, mass, composition and surface features as the Moon (complete with American flag)? Billions of years of unique events formed that into the body that it is, but it wasn't scripted. Maybe it has an identical twin or two out there somewhere, but I wouldn't consider it weird if there aren't any. It only becomes weird if you attach some specific importance to that particular formation of matter. Life is just a thing that happens if you arrange certain bits of matter in a certain way. It could be incredibly unlikely and it might have only happened here, there's nothing weird about that thought.
 
Really unlikely things happening isn't weird though.

Let's say you wake up one day and you learn that you won the lottery. A really unlikely event, but like you said, unlikely events happening isn't weird. But what would be weird would be you winning the lottery 5,518 times in a row, assuming you weren't cheating, and in between each of the wins you got struck by lightning and lived to tell about it

If that happened I'd also suspect that it was scripted, somehow, even though it's technically possible
 
Let's say you wake up one day and you learn that you won the lottery. A really unlikely event, but like you said, unlikely events happening isn't weird. But what would be weird would be you winning the lottery 5,518 times in a row, assuming you weren't cheating, and in between each of the wins you got struck by lightning and lived to tell about it

If that happened I'd also suspect that it was scripted, somehow, even though it's technically possible

If some high percentage of planets in the universe had civilisations like ours on them, would you still consider it to be weird for that to have happened to someone, on one of those worlds, once? Ignoring the fact that no-one would play the lottery 5,518 in a row if they kept winning that is.

Or think about your own existence for that matter. Of the billions of people on the planet, what are the odds that 2 specific ones would meet and get into a relationship and have sex at the particular time/place/position such that exactly the "right" sperm out of millions of them would lead to your existence? And then think that the same is true for each of them, and each of their parents going back for hundreds of millions of years. Was that scripted too?
 
Let's say you wake up one day and you learn that you won the lottery. A really unlikely event, but like you said, unlikely events happening isn't weird. But what would be weird would be you winning the lottery 5,518 times in a row, assuming you weren't cheating, and in between each of the wins you got struck by lightning and lived to tell about it

If that happened I'd also suspect that it was scripted, somehow, even though it's technically possible
If you believe the universe is infinite then your improbable repeat scenario is actually a certainty.

This doesn't require a divine or supernatural script. If something is possible then it has happened an infinite number of times already and will happen again an infinity more times. That's the nature of infinity.
 
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If some high percentage of planets in the universe had civilisations like ours on them, would you still consider it to be weird for that to have happened to someone, on one of those worlds, once?

I would do the math and get back to you. Right now I'm having trouble comparing the odds I gave in that particular example to the size of the Universe in my head

Or think about your own existence for that matter. Of the billions of people on the planet, what are the odds that 2 specific ones would meet and get into a relationship and have sex at the particular time/place/position such that exactly the "right" sperm out of millions of them would lead to your existence? And then think that the same is true for each of them, and each of their parents going back for hundreds of millions of years. Was that scripted too?

No, you're just describing human fornication. That happens all the time, around the clock, all over the planet. It's not weird, it's expected

hobbsyoyo said:
If you believe the universe is infinite then your improbable repeat scenario is actually a certainty.

My stance is "We don't know, but it appears to be finite" and "It appears it's not impossible for it to be infinite"

I also don't believe that just because something is possible in an infinite universe, that it will happen. Some things will just never happen and some scenarios will just never arise.
 
someplace else on the web ı have been called names , many of them worse than an UFO believer , which is like an insult . Because America needs to prove it's like totally above the rest of mankind and can even fight Aliens , everybody lauds the superior US tech . Takes like weeks for my posts to arrive , if ever so there you are :


ı will behave , so Help me God .

what's the deal ? Why stuff unacceptable becomes hotly debateable when the source is American ? Oh , ı will grant American Exceptionalism , down to imagination . Comic book , Machines try to perfect delivering Terminators , run many tests . Before Sarah Connor learns what the hell , the US Goverment collects 27 specimens throughout the world , China has three , the French might have one . Aren't people banned right away when they link videos of lights in the sky ? Allow me saving you people from the whys and hows of it in some tiresome rant , yet ı come here and click on a link and first thing ı see is that the chief witness is capable enough to behave in 10 episodes straight in TV documentary . ı will grant comments elsewhere that presents an image of "Wow" is justified . If something really jams your "must-be-utterly-capable" radar it can't be a cloud reflecting car headlights . ı go around the blog the link directs to and hey there's an episode , the Alert pilot scrambles so unexpectedly that he barely has time to do his straps and two Iranian Frogfoots are right over the carrier , he just might gun one down off the bow , witnessed by hundreds .

so (USS) Princeton watching a light for 2 weeks and is interested and calls on planes , passing by . So , why not the Alert plane ? Not that people would slur American weapons -now that 9X was no good for a almost 1950s design and it [the Syrian Fitter recently shot down] took an AMRAAM . We could cut you some slack , you know , Aliens being being Aliens have very high and alien tech ... Such interest in the optics and devices that capture the image , colourful language in the tapes . Every site stressing the Witness desiring to fly one . Why , Andromeda Spacelines hiring ? And Iranian "experience" all over . Since when Iranians are "reliable" in anything ? But it's cool when America gets blamed for having Mach 10 craft . Just like no American teen can be allowed to think that any nation on Earth could win in a race to capture non-operational Terminators ; when America was in .

never minding ı got Trojans out of the blog , seen by my like 6 months old anti-virus programme ; luckily am accustomed to a notion that really dangerous ones are not visible anyhow .

yet , the best is reserved for the last . Some other blog (that calls Russia as a Rogue State) reports on an American Airforce poll . And people decide the real life equivalent of the X-Wing is ... F-15E . Blows up everything that's down , shoots down anything that's up . And not the F-22 . You see , Incom's T-65 is not stealthy . ı assume lack of alignment , corner reflection situation when the S-Foil is up , plus all that cooling that's required .

(there's a lot of good vibe for that other product of a company L. but we all avoid naming that like the plague .)
 
@warpus
The light speed horizon means we can never be sure the universe is truly infinite, I think. So scepticism is healthy. However, you cannot separate infinite repetition from an infinite universe; it's a fundamental consequence of a true infinity.
 
@warpus
The light speed horizon means we can never be sure the universe is truly infinite, I think. So scepticism is healthy. However, you cannot separate infinite repetition from an infinite universe; it's a fundamental consequence of a true infinity.

Hm... While 1,2,3... goes to infinity, you can have infinite sets of 1,2 but that isn't really the same, no? I mean... infinite sets of finite elements would seem to not require the same state as an actually differentiating (from a set point of view) infinite progression. Though maybe what you said has no tie to what i said in the first place :D
 
@warpusThe light speed horizon means we can never be sure the universe is truly infinite, I think. So scepticism is healthy.

We can never be sure in terms of observational evidence, but what if we figure out the Universe's exact mathematical model, and it's infinite in nature? Isn't that a possibility?

However, you cannot separate infinite repetition from an infinite universe; it's a fundamental consequence of a true infinity.

I disagree, you can think of an infinite set that does not contain everything. For example {1,3,5,7,9,11,...}
 
That was unfair, I shouldn't call that a tantrum...
Don't make him angry, you wouldn't like him when he's angry. There are aspects of is personality that he cannot control.....[insert Hulk smiley here]
Besides, provoking a rocket scientist rarely ends well......:mischief:
 
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