How would you define middle-aged?

[BenitoChavez]

Sure. Let's move it

Moderator Action: -> Done. The_J

 

[Valka D'Ur]

You've never been a young man. Even a young white man will be stopped by police and followed round the shop by security guards.

Please don't deign to tell me my own lived experience.

And don't presume to assume I haven't been followed around a store. I've never been a young man, but you've never been a low-income disabled woman.

 

[Tee Kay]

35 - 54 year olds

Organs start failing, perception of risks change, teenagers call you a boomer unironically, you get comments along the lines of "aren't you a bit too old to change careers"; made up for by the fact that people with power and privilege take you more seriously in contexts outside of your presumed criminal tendencies.

We can't really use life events as hallmarks of middle age anymore because traditional expectations of adulthood and families and career progression have been thrown out the window at least in most of the West. But physiology and brain chemistry get all of us in more or less the same way.

 

[Narz]

I love when people still call me young man.

I'd say middle age is 45-55

 

[EgonSpengler]

35 - 54 year olds

Organs start failing, perception of risks change, teenagers call you a boomer unironically, you get comments along the lines of "aren't you a bit too old to change careers"; made up for by the fact that people with power and privilege take you more seriously in contexts outside of your presumed criminal tendencies.

We can't really use life events as hallmarks of middle age anymore because traditional expectations of adulthood and families and career progression have been thrown out the window at least in most of the West. But physiology and brain chemistry get all of us in more or less the same way.

You just named 5 life events as hallmarks of middle age. Anyway, "people with power and privilege take you more seriously" is interesting. I hadn't thought of that one.

 

[Narz]

35 - 54 year olds

made up for by the fact that people with power and privilege take you more seriously in contexts outside of your presumed criminal tendencies

I dunno. If you haven't "gotten it together" by this age people tend to take you less seriously whereas when you're young people still have hope. Mostly talking about family members. Speaking in general of course nothing to do w me

 

[warpus]

How would you define middle-aged?

I don't. I live my life and if somebody wants to label me as something, then go for it, I guess. People care far too much about labels. I don't really care

 

[GinandTonic]

And don't presume to assume I haven't been followed around a store. I've never been a young man, but you've never been a low-income disabled woman.

I didn't tell you anything about your experience

 

[Harv]

...somewhere between the fall of Rome and 1453.

 

[amadeus]

When you go to the doctor and the doctor is younger than you.

 

[Berzerker]

middle age begins about 46-50 and runs to 66-70

 

[Valka D'Ur]

I didn't tell you anything about your experience

You accused me of something I didn't do, or at least did not intend to do. It's a fact that there are numerous reasons store employees cite for following people around, whether they harass them or not, whether they kick them out or not.

Yes, there are store employees who make faulty assumptions about people based on age. There are employees who assume that every indigenous person in Canada is going to shoplift or cause some sort of problem. FFS, there was a man and his granddaughter in BC who were handcuffed by the cops - called by a bank employee who couldn't wrap her racist head around the fact that many indigenous Canadians have alternate forms of ID (status cards, etc.) and assumed that these two were attempting to perpetrate a fraud, when they were just trying to open a bank account for the granddaughter. One of my hospital roommates in 2019 came back to the room, crying and upset because an employee in the shop downstairs had accused her of stealing a pack of gum (she was there to buy something else and had no reason to want gum or steal anything at all). She's indigenous.

The number of times I've been profiled because I use a walker with an attached basket or box to hold my purchases, coat, medical supplies (never leave home without your testing kit if you're diabetic), etc. has been frustrating. One woman at the mall assumed I was homeless. Another at the library - one of their employees - looked at me suspiciously as she thought I was a drug addict. I explained to her that I'm diabetic and had to take insulin. That's not the sort of thing that can wait for other people's convenience. Constant "may I help you" from clerks following someone around a clothing department isn't an attempt to be helpful. It's a way of checking up to make sure the customer isn't taking something, and it's meant to push them along and leave, especially if they just assume the person can't afford what the merchandise is and is planning to steal something. After the third "may I help you" while the clerk was following me around resulted in my telling her, "I said no, thank you" twice already. Trust me, if I need help I will ask for it." I don't shop there anymore (even before the pandemic; my clothes shopping is online now).

So if you're being profiled, that's obviously frustrating for you. But keep in mind that it's not just you. It's a lot of people, for reasons that store employees and bank employees are too ignorant or prejudiced to get that they're jumping to unwarranted conclusions.

35 - 54 year olds

Organs start failing, perception of risks change, teenagers call you a boomer unironically, you get comments along the lines of "aren't you a bit too old to change careers"; made up for by the fact that people with power and privilege take you more seriously in contexts outside of your presumed criminal tendencies.

We can't really use life events as hallmarks of middle age anymore because traditional expectations of adulthood and families and career progression have been thrown out the window at least in most of the West. But physiology and brain chemistry get all of us in more or less the same way.

So what comes after age 54? Some places here start offering seniors' discounts to people 50 and up. I was pleasantly surprised that there are some days when one of the pharmacies I shopped at would offer seniors' discounts to people 55 and up. There are some women who are irrationally vain about their ages and would have told the clerk off for asking if they qualified for that discount. As for me, I'm not going to turn down a 20% discount. And to me, age is just a matter of how many times I've gone around the Sun. Until we have space travel and can live on a starship, we're all in the same situation. We're going to get one year older every year, whether we want to or not.

The woman who taught me how to play Civ II was someone determined not to let her age define her. At 60+ years she achieved a double Arts & Sciences degree in the SCA's University of Ithra (something few people achieve at all, even if they spend many more years taking classes than she did). She was part of our Star Trek society, and an avid RPG and board gamer. And when people told her to "grow up and act your age" she'd tell them off. She'd spent far too much of her younger years going along with what society expected of her, and after she finally had her independence, she intended to remain young in heart and mind as long as possible.

Life caught up with her in the end, of course. She developed Alzheimers, and I know from experience how hard that is for a family to deal with. She died some years ago, but for about 30 of those years she was determined to enjoy herself in the SCA and in the SF and gaming communities.

...somewhere between the fall of Rome and 1453.

The Society for Creative Anachronism, for convenience, defines the "Current Middle Ages", aka "in period" as being 600-1600 (to accommodate the Plantagenet-Tudor wars).

My own persona is based in the late 10th century.

 

[Tee Kay]

If you haven't "gotten it together" by this age people tend to take you less seriously whereas when you're young people still have hope. Mostly talking about family members.

It's different if you know the person. I'm talking, like, encounters with strangers and/or public figures, where first appearance matters.

And even if you don't "have it together" at 45 you're still afford a measure of... not quite respect, but take-you-seriousness that comes with being a person of more advanced age and presumed more experience.

At the very least, middle aged people who screwed up aren't expected to make something themselves. People give up on you. And that might come as a relief compared to the kind of pressure that younger people face to "make it"

When you go to the doctor and the doctor is younger than you.

I think I might already be there oh no

So what comes after age 54?

Early seniority at 55 - 64; you're reproductively useless but evolution kept you around as extra childcare and to impart life lessons to the younguns. Followed by late seniority at 64 - 75, when you're either too old to work or gets told you're too old to work and to vacate your positions for people younger and more in touch with current societal realities. Anything after 75 is extra time, you're well past the average life expectancy of a human being and you're not really expected to do anything except by right-wing reactionary demagogues who love the thing you do at election time.

Don't get me wrong I'm glad you and many others don't let age define you and I hope I never "act my age" either. However, aging bodies and cognitive functions and changed social expectations and the cumulative years of experiences are still real things that shape life no matter how much one insists that age is just a number.

 

[AmazonQueen]

Definitions of middle-age and old age are changing in rich countries due to increased life expectancy, improved medical care, better diet etc.
My mum is 82 and golfs and gardens. Her mother was visually impaired (couldn't read or watch TV) and used a wheelchair whenever she left the house (and a walking frame in the house) when she was 70-ish.
I'd say middle-age is 50-70 now.

 

[Farm Boy]

What is "making it?" Its just money. And prestige. That's timeless, the same people care about money at 40 as did at 10, for the most part.

Some of the finest people I know to have in the life, rich and giving personalities that actually color in the day? Almost totally incompetent at the American vision of "making it." I'd probably just discount the concept, it's probably beneath you.

 

[Snerk]

People who still hang out on forums.

 

[Valka D'Ur]

People who still hang out on forums.

Some CFC members aren't even out of high school. They can't possibly be considered middle-aged. Even Aimee and Synsensa - the two youngest OT regulars I've regularly interacted with - can't be considered middle-aged.

 

[Snerk]

Some CFC members aren't even out of high school. They can't possibly be considered middle-aged. Even Aimee and Synsensa - the two youngest OT regulars I've regularly interacted with - can't be considered middle-aged.

Sure, it was half a joke. But generally speaking we're probably an aging demographic though.

Also I'm not middle aged either. And if anybody says otherwise I will choose violence.

 

[Valka D'Ur]

But generally speaking we're probably an aging demographic though.

I don't disagree with that. But it's still unsettling to realize that some people here are old enough to be my hypothetical adult grandchildren.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

At this point? A year or two older than I am. Forever.

I don't disagree with that. But it's still unsettling to realize that some people here are old enough to be my hypothetical adult grandchildren.

I get the same feeling when people I talk to on Discord "used to watch my videos when they were kids". Oof.