I hope the game isn't boring for returning Civfanatics

[Thormodr]

Given that you appear to be waiting for more information, I do encourage you to check out the design team interviews available on video, particularly the Twitch.tv set from Firaxis: http://www.twitch.tv/firaxisgames/c/4858326

After you go through the set and perhaps watch one or two independent preview gameplay videos, I'd love to hear your reactions to them. If this doesn't change your mind, fine, but it would interest me to know why not.

That sounds fair. I'll check them out sometime this week.

 

[Acken]

I doubt you'd like it if you disliked Civ5 to begin with (expansion included, vanilla was agreeably lacking content) or if 1UPT is your nightmare. The game certainly is a spin-off of Civ5, using the same engine and gameplay but with different mechanics.

It's clearly a game for those wanting more of Civilization in the continuation of Civ5 (or newcomers).

 

[omniclast]

I'll just be happy if they make some basic fixes that are still really needed in Civ, like better AI and multiplayer stability. Sadly I think that's at the bottom of the to do list, so my frustrations with the core game's poor functionality will remain in BE.

 

[Civ'ed]

I'll just be happy if they make some basic fixes that are still really needed in Civ, like better AI and multiplayer stability. Sadly I think that's at the bottom of the to do list, so my frustrations with the core game's poor functionality will remain in BE.

isn't there a thread on the front page which mentions the AI and MP have both been improved

 

[gunnergoz]

At the risk of repeating myself, I just want to say that I see a level of design focus in BE that was absent in Civ V at this point of its public exposition. That focus may well translate to a more finely tuned AI. Or so we can hope. I remain optimistic until proven wrong.

 

[omniclast]

isn't there a thread on the front page which mentions the AI and MP have both been improved

The AI will definitely need new capabilities to deal with the new mechanics, which was talked about in the thread... but whether it will be smarter and more adaptive is something we'll have to play the game to determine.

Sadly I don't speak German, but didn't see anything about MP in that thread. Haven't heard anything from Firaxis about MP at all, really, which I find concerning. Human players are so much more interesting and challenging than AIs, but the game really isn't playable when you can drop 3 times in thirty minutes on an 18mbps connection -- particular if you're playing FFA and there's no way to get added back.

 

[gunnergoz]

One of the co-lead designers mentioned that the Aliens have their own AI, unlike the barbarians of the past which basically had simple scripts. It looks like some thought went into making BE different in this way as well.

 

[Civ'ed]

but didn't see anything about MP in that thread.

MP got some love and "should be more stable" now.
Hot-seat, but no pit-boss.

5chars

 

[Acken]

At the risk of repeating myself, I just want to say that I see a level of design focus in BE that was absent in Civ V at this point of its public exposition. That focus may well translate to a more finely tuned AI. Or so we can hope. I remain optimistic until proven wrong.

Yes I also think CivBE has a lot of potential but I doubt an improvement over civ5 would please someone that hates civ5. The guy didn't even know it was 1UPT and based on his reaction it's not a better AI (if) and a tech web that will please him.

Trying to convince someone to like a game is the same loss of time that the OP did trying to convince others to hate the game (or the other "don't preorder" thread). It's stupid, pueril and nobody cares what people do with their money.

 

[Thormodr]

Yes I also think CivBE has a lot of potential but I doubt an improvement over civ5 would please someone that hates civ5. The guy didn't even know it was 1UPT and based on his reaction it's not a better AI (if) and a tech web that will please him.

Trying to convince someone to like a game is the same loss of time that the OP did trying to convince others to hate the game (or the other "don't preorder" thread). It's stupid, pueril and nobody cares what people do with their money.

Wow! Such hostility! Call off the dogs, please.

People have raised justifiable concerns about the quality of this upcoming game. Being rude and dismissive isn't helping matters.

 

[Lucius_]

People have raised justifiable concerns about the quality of this upcoming game. Being rude and dismissive isn't helping matters.

Not really. Most concerns I've seen have either been unfounded and very subjective or largely niche. Imo, the only major issue would be AI, which Civ has never shined at. If it's not improved, will any Civ player ever be surprised?

Many of the complaints feel like they are coming from people who hate CiV and BE gives a new opportunity to spread their perceived grievances.

Multiplayer folks have some real complaints, but Civ has always been about the core game first and mp second. It appears the majority of players have little interest in multiplayer and Firaxis's priorities reflect that.

I think the assessment is correct. Civ:BE is a CiV spinoff that borrows heavily from it in graphics and base gameplay, but certainly different mechanically that I expect it will play very differently. If CiV, particularly 1UPT, was an utter failure in one's opinion, it's highly unlikely you'd be interested in it's spin-off game.

 

[Thormodr]

Not really. Most concerns I've seen have either been unfounded and very subjective or largely niche. Imo, the only major issue would be AI, which Civ has never shined at. If it's not improved, will any Civ player ever be surprised?

Many of the complaints feel like they are coming from people who hate CiV and BE gives a new opportunity to spread their perceived grievances.

Multiplayer folks have some real complaints, but Civ has always been about the core game first and mp second. It appears the majority of players have little interest in multiplayer and Firaxis's priorities reflect that.

I think the assessment is correct. Civ:BE is a CiV spinoff that borrows heavily from it in graphics and base gameplay, but certainly different mechanically that I expect it will play very differently. If CiV, particularly 1UPT, was an utter failure in one's opinion, it's highly unlikely you'd be interested in it's spin-off game.

These of course are only your opinions. They are most certainly subjective, as well.

The quality of AI is a very valid concern. It was poor, to be charitable, in Civilization 5.

Diplomacy was not very good at all, either.

Multi Player was not good at all. This was exacerbated by the fact that the single player experience was so bad. Partly due to the bad diplomacy and AI.

1UPT is of course a personal choice. I happen to think it's horrendous. However, if you are going to have it, at the very, very least have an AI that can understand it.

A lot of people considered Civilization 5 a giant step backwards for the franchise. We have a right to express our concern when Civilization 5: Beyond Dearth appears to be more of the same. Sure there are some cosmetic changes here and there and there is a sci-fi theme but it's essentially warmed over meatloaf. At least, it sure looks that way, so far.

 

[Sprenk]

A lot of people considered Civilization 5 a giant step backwards for the franchise. We have a right to express our concern when Civilization 5: Beyond Dearth appears to be more of the same. Sure there are some cosmetic changes here and there and there is a sci-fi theme but it's essentially warmed over meatloaf. At least, it sure looks that way, so far.

This thread has been amusing so far, and you're certainly welcome to your opinions, but I have trouble sympathizing with your cries of persecution ("Wow! Such hostility! Call off the dogs, please.") when you're the one who has released the hounds? "Giant step backwards"? "Warmed over meatloaf"? It certainly seemed like you are trying to stir up a response--so enjoy what you wrought!

At the very least, could you lose the sophomoric "Beyond Dearth" joke? Using it once is unworthy of you. Using it multiple times is a crime against the comic muse.

 

[Thormodr]

This thread has been amusing so far, and you're certainly welcome to your opinions, but I have trouble sympathizing with your cries of persecution ("Wow! Such hostility! Call off the dogs, please.") when you're the one who has released the hounds? "Giant step backwards"? "Warmed over meatloaf"? It certainly seemed like you are trying to stir up a response--so enjoy what you wrought!

At the very least, could you lose the sophomoric "Beyond Dearth" joke? Using it once is unworthy of you. Using it multiple times is a crime against the comic muse.

Meh. I am not claiming to be persecuted. I am merely asking for civility.

As far as dearth goes, sorry you don't see the clever wit in this.

dearth
[durth]

noun
1.
an inadequate supply; scarcity; lack:
There is a dearth of good engineers.
2.
scarcity and dearness of food; famine.

Synonyms
1. shortage, want, paucity, insufficiency.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/dearth

I found Civilization 5 to be wholly insufficient. It had a shortage of fun and was severely wanting in many departments.

Therefore, although there will be some that think this latest helping of warmed over meatloaf is fantastic, it shall remain Civilization 5: Beyond Dearth as it is following in the footsteps of a wholly insufficient game.

 

[SupremacyKing]

A lot of people considered Civilization 5 a giant step backwards for the franchise. We have a right to express our concern when Civilization 5: Beyond Dearth appears to be more of the same. Sure there are some cosmetic changes here and there and there is a sci-fi theme but it's essentially warmed over meatloaf. At least, it sure looks that way, so far.

That opinion might made sense a couple months ago when all we had were some screenshots of the early game but now I have a real hard time understanding this point of view when we know about the covert ops system which is greatly expanded with new missions and features, when the affinities system is brand new and unlike anything seen before in civ, when there is a brand new orbital layer that is unlike anything in a previous civ game etc... Those seem like much more than cosmetic changes to me, those are brand new features and systems that change how the game will be played.

 

[Sprenk]

Thormodr, you had to go and EXPLAIN your "dearth" joke?!

But yes, civility is good. And, compared to other game forums, we are very civil here.

 

[Thormodr]

That opinion might made sense a couple months ago when all we had were some screenshots of the early game but now I have a real hard time understanding this point of view when we know about the covert ops system which is greatly expanded with new missions and features, when the affinities system is brand new and unlike anything seen before in civ, when there is a brand new orbital layer that is unlike anything in a previous civ game etc... Those seem like much more than cosmetic changes to me, those are brand new features and systems that change how the game will be played.

Affinities may be brand new as well as the tech tree being rejiggered but how will that all pan out gameplay wise?

Will it just be, I'm friendly to aliens so I'll choose all the alien friendly techs in the tech tree/web or I'm hostile to aliens so I'll choose all the killing aliens techs in the tech tree/web. The other one will be somewhere in between.

Same with the virtues/social policies.

So far, the game looks like it will be interesting the first couple of times but I do wonder about the replayability which has been a hallmark of the Civ series.

Summation, will there be enough interesting choices to make or will the game basically make them for you?

 

[Thormodr]

Thormodr, you had to go and EXPLAIN your "dearth" joke?!

But yes, civility is good. And, compared to other game forums, we are very civil here.

I figured you hadn't understood the subtle nuances.

Anyway, yes, the forums here are quite civil. I've been on other ones that are free for alls in that regard.

 

[ResistancKnight]

Harmony does not equal friendly to aliens. If anything Harmony wants to be to the new planet what humans were to earth.

That said, re-playability might be an issue. As it stands, you only have 3 victory types; your affinity, contact, or domination. And (as far as I know, if I'm wrong correct me) there aren't any unique units or buildings dedicated to each civ. So eventually it'll boil down to robots vs alien/neohumans vs pure humans, no matter the nation you choose.

On one hand, as it was before the only time you had different units fighting was when one civ had a tech advantage, but on the the other it almost feels like your affinity will overshadow your civilization, and I kinda have mixed feelings on that.

 

[Thormodr]

Harmony does not equal friendly to aliens. If anything Harmony wants to be to the new planet what humans were to earth.

That said, re-playability might be an issue. As it stands, you only have 3 victory types; your affinity, contact, or domination. And (as far as I know, if I'm wrong correct me) there aren't any unique units or buildings dedicated to each civ. So eventually it'll boil down to robots vs alien/neohumans vs pure humans, no matter the nation you choose.

On one hand, as it was before the only time you had different units fighting was when one civ had a tech advantage, but on the the other it almost feels like your affinity will overshadow your civilization, and I kinda have mixed feelings on that.

Interesting observations. Affinities overshadowing the civs doesn't sound good. In a way, you'd only have 3 civs in the game and that would definitely impact on replayability.