Imperium Romanorum

I would also try to draft a constitution. But I won't be able to before Thursday.

My two cents: the Consuls should have control of the military and the foreign policy, and also be members of the senate. And moar, if I had more time...
 
I praise Patrician Marcus for his mentions on compromise. But until I hear the other two propositions that notable Patricians like Valerius Claudius Filius Nocti and Ioannes JoanK Calibus are drafting with such detail and work, I will refrain from other opinions and possible compromises we can make. Voting shall also be put on hold.
 
I await with interest any alternative constitutional proposals. Although considering they are being produced as a reaction to my own proposal I am cautious as to whether the ones behind them can produce a worthy government for a new Rome, afterall if they aided in burning down the Kingdom only to have nothing prepared to replace it with.... well its not indicative of the foresight or wisdom.
 
Tsk tsk, not in response to yours, just not finished yet.
 
In no way was Rome left without a form of government following the fall of the Superbii, the senate assumed the powers of the kings as it did during interregna prior to the rise of dynastic rule. I would also point out that your own constitution was hardly immediately forthcoming and its' original draft placing so much power in the hands of one man showed it was thrown together in a hurry, hardly a document fitting to serve as the foundation for Roman law. Anyway, I present the proposed Claudian constitution.
Spoiler :
The Senate
The senate serves as the foundation for Roman law and all law, power and authority flows from it. The senate is reserved the right to enact law, implement policy and direct research for the Republic. Membership of the senate is reserved for the paterfamilias of patrician gentes. Members of the senate are referred to as Senator unless they have been appointed a higher title. The senate also serves as the highest court and cases will be heard by a panel of three senators, chosen by lot. Only a 2/3 majority vote of the senate may change this constitution and no veto may be applied against such a vote.

The Princeps Senatus: The Princeps Senatus is first in honour among the senators. He has the right to speak first during discussions and serves as the voice of the senate in foreign affairs. The Princeps Senatus is elected by the senate as a whole for a two session term. At the end of his term his final duty is to appoint the new junior consul. A patrician may serve as Princeps Senatus more than once but he may not be elected whilst the consul he appointed still serves in that role. The Princeps Senatus and the consuls hold a tripartite veto where any two of the three may together veto any action or decision of the third or of the senate as a whole.

The consuls: The consuls serve for staggered four session terms synchronised with the terms of Principes Senatus. Consuls are appointed by outgoing Principes Senatus. The senior consul is responsible for the Roman treasury and civilian policing. The junior consul is responsible for land management and discipline within the senate. Both consuls may introduce debates to the senate and both may take command of any Roman legion. The Princeps Senatus and the consuls hold a tripartite veto where any two of the three may together veto any action or decision of the third or of the senate as a whole.

Senex: An honorary title given to the eldest senator with no other position. In the event of the death in office of the Princeps Senatus or a consul the Senex will fill the position for the remainder of their term.

Prefects and Governors
Cities of the Republic are administered by Prefects (if the population has been granted Roman citizenship) or Governors (if a conquered city that has not been granted citizenship yet). They have the power to direct construction in that city and make law for the population. The Consilium Praefactus is composed of all prefects and governors to allow cities to cooperate for the good of the Republic although only prefects may vote on resolutions. The Prefect of Rome is primus inter pares of the consilium and may refer resolutions to the senate if they require the force of legislation.

Other Positions
Tribune of Plebs: Elected by the plebs as a personification of the plebeian masses as their voice in government. Therefore one must be a plebeian to hold this office. The tribune has the power to speak to, and propose laws for the consideration of the senate. He is sacrosanct. A tribune must remain within the pomerium (bounds) of Rome to exercise his powers.

Dictator: An extraordinary position that may created during a state of emergency. The Dictator has power over the treasury and military during his time in office and is sacrosanct. The Dictator has no power over criminal justice and may not alter the constitution or interfere with the senate. Neither the senator who proposed the state of emergency, the senator who proposed the election of a Dictator or the senators who seconded those motions are eligible to become Dictator. Whilst a Dictator is in office the first votes of the senate of every session must be (in order) whether to maintain the state of emergency, whether a Dictator is still required and who should be Dictator. If a Dictator refuses to cede power once the emergency has passed they lose sacrosanctity and it becomes the duty of all Roman citizens to bring them to justice before the senate or before the gods. Any citizen who brings a renegade Dictator to justice may become a Patrician.
 
This other Constitution is much better, in my humble opinion.
 
Just a question, when you say "years" do you mean sessions? If you mean ingame years you will have to choose a new Princeps Senatus every two turns.
 
A question about the consuls, can they be re-elected?
I also infer the Princeps Senatus has the power to make agreements with foreign nations, being the voice of the senate, or is that power unique to the entire senate?
 
The consuls: The consuls serve for staggered four session terms synchronised with the terms of Principes Senatus. Consuls are appointed by outgoing Principes Senatus. The senior consul is responsible for the Roman treasury and civilian policing. The junior consul is responsible for land management and discipline within the senate. Both consuls may introduce debates to the senate and both may take command of any Roman legion. The Princeps Senatus and the consuls hold a tripartite veto where any two of the three may together veto any action or decision of the third or of the senate as a whole.
I disagree strongly with the role given the Consuls in this constitution. Specifically, one man absolutely cannot be given control of the entire Roman treasury. The consuls must be dependent upon the Senate for money, and in this constitution, the senate will depend on the senior consul. Also, the idea that the junior consul should be able to discipline the senate is absurd. The Senate is an independent organization, and if the consuls are able to interfere in it militarily, it could be overthrown. I would like to propose my own constitution that is composed of differing parts of the other two that will be known as the Camillas Compromise:

Spoiler :
The Roman Senate is the Patrician Assembly that governs the Roman Republic. It votes and decides on matters regarding social policy, national taxes, technological research, law, the granting of triumphs, and declarations of war. The senate also serves as the highest court and cases will be heard by a panel of three senators, chosen by lot. Only a 2/3 majority vote of the senate may change this constitution and no veto may be applied against such a vote. It is open to public observance with the exception of closed sessions called by the Princeps.

Amongst those entitled to sit in the senate are certain officials possessed of Imperium with direct personal responsibility over various spheres distinct from the ordinary magisterium of the senate and/or with specific roles to play in the senatorial process. They are as follows.

The Princeps Senatus: The Princeps Senatus is first in honour among the senators. He has the right to speak first during discussions and serves as the voice of the senate in foreign affairs. The Princeps Senatus is elected by the senate as a whole for a two session term. At the end of his term his final duty is to appoint the new consul. A patrician may serve as Princeps Senatus more than once but he may not be elected whilst the consul he appointed still serves in that role.

Consuls: The consuls serve for staggered four session terms synchronised with the terms of Princeps Senatus. Consuls are appointed by outgoing Princeps Senatus.Two in number, both must give assent to any laws proposed in the senate for them to take effect. Consuls also are responsible for taking field command of the army during wartime with at least one taking direct command while one remains in Rome. A consul can veto any of the other consuls actions. They are appointed to office by the outgoing Princeps Senatus.

Senex: An honorary title given to the eldest senator with no other position. In the event of the death in office of the Princeps Senatus or a consul the Senex will fill the position for the remainder of their term.

Consilium Praefectus

Cities of the Republic are administered by Prefects (if the population has been granted Roman citizenship) or Governors (if a conquered city that has not been granted citizenship yet). The Prefect shall be chosen by the Senate originally, and then will become a hereditary position. The Prefect can be removed and replaced by the Senate. The Governor is appointed by the consul that conquered the city. Prefects and Governors have the power to direct construction in that city, distribute land, and make laws for the population. The Consilium Praefactus is composed of all prefects and governors to allow cities to cooperate for the good of the Republic although only prefects may vote on resolutions. The Prefect of Rome is primus inter pares of the consilium and may refer resolutions to the senate if they require the force of legislation.

The Roman Tribunate

The Tribune of the People is elected by the plebs as a personification of the plebeian masses as their voice in government. Therefore one must be a plebeian to hold this office. The tribune has the power to speak to, and propose laws for the consideration of the senate. He is sacrosanct. A tribune must remain within the pomerium (bounds) of Rome to exercise his powers.
 
The Camillas Compromise:

Spoiler :
The Roman Senate is the Patrician Assembly that governs the Roman Republic. It votes and decides on matters regarding social policy, national taxes, technological research, law, the granting of triumphs, and declarations of war. The senate also serves as the highest court and cases will be heard by a panel of three senators, chosen by lot. Only a 2/3 majority vote of the senate may change this constitution and no veto may be applied against such a vote. It is open to public observance with the exception of closed sessions called by the Princeps.

Amongst those entitled to sit in the senate are certain officials possessed of Imperium with direct personal responsibility over various spheres distinct from the ordinary magisterium of the senate and/or with specific roles to play in the senatorial process. They are as follows.

The Princeps Senatus: The Princeps Senatus is first in honour among the senators. He has the right to speak first during discussions and serves as the voice of the senate in foreign affairs. The Princeps Senatus is elected by the senate as a whole for a two session term. At the end of his term his final duty is to appoint the new consul. A patrician may serve as Princeps Senatus more than once but he may not be elected whilst the consul he appointed still serves in that role.

Consuls: The consuls serve for staggered four session terms synchronised with the terms of Princeps Senatus. Consuls are appointed by outgoing Princeps Senatus.Two in number, both must give assent to any laws proposed in the senate for them to take effect. Consuls also are responsible for taking field command of the army during wartime with at least one taking direct command while one remains in Rome. A consul can veto any of the other consuls actions. They are appointed to office by the outgoing Princeps Senatus.

Senex: An honorary title given to the eldest senator with no other position. In the event of the death in office of the Princeps Senatus or a consul the Senex will fill the position for the remainder of their term.

Consilium Praefectus

Cities of the Republic are administered by Prefects (if the population has been granted Roman citizenship) or Governors (if a conquered city that has not been granted citizenship yet). The Prefect shall be chosen by the Senate originally, and then will become a hereditary position. The Prefect can be removed and replaced by the Senate. The Governor is appointed by the consul that conquered the city. Prefects and Governors have the power to direct construction in that city, distribute land, and make laws for the population. The Consilium Praefactus is composed of all prefects and governors to allow cities to cooperate for the good of the Republic although only prefects may vote on resolutions. The Prefect of Rome is primus inter pares of the consilium and may refer resolutions to the senate if they require the force of legislation.

The Roman Tribunate

The Tribune of the People is elected by the plebs as a personification of the plebeian masses as their voice in government. Therefore one must be a plebeian to hold this office. The tribune has the power to speak to, and propose laws for the consideration of the senate. He is sacrosanct. A tribune must remain within the pomerium (bounds) of Rome to exercise his powers.

The Claudian Constitution

Spoiler :
The Senate
The senate serves as the foundation for Roman law and all law, power and authority flows from it. The senate is reserved the right to enact law, implement policy and direct research for the Republic. Membership of the senate is reserved for the paterfamilias of patrician gentes. Members of the senate are referred to as Senator unless they have been appointed a higher title. The senate also serves as the highest court and cases will be heard by a panel of three senators, chosen by lot. Only a 2/3 majority vote of the senate may change this constitution and no veto may be applied against such a vote.

The Princeps Senatus: The Princeps Senatus is first in honour among the senators. He has the right to speak first during discussions and serves as the voice of the senate in foreign affairs. The Princeps Senatus is elected by the senate as a whole for a two session term. At the end of his term his final duty is to appoint the new junior consul. A patrician may serve as Princeps Senatus more than once but he may not be elected whilst the consul he appointed still serves in that role. The Princeps Senatus and the consuls hold a tripartite veto where any two of the three may together veto any action or decision of the third or of the senate as a whole.

The consuls: The consuls serve for staggered four session terms synchronised with the terms of Principes Senatus. Consuls are appointed by outgoing Principes Senatus. The senior consul is responsible for the Roman treasury and civilian policing. The junior consul is responsible for land management and discipline within the senate. Both consuls may introduce debates to the senate and both may take command of any Roman legion. The Princeps Senatus and the consuls hold a tripartite veto where any two of the three may together veto any action or decision of the third or of the senate as a whole.

Senex: An honorary title given to the eldest senator with no other position. In the event of the death in office of the Princeps Senatus or a consul the Senex will fill the position for the remainder of their term.

Prefects and Governors
Cities of the Republic are administered by Prefects (if the population has been granted Roman citizenship) or Governors (if a conquered city that has not been granted citizenship yet). They have the power to direct construction in that city and make law for the population. The Consilium Praefactus is composed of all prefects and governors to allow cities to cooperate for the good of the Republic although only prefects may vote on resolutions. The Prefect of Rome is primus inter pares of the consilium and may refer resolutions to the senate if they require the force of legislation.

Other Positions
Tribune of Plebs: Elected by the plebs as a personification of the plebeian masses as their voice in government. Therefore one must be a plebeian to hold this office. The tribune has the power to speak to, and propose laws for the consideration of the senate. He is sacrosanct. A tribune must remain within the pomerium (bounds) of Rome to exercise his powers.

Dictator: An extraordinary position that may created during a state of emergency. The Dictator has power over the treasury and military during his time in office and is sacrosanct. The Dictator has no power over criminal justice and may not alter the constitution or interfere with the senate. Neither the senator who proposed the state of emergency, the senator who proposed the election of a Dictator or the senators who seconded those motions are eligible to become Dictator. Whilst a Dictator is in office the first votes of the senate of every session must be (in order) whether to maintain the state of emergency, whether a Dictator is still required and who should be Dictator. If a Dictator refuses to cede power once the emergency has passed they lose sacrosanctity and it becomes the duty of all Roman citizens to bring them to justice before the senate or before the gods. Any citizen who brings a renegade Dictator to justice may become a Patrician.

The Pactione Romani

Spoiler :
Pactione Romani (Compact of Romans)

-

The Roman Senate:

The Roman Senate is the Patrician Assembly that governs the Roman Republic. It votes and decides on matters regarding social policy, national taxes, technological research, law, the granting of triumphs, and declarations of war. It is open to public observance with the exception of closed sessions called by the Princeps.

Amongst those entitled to sit in the senate are certain officials possessed of Imperium with direct personal responsibility over various spheres distinct from the ordinary magisterium of the senate and/or with specific roles to play in the senatorial process. They are as follows.

-

Princeps Senatus: The First Man of the Senate, head and guardian of the state, the Princeps is directly responsible for the care of the treasury. The Princeps as head of state also has the right of first speech in the senate and announcing the topics for discussion. The Princeps is considered sacrosanct. The Princeps can be granted dictatorial power to rule by decree via a vote of the senate in a national emergency, with set time limits defined at the time of vote. The Princeps Senatus is elected by the Senate for a term of three sessions.

Consuls: Two in number, Consuls posess supreme command of the military in peace and war and are also responsible for taking field command of the army during wartime, with at least one consul being obliged to take direct command while one remains in Rome. The Consuls must also provide military advice to the Roman Senate. They are appointed to office by the Princeps Senatus for the duration of his term.

Legatus: The Legatus is responsible for negotiating with foreign powers, making agreements and signing treaties. All treaties must be approved by the Roman Senate, unless the Roman Senate votes to give the Legatus arbito (discretion) at the beginning of their term. The Legatus is selected by the Princeps Senatus for the duration of his term, subject to approval by vote of the Roman Senate.

Caput Iudex: The Caput Iudex is the highest judge in Rome with authority to preside over trials. The Caput Iudex is selected by the Princeps Senatus for the duration of his term, subject to approval by vote of the Roman Senate.

-

Any other patrician in the senate is simply known as a senator, and has the right to debate on senatorial proposals and make proposals and vote in the senate on senatorial matters (as distinct from the personal imperium over various areas to the above officials). All patricians are entitled to sit in the senate, but a patrician, with the exception of a consul or the Princeps during the course of their duties, must reside in Rome in order to exercise senatorial privileges and be counted as a senator.

---

Consilium Praefectus

Prefects are responsible for the civil administration (builds, local governance, land distribution and management) of cities with each city having one Prefect. Prefects are ranked by seniority of the city with the Prefect of Rome being known as the Praefectus Urbi. The Praefectus Urbi is selected for life by the Roman Senate, however the Roman Senate may remove the Praefectus Urbi from his position and select another. The other original Prefects are to be elected via popular vote, thereafter hereditary with the senate having power to transfer the hereditary rights to prefectural power to another lineage. The Prefect of newly settled/conquered cities are to be appointed by the senate. A prefect must reside in the city of the region he governs.

The Praefectus Urbi heads a council of prefects called the Consilium Praefectus that exists to ensure that each prefect’s orders are in accord with the policy of the wider empire, and not detrimental to the greater good of the empires development. The Praefectus Urbi has the rights to veto a lesser prefect’s orders if the lesser prefect remains obstinate. This veto can be vetoed by the senate.

---

The Roman Tribunate

The Tribune of the People is elected by the plebs as a personification of the plebeian masses as their voice in government. Therefore one must be a plebeian to hold this office. The tribune has the power to speak to, and propose laws for the consideration of the senate. He is sacrosanct. A tribune must remain within the pomerium (bounds) of Rome to exercise his powers.

The Caelian Constitution

-

Spoiler :
Constitution of Rome

-

The Roman Senate:

-

The Roman Senate is the Patrician Assembly that governs the Roman Republic. It votes and decides on matters regarding social policy, national taxes, technological research, law, the granting of triumphs, and declarations of war. It is open to public observance with the exception of closed sessions called by the Princeps.

Amongst those entitled to sit in the senate are certain officials possessed of Imperium with direct personal responsibility over various spheres distinct from the ordinary magisterium of the senate and/or with specific roles to play in the senatorial process. They are as follows.

-

Princeps Senatus: The First Man of the Senate, head and guardian of the state, the Princeps is directly responsible for the care of the treasury. The Princeps as head of state also has the right of first speech in the senate and announcing the topics for discussion, also possesses the veto over any proposals in same senate or actions of the consuls and is considered sacrosanct. The Princeps can be granted dictatorial power to rule by decree via a vote of the senate in a national emergency, with set time limits defined at the time of vote. The Princeps Senatus is elected by the Senate for a term of three sessions.

Consuls: Two in number, both must give assent to any laws proposed in the senate for them to take effect. Consuls posess supreme command of the military in peace and war and are also responsible for taking field command of the army during wartime, with at least one consul being obliged to take direct command while one remains in Rome. The Consuls also are responsible for negotiating with foreign powers, making agreements and signing treaties. The Consuls are also the highest judges in Rome with authority to preside over trials. A consul can veto any of the others consuls actions. They are appointed to office by the Princeps Senatus for the duration of his term.

-

Any other patrician in the senate is simply known as a senator, and has the right to debate on senatorial proposals and make proposals and vote in the senate on senatorial matters (as distinct from the personal imperium over various areas to the above officials). All patricians are entitled to sit in the senate, but a patrician, with the exception of a consul or the Princeps during the course of their duties, must reside in Rome in order to exercise senatorial privileges and be counted as a senator.

---

Consilium Praefectus

Prefects are responsible for the civil administration (builds, local governance, land distribution and management) of cities with each city having one Prefect. Prefects are ranked by seniority of the city with the Prefect of Rome being known as the Praefectus Urbi. The original Prefects are to be elected via popular vote, thereafter hereditary with the senate having power to transfer the hereditary rights to prefectural power to another lineage. The Prefect of newly settled/conquered cities are to be appointed by the senate. A prefect must reside in the city of the region he governs.

The Praefectus Urbi heads a council of prefects called the Consilium Praefectus that exists to ensure that each prefect’s orders are in accord with the policy of the wider empire, and not detrimental to the greater good of the empires development. The Praefectus Urbi has the rights to veto a lesser prefect’s orders if the lesser prefect remains obstinate. This veto can be vetoed by the senate.

---

The Roman Tribunate

The Tribune of the People is elected by the plebs as a personification of the plebeian masses as their voice in government. Therefore one must be a plebeian to hold this office. The tribune has the power to speak to, and propose laws for the consideration of the senate. He is sacrosanct. A tribune must remain within the pomerium (bounds) of Rome to exercise his powers

These are all the constitutions that have been drafted so far. Most share the same ideas with differences in consuls, judiciary power, etc. I propose we begin to break up each issue and vote on the matter to facilitate the creation of our government and ensure the needs of Rome and all the worries of the Patricians are addressed and resolved.

These are the following issues:

Lets start with something that almost everyone agrees to:

The Roman Tribunate

The Tribune of the People is elected by the plebs as a personification of the plebeian masses as their voice in government. Therefore one must be a plebeian to hold this office. The tribune has the power to speak to, and propose laws for the consideration of the senate. He is sacrosanct. A tribune must remain within the pomerium (bounds) of Rome to exercise his powers

Vote Options for the The Roman Tribunate
  • Agree, Include in the Roman Constitution
  • Disagree, throw this out completely
  • Disagree (state your opinion and your proposition)

More simpler issues to come in a few minutes...
 
On the Claudian Constitution

-

I am gravely concerned about this constitution due to its peculiar distribution of powers. The consuls would be responsible for the Roman treasury, civilian policiing, land management and "discipline in the senate" with the Princeps Senatus having control over foreign policy and first voice. This in effect puts nigh absolute power in the hands of three individuals through domination of certain key areas.

As such since the Princeps Senatus appoints the consuls it seems quite likely to me that our good Noctus patrician thinks to establish some sort of triumvirate, where an alliance of patrician families gains nearly absolute power by consolodiating power in a small group which is self-perpetuating, particularly since it could give itself large land holdings thus ensuring it has the power advantage over the long term. Not to mention the possibilities for abuse I have already mentioned with the dictatorate!

In the Caelian constitution, this cannot be done, since the Princeps and the Consuls lack power over land and law enforecement with this being left to the Prefects. This subsidiary distribution of these powers to the prefects (who can be removed by the Senate in the Caelian Constitution) ensures that these crucial areas are managed locally, and that they are given oversight. Should a Prefect think to give all land to himself and his allies the Senate can kick him out of his office, should the consuls in league with the Princeps in the Claudian Constitution seek to do the same there is no balancing principle to prevent them from doing so.

I warn my fellow patricians and indeed all Romans not to support this tyrannical constitution.

-

On the Camillan Compromise

-

The House Camillas was worthy in seeing the hidden tyranny in the Claudian Constitution, but they were blind to its true nature. Its compromise as such remains vastly inferior to the caelian constitution in several respects. Firstly its proposition that the treasury be invested in the senate is severely problematic. Rome is an Empire and it requires someone to manage it economically, it is grossly innefficient to the point of being quite dangerous should a crisis come along to have economics devolve to the entire senate on the whole, for we could expect only protracted debate over what precisely to do, when it is action that is needed and when funds need to be dispensed quickly. In the Caelian constitution this necessary personal administration of funds is given the to the Princeps Senatus, something that is balanced by his limited term, and the fact that the senates elected successor can freely change economic tack if his predecessors budget was problematic.

This brings me to another problem, which is that the Princeps Senatus here is given power over foreign policy, and us unbound by anyone. He could sign a treaty detrimental to Rome which we would then be bound to uphold long beyond his term (lest we face severe diplomatic penalty) and no one could prevent him from signing it. He has absolute free reign oer this important faculty! This problem was pointed out in the original draft in the Caelian constitution and was promptly corrected (although it appears it is easier to pick at the speck in anothers eye, than the log in ones own, since the Claudian Constitution also has this problem, as does the Pactione Romani), with the consuls becoming responsible for foreign policy in the corrected version, with them of course being subject to mutual veto, and the veto of the princeps senatus. This is far superior to the unreigned faculties of the Princeps Senatus in the Camillan Compromise.

-

On the Pactione Romani

-

This constitution is very similar to the Caelian Constitution I proposed, indeed it (along with all of the others) are clearly derived from it, with the difference being changes fitting with each patricians ideas.

In the case of the Pactione Romani, it falls into the trap of giving special faculties to too many people thus making the system overly complicated, and increasing the chances for discord between various officials, while at the same time eliminating several important instruments of balancance. This constitution indeed removes all means of balance by excising the veto power of the consuls over each other and the princeps Senatus in general. This constitution therefore is quite simply the formulation of various fiefdoms with each position having absolute control over their "sphere of influence" for their term. This perhaps reflects its authors focus on ensuring his own influence is guaranteed...

As such the same concerns apply to the Legatus in this constitution as to the Princeps Senatus in the Camillan Compromise. While the problem is expanded to the position of the Caput Iudex which also lacks balance, since its a single man being given control over judicial faculties where in the Caelian Constitution the Consuls have control, with the mutual veto and the Princeps veto applying to ensure a just result.

Which brings me to the point of the lack of consular mutual veto, this is not a good thing, especially since they have control over the military with one being obliged to go out on campaign. This constitution increases the chances of a military coup, as the field commander could simply take his army and march back to Rome, with no one having the power to stop this legally before it is too late. In the Caelian Constitution the veto's ensure that a campaigning consul is kept on a leash and that the signs of rowdy discontent can be observed before the army reaches our threshold.
 
Another issue with common ideas and goals, yet with some differences:

Spoiler Consilium Praefectus :
Consilium Praefectus

Cities of the Republic are administered by Prefects (if the population has been granted Roman citizenship) or Governors (if a conquered city that has not been granted citizenship yet). The Prefect shall be chosen by the Senate originally, and then will become a hereditary position. The Prefect can be removed and replaced by the Senate. The Governor is appointed by the consul that conquered the city. Prefects and Governors have the power to direct construction in that city, distribute land, and make laws for the population. The Consilium Praefactus is composed of all prefects and governors to allow cities to cooperate for the good of the Republic although only prefects may vote on resolutions. The Prefect of Rome is primus inter pares of the consilium and may refer resolutions to the senate if they require the force of legislation.

Consilium Praefectus

Prefects are responsible for the civil administration (builds, local governance, land distribution and management) of cities with each city having one Prefect. Prefects are ranked by seniority of the city with the Prefect of Rome being known as the Praefectus Urbi. The Praefectus Urbi is selected for life by the Roman Senate, however the Roman Senate may remove the Praefectus Urbi from his position and select another. The other original Prefects are to be elected via popular vote, thereafter hereditary with the senate having power to transfer the hereditary rights to prefectural power to another lineage. The Prefect of newly settled/conquered cities are to be appointed by the senate. A prefect must reside in the city of the region he governs.

The Praefectus Urbi heads a council of prefects called the Consilium Praefectus that exists to ensure that each prefect’s orders are in accord with the policy of the wider empire, and not detrimental to the greater good of the empires development. The Praefectus Urbi has the rights to veto a lesser prefect’s orders if the lesser prefect remains obstinate. This veto can be vetoed by the senate.

It seems like everyone is in favor of having a Consilium Praefectus, yet there are two slightly different propositions.

Vote Options for the The Consilium Praefectus

  • I agree with the first Consilium Praefectus quoted
  • I agree with the second Consilium Praefectus quoted
  • I disagree with both (state opinions and your proposition)

I'll wait for these two to be voted on before continuing with greater issues like the consuls and the Princeps Senatus.
 
The tribunal elections btw, are by the plebs, for the plebs. As the players are patricians we have no say in who the tribune is, since inevitably its an NPC plebeian ;)
 
I believe that it would be great folly if we voted on individual sections because it would prevent compromise on the whole constitution. We must debate and pass one unified document. In order to go forward, I believe the Camillas Compromise should be used as a starting point for the actual constitution because it already contains aspects of both sides. Also, I am willing to negotiate most points. If it is acceptable to the other patricians, I wish to give the foreign power to the consuls. The reason I didn't give it already is that I thought Claudius would oppose it. I do not foresee any of the other documents being passed so I urge my fellow nobles to consider the Camillas Compromise favorably and take advantage of it's negotiability.
 
I see where my initiative has caused the wrong reaction. The purpose of what I am trying to do is to focus on one issue and gather the information and the opinions for easier debate of the propositions and the facilitation of the process. These votes in no way will determine the passing of a section because of majority, for I do not have the power to do such a thing. I just want this to bring all the issues and differences of each of the constitutions drafted and begin a more organized debate. Then, once we have all votes agreeing, the issue is put to rest and we move on to the next one. I started with simple issues where everyone agrees to get them out of the way. Then we will debate and vote on the greater, more differing issues.
 
The tribunal elections btw, are by the plebs, for the plebs. As the players are patricians we have no say in who the tribune is, since inevitably its an NPC plebeian ;)

Is this a response to my other post? What I was asking is if everyone agrees to have the tribune at all in our government, not starting an election of the tribune itself.
 
I apologize for misinterpreting your intentions. I still believe that it would be better to take a plan as a whole and negotiate the whole because going section by section will make compromising difficult and lengthen the whole process. If other patricians disagree with my view then I am willing to use your strategy for negotiation.
 
Top Bottom