Indonesia First Look
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God of Kings
Ruler of all heads of state
With plenty of water-based resources, Indonesia would be the ultimate tall civ.
Zenstrive
Ocean King
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Indonesia's superior faith over its water domain could mean relentless ships built with utmost faith and sails with relentless faith.
Built fast in the Kampungs and sail toward the foreign countries to take their cities easily. Then built more ships with faiths from those cities, faster and faster.
In the end: The Goddess of Three Worlds is now Goddess of All Worlds
I just love me some Gijarta.
Built fast in the Kampungs and sail toward the foreign countries to take their cities easily. Then built more ships with faiths from those cities, faster and faster.
In the end: The Goddess of Three Worlds is now Goddess of All Worlds
I just love me some Gijarta.
Zenstrive
Ocean King
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So uhh... is the Kampung housing bonus global or something?
I mean I have 73 housing in my capital...
Whoa, talk about ready for global warming, eh?
I only have a moderate amount of sea resources and my capital has over thirty housing in the midgame.
Westwall
Emperor
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Am I the only one trying to headcanon/rename this civ and its leader as Moana of Mata Nui? Maybe after she grew up and went on to conquer the Pacific after leading her people out of isolation? Assimilating other islander nations and their cultures into her own along the way...
Alexander's Hetaroi
Deity
Maybe I just totally missed it but before I started playing I thought that you could build Kampungs on any coastal water tile without being adjacent to a sea resource. I'm sort of sad that this wasn't the case. Still it's not horrible on an island plates map, just not as great compared to the Outback Station.
Zenstrive
Ocean King
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Am I the only one trying to headcanon/rename this civ and its leader as Moana of Mata Nui? Maybe after she grew up and went on to conquer the Pacific after leading her people out of isolation? Assimilating other islander nations and their cultures into her own along the way...
Moana is fully fictional, Gijarta is historical.
Maybe someone can make Moana in a mod. With movable Kampungs.
Westwall
Emperor
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Yes, I realize that. I'm saying for the purposes of roleplaying since they bear at least a passing resemblence.
God of Kings
Ruler of all heads of state
The single hex island could outproduce a city with the Ruhr Valley.
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I think the extra housing for the Kampung comes on at Square Rigging. That was the last tech I got before I noticed my housing go up. Either that or the Natural History civic, but that makes less sense.
Anyone want to confirm?
EDIT: I am certain that the Kampung gets Tourism at Flight, although I am not sure about what ratio.
Anyone want to confirm?
EDIT: I am certain that the Kampung gets Tourism at Flight, although I am not sure about what ratio.
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unpossible251
Warlord
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smack bang in the middle? as in Singapore or north kalimantan? message me, if u are in the latter, im in KalTeng
unpossible251
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Am I the only one trying to headcanon/rename this civ and its leader as Moana of Mata Nui? Maybe after she grew up and went on to conquer the Pacific after leading her people out of isolation? Assimilating other islander nations and their cultures into her own along the way...
mmmmm... noooo... but I do definitely, definitely hope that polynesia is brought back.
Uhm no, #FiraxisFailsAtCoding, it's *any* holy site, so no need to build any at all, as you will be using the ones build by your enemies.
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My Indonesia Review:
Indonesia is a very powerful civ, particularly on Island Plates maps that play to its strengths.
Great Nusantara:
Having an adjacency bonus to coastal tiles is part of Indonesia's coastal focus. In many cases, these districts would be better suited inland, but this bonus makes them viable when placed on the coast. On IP maps, you may not have a choice otherwise. The extra amenity on the Entertainment Complex is more important than expected, because you are going to have some astoundingly large cities. Indonesia's Theater Squares are one of the few with an actual terrain adjacency bonus (Brazil and Australia have the others).
Exalted Goddess of the Three Worlds:
The free Faith in coastal cities is very helpful for gaining first pick on Pantheons. Most likely you will be getting God of the Sea for that sweet, sweet sea resource production. It's somewhat less useful for buying units with Faith, because it doesn't add up that fast. If you are planning to Faith-purchase a huge navy, this will need to be supplemented with Faith from Holy Sites and religion. But if you're just occasionally buying caravels, it's probably fine.
I don't play towards religious victories, but I can see how having your missionaries sweep in off the sea and blitz cities with conversion is pretty powerful, as that would be hard to defend against.
Jong
The Jong is faster, stronger (with an accompanying embarked land unit), and comes a whole era earlier than the Frigate that it replaces. I was attacked by the Greeks who got Caravels before I did, but I got my Jongs and ripped them apart. It helps that Mercenaries is relatively easy to beeline. The downside is that you will have to invest a little bit more production to get a land unit to ride on it, to get its full potential.
Kampung
The Outback Station of the sea! And like that improvement, you will be spamming Kampungs anywhere you can because there's no reason not to. The yields are good, especially when you get a Lighthouse up (and later a Seaport). The Housing is simply ridiculous for an improvement that you could have 10 or more per city. It starts with 1 Housing, and then gets another 1 at Square Rigging! Either that second one needs to be moved to later in the tech tree or it needs to be reduced to half. I expect it to be nerfed in a future patch. And if making huge cities wasn't enough, these things also generate Tourism at Flight, despite having no Culture. I haven't figured out if the Tourism is equivalent to the Food generated or what, but they increased my raw Tourism index by 75%. So, they are kind of a cross between the Outback Station and the Pairediazas.
The downside of coastal improvements and districts is that a band of naval raiders (I'm looking at England and Norway here) could sweep in and lay waste to your infrastructure. Be sure to keep a strong navy in defense.
TL;DR Indonesia is really good on any map with water, and breathtaking on Island Plates.
Indonesia is a very powerful civ, particularly on Island Plates maps that play to its strengths.
Great Nusantara:
Having an adjacency bonus to coastal tiles is part of Indonesia's coastal focus. In many cases, these districts would be better suited inland, but this bonus makes them viable when placed on the coast. On IP maps, you may not have a choice otherwise. The extra amenity on the Entertainment Complex is more important than expected, because you are going to have some astoundingly large cities. Indonesia's Theater Squares are one of the few with an actual terrain adjacency bonus (Brazil and Australia have the others).
Exalted Goddess of the Three Worlds:
The free Faith in coastal cities is very helpful for gaining first pick on Pantheons. Most likely you will be getting God of the Sea for that sweet, sweet sea resource production. It's somewhat less useful for buying units with Faith, because it doesn't add up that fast. If you are planning to Faith-purchase a huge navy, this will need to be supplemented with Faith from Holy Sites and religion. But if you're just occasionally buying caravels, it's probably fine.
I don't play towards religious victories, but I can see how having your missionaries sweep in off the sea and blitz cities with conversion is pretty powerful, as that would be hard to defend against.
Jong
The Jong is faster, stronger (with an accompanying embarked land unit), and comes a whole era earlier than the Frigate that it replaces. I was attacked by the Greeks who got Caravels before I did, but I got my Jongs and ripped them apart. It helps that Mercenaries is relatively easy to beeline. The downside is that you will have to invest a little bit more production to get a land unit to ride on it, to get its full potential.
Kampung
The Outback Station of the sea! And like that improvement, you will be spamming Kampungs anywhere you can because there's no reason not to. The yields are good, especially when you get a Lighthouse up (and later a Seaport). The Housing is simply ridiculous for an improvement that you could have 10 or more per city. It starts with 1 Housing, and then gets another 1 at Square Rigging! Either that second one needs to be moved to later in the tech tree or it needs to be reduced to half. I expect it to be nerfed in a future patch. And if making huge cities wasn't enough, these things also generate Tourism at Flight, despite having no Culture. I haven't figured out if the Tourism is equivalent to the Food generated or what, but they increased my raw Tourism index by 75%. So, they are kind of a cross between the Outback Station and the Pairediazas.
The downside of coastal improvements and districts is that a band of naval raiders (I'm looking at England and Norway here) could sweep in and lay waste to your infrastructure. Be sure to keep a strong navy in defense.
TL;DR Indonesia is really good on any map with water, and breathtaking on Island Plates.
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SammyKhalifa
Deity
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Besides being powerful, they're just fun because they make you look at the map and tech tree in a very different way than most other civs.
So much so this. I mean, the Khmer are powerful--but they're not half as fun as Indonesia simply because Indonesia is so different.
chazzycat
Deity
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Having played 2 games now, 1 of each...they are both fun but very very different. Indonesia on island plates is just incredibly strong (and fun!) as already covered above. But they are dependent on sea resources, so not super versatile for other map types.
Khmer on the other hand seems overall more balanced for different maps, the only requirement is rivers. The elephants are underwhelming, didn't do much for me. But the aqueducts & holy site stuff do have good synergy. I like the attention to aqueducts...they are probably the only civ other than Rome where you actually build them on fresh water...this leads to quite a bit of housing and food. Religion is an easy way to add 3 more housing in the early game (+1 from shrine & temple belief, +1 from pagoda) and with Khmer you want some early holy sites, so that's a natural fit. The end result is that you can easily build large cities with Khmer, well before neighborhoods. Just gotta pay attention to amenities to keep growing.
I think they are best suited to a culture or science victory. Religion would seem like a natural choice, but the problem with that is you will end up sacrificing a ton of missionaries to get those sweet sweet free relics. It's hard to spread religion when you are intentionally losing a bunch of religious combats. However those relics set you up pretty nicely for culture victory with a head start in tourism. And of course, science is a natural fallback option for any civ that has large productive cities in the midgame. I would avoid domination or much aggression really with Khmer, because you want to keep the luxury trades coming, so your cities can keep up with all that housing & food, and keep growing into powerhouses.
Khmer on the other hand seems overall more balanced for different maps, the only requirement is rivers. The elephants are underwhelming, didn't do much for me. But the aqueducts & holy site stuff do have good synergy. I like the attention to aqueducts...they are probably the only civ other than Rome where you actually build them on fresh water...this leads to quite a bit of housing and food. Religion is an easy way to add 3 more housing in the early game (+1 from shrine & temple belief, +1 from pagoda) and with Khmer you want some early holy sites, so that's a natural fit. The end result is that you can easily build large cities with Khmer, well before neighborhoods. Just gotta pay attention to amenities to keep growing.
I think they are best suited to a culture or science victory. Religion would seem like a natural choice, but the problem with that is you will end up sacrificing a ton of missionaries to get those sweet sweet free relics. It's hard to spread religion when you are intentionally losing a bunch of religious combats. However those relics set you up pretty nicely for culture victory with a head start in tourism. And of course, science is a natural fallback option for any civ that has large productive cities in the midgame. I would avoid domination or much aggression really with Khmer, because you want to keep the luxury trades coming, so your cities can keep up with all that housing & food, and keep growing into powerhouses.
KayAU
Emperor
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I finally loaded up my Indonesia save again (I wanted to wrap things up with my ongoing Stellaris game first, and that took a while). The Kampungs definitely give +2 housing now. I am not sure at what tech that happened, but it was not Square Rigging, as I have not researched that yet.
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