Info on Next Patch

[gunter]

Zimbu, could you please briefly describe to Sonereal what do you mean for emotions ?

I imagine you wasn't referring to 5 only, am I right ?

 

[Clement]

A "right to passage" that opens up civilian movement and trade between borders should alleviate some of this as well.

This a very good point, at the moment open borders just means they get to see how little your army is, there should be an upside to open borders, it should be trade and good relations.

 

[ZimbuTheMonkey]

Uahaha , another bozoo here like gunter... ehehe.. he speaks about emotion-less robots..... you are now closer to my DNA concept..... emotions man, yes emotions I meant.

I hope now it is clearer, at least to you.

How can a patch bring emotions all of a sudden ?

Umm, you are completely misconstruing my post.

Did you read that and actually think I want the developers to give the AI human emotions? I said my perception of the AI is different than the AI from Civ IV, which felt more loyal and friendly.

Here's a stupid way they can fix it:

The first AI you can encounter and have a successful trade agreement with becomes your "best friend" and never declares war on you or subverts your quest for victory.

Boom. Best buds forever. Obviously the devs need to make the change more sophisticated. I'm not saying they make a robot that can feel, I'm saying they tweak the AI in a way that makes ME feel that they have human qualities.

(This wasn't your original argument, so please stop pretending it was)

EDIT: Oh and getting back to your original point, nowhere did I state that this is a change that CANNOT be made via software update.

 

[gunter]

I don't know. I was playing Civ4 and my monitor shed a tear. I had to wipe it away with a tissue, pat it on its back, and tell it that everything was going to be okay.

Then Civ5 came out.

You have just caused an emotion, laugh. ( no irony )

Somereal has only 5 emotions, I wonder if it has already upgraded himself to the 6th

 

[Sonereal]

Somereal has only 5 emotions, I wonder if it has already upgraded himself to the 6th

The five emotions of Civ4 AI

Pissed
Annoyed
Whatever
"Yo, how's it going with you?"
"BEST FRIEND!"

 

[Sonereal]

This a very good point, at the moment open borders just means they get to see how little your army is, there should be an upside to open borders, it should be trade and good relations.

Or better yet, a trade pact that increases relations and trade without the need for free military movements.

The OB should just be an upgrade.

 

[gunter]

Umm, you are completely misconstruing my post.

Did you read that and actually think I want the developers to give the AI human emotions? I said my perception of the AI is different than the AI from Civ IV, which felt more loyal and friendly.

Here's a stupid way they can fix it:

The first AI you can encounter and have a successful trade agreement with becomes your "best friend" and never declares war on you or subverts your quest for victory.

Boom. Best buds forever. Obviously the devs need to make the change more sophisticated. I'm not saying they make a robot that can feel, I'm saying they tweak the AI in a way that makes ME feel that they have human qualities.

(This wasn't your original argument, so please stop pretending it was)

Do not want you to be so cynical now, Zimbu.

I prefer when we were at war like few posts ago, honey

 

[Gunship_Down]

Looks good indeed, glad my faith isn't misplaced.

 

[r_rolo1]

@Sonereal ( and OT )

I recognize your avatar, but i really can't remember from where Can you say from where it is, pls ?

 

[joyous_gard]

Listen, instead of getting more and more esoteric and vague with each post, why don't you just give me an example of a problem that is inherent to the "core of the structure" in Civilization V and one that you feel cannot be addressed/fixed with a software update?

I like your little monkey icon. I think of him asking these questions.

 

[Ankh]

The five emotions of Civ4 AI

Pissed
Annoyed
Whatever
"Yo, how's it going with you?"
"BEST FRIEND!"

Isabella only has 2

Same religion = LOVE!
Different religion = WAR!

EDIT: An example why religion was poorly implemented in civ4 and why I don't miss it in civ 5

 

[ZimbuTheMonkey]

Do not want you to be so cynical now, Zimbu.

I prefer when we were at war like few posts ago, honey

You are acting more clownish with every reply.

Is this the part where you ignore the original questions and deflect all the arguments with a shield of sarcasm?

 

[Sonereal]

@Sonereal ( and OT )

I recognize your avatar, but i really can't remember from where Can you say from where it is, pls ?

Tengen Toppa Gurren Lagann

Isabella only has 2

Same religion = LOVE!
Different religion = WAR!

EDIT: A reason why religion was poorly implemented in civ4 and why I don't miss it in civ 5

 

[Rohili]

An example ? Civ V misses a screen like previous edition where you can see if a civ is allied or at war with another one etc... that , tactically speaking , was fundamental if we are speaking about the Next Patch diplo fixes, do you agree ?

This proves that you don't know anything about what you are saying. There is such a screen in Civ V - under Global Politics.

Furthermore, even if it were missing, it is just a simple UI fix and I fail to see how it is a fundamental, unresolvable "DNA" issue.

 

[gunter]

Ok stop hijiacking the thread now guys, we had a good discussion anyway.

Have a nice time with the next patch, you deserve it.

 

[r_rolo1]

@Sonereal

Thanks

 

[aimlessgun]

I think the crux of the diplomacy problem is not just the fact that you can't be friends with a nation (which in the context of global politics should mean mutually beneficial relationship, not 'buddies').

The problem is that the diplomacy system is very simple, and doesn't give you a whole lot of interesting feedback. Even if they make it so you can be friendly with other civs, they won't be any less robotic. People will just get a fuzzy security blanket back, which is great, but the creation of a highly interactive and realistic diplomacy system would require the game to be more of an empire simulator, something we all know it isn't.

Anyways great news on the patch, thanks for the link.

 

[Clement]

when an Ai pops up with an insult you could get a new option like this :

AI : just wanted to let you know that your army is so tiny i laughing hard.

Then you have two options :

option 1 : very well, thank you for your observation. (you take insult and no penalty)

option 2 : Well, it may be small but it's all i need to deal with you! (penalty to relations)

 

[firecat318]

I would really love to have some kind of alliance system or something, sort of like city states but not so binding. That we we could actually have peaceful coexistence with another AI even if they were touching out borders. I get so sick of getting DOW'ed on simply because the other AI is too close to me.

 

[Snapp]

A lot of people in this thread seem to want to go back to the Civ IV model of diplomacy where you can gift your way into friendship, or simply being friendly makes you friends.

Honestly I really don't agree with that at all. I think its not realisitic that you can just gift useless crap and expect an alliance.

Do you honestly think if the Chinese gave Genghis some bananas that would have stopped him from attacking ? Hell no it wouldn't. Do you really think that giving Rome small amounts of gold would have stopped their conquest? No, for the glory of Rome they will just take your gold when they conquer you.

I could see the AI making more demands and if you meet them they don't attack, that could be realistic. They want to expand their borders so they demand you hand over the cities bordering them or they attack. You want to be peaceful, then you hand them over.

They could also implement friendly allies ala Civ IV but that would really depend on the personality of the leader. There will be no piece with Genghis, Rome, Montezuma if they want to expand. But make friendly with Gandhi and then you may have an ally.