Is Canada's Immigration System Ideal?

[Evie]

Even if illegal immigration isn't included in that chart, estimates for illegal immigrants in the US put the number around 3-4% of the population - not enough to get America above Canada (even if we assume Canada has no illegal immigrants).

Personally, speaking a a Canadian lawyer who articled in immigration law...the system is less than ideal. It may be better than others, but there are a lot of issues with it, ranging from monstrous bureaucratic delays (far in excess of their own claimed delays), significant barriers especially for young international couples (seriously, if you as a Canadian haven't managed to build a stable career - and we all know how impossible that is for young people -, you might as well kiss your foreign-born spouse goodbye. Or immigrate to their country.). Arbitrary skepticism and bias on the part of immigration authorities (if you don't have the photographs depicting a stereotypical love story, you are immediately suspected of sham marriage and likely to be turned down), immigration official who are more interested in backing each other than in delivering fair decisions (I've seen cases that went to the Federal Court three or four times - each time after a separate ruling from the immigration commission - before the Federal Court just got sick of the immigration commission's sheananigans and told them to accept the freaking application already), a strong "guilty until proven innocent beyond reasonable doubt" mentality (seriously, I've seen some flimsy pretext for doubts used to reject refugee and immigration application)...

No. The system is decidedly not ideal.

 

[Crime Doesn't Pay]

What do Canadians think of their country's immigration system? Are there any reports as such about this topic?

 

[Valka D'Ur]

What do Canadians think of their country's immigration system? Are there any reports as such about this topic?

Basically, without it, most of us wouldn't be here.

Fast-forward to now, and you get everything from "accept nobody" to "accept everybody except terrorists". "Terrorists" currently defined by the right-wing as anyone who is Muslim (and thanks to the shenanigans of Trudeau's latest international trip, some would also include Sikhs).

 

[Crime Doesn't Pay]

Basically, without it, most of us wouldn't be here.

Fast-forward to now, and you get everything from "accept nobody" to "accept everybody except terrorists". "Terrorists" currently defined by the right-wing as anyone who is Muslim (and thanks to the shenanigans of Trudeau's latest international trip, some would also include Sikhs).

Thanks for your response!

I respectfully ask this: Do you think the Canadian immigration system is harsher in practice than perceived by the general Canadian population?

 

[Valka D'Ur]

Thanks for your response!

I respectfully ask this: Do you think the Canadian immigration system is harsher in practice than perceived by the general Canadian population?

I honestly couldn't say, since I was born here and the most recent immigration that happened in my family (dad's family; I don't count my mother's side) was nearly a century ago.

There have been articles on CBC.ca about immigration snafus regarding paperwork (the applicant is married to a Canadian, has children with her Canadian husband, wants citizenship, sends in every bit of required paperwork, the application is sent back for some flimsy reason including the claim that part of the paperwork is missing when it's clearly there...) and it must be so incredibly frustrating for these people.

 

[Arwon]

Of course that doesn't count illegals, something which I don't think Canada has much of.....

Nope, it does. It is foreign born population based on census and survey data. Population statistics, not administrative datasets, and adjusted for undercount.

 

[Synobun]

Thanks for your response!

I respectfully ask this: Do you think the Canadian immigration system is harsher in practice than perceived by the general Canadian population?

In my experience through my family and through friends immigrating here, it's no more harsh than any other bureaucratic hellscape process. Which is to say that it's awfully particular, especially if your case goes by someone's desk that doesn't like you or is a stickler for random details. If you've been on welfare for health reasons or involved in government disputes, it's about equal to that level of perpetual despair.

The stakes of course differ between different people. For some, immigration delays or obstacles aren't a big deal. For many, it can potentially ruin their life. The more at stake, the harsher the system feels.

 

[Lemon Merchant]

My experience was pretty positive, but I came to the country as a minor. My parents handled my immigration. I don't know what they had to endure, but my dad's office would have handled the majority of the hurdles before he was transferred here. I became a citizen later, after I was finished college and decided to remain in Canada to be a nurse. I did my paperwork and after a few years working as a landed immigrant, I was accepted. I don't know what it is like now, as this was years ago, and I came from a "friendly" country. From what I have read, and by talking to people, it seems to be harder to get in unless you have a serious skill set to offer.

 

[Bamspeedy]

https://www.migrationpolicy.org/pro...immigrants-australia-canada-and-united-states

2006 If you can find something more recent, feel free to post it.

Australia's foreign born population:
UK: 24%
New Zealand: 9%
China: 5%
Italy: 5%
Vietnam: 4%

Canada's foreign born population:
UK: 9%
China: 8%
India: 7%
Philippines: 5%
Italy: 5%

USA foreign born population:
Mexico: 29%
India: 4%
Philippines: 4%
China: 4%
Vietnam: 3%

 

[Traitorfish]

I'm beyond tired of your "Canadia" BS. If you want to have a serious discussion, how about some basic respect for the countries you're talking about?

"Greater Quebec."

 

[Valka D'Ur]

"Greater Quebec."

I have no idea what that is supposed to mean. Quebec is a province of Canada. Period.

 

[Arwon]

https://www.migrationpolicy.org/pro...immigrants-australia-canada-and-united-states

2006 If you can find something more recent, feel free to post it.

Australia's foreign born population:
UK: 24%
New Zealand: 9%
China: 5%
Italy: 5%
Vietnam: 4%

Canada's foreign born population:
UK: 9%
China: 8%
India: 7%
Philippines: 5%
Italy: 5%

USA foreign born population:
Mexico: 29%
India: 4%
Philippines: 4%
China: 4%
Vietnam: 3%

What's the point of quoting the top 5 countries of origin that comprise each country's foreign born population? That omits over 50% of the foreign-born people in each country, and a compositional breakdown within the foreign-born population also obscures the very different levels of migration involved (ie, the foreign born population in Canada and Australia is like twice as proportionately large as the USA).

I'm not sure the claim that "the USA has proportionally far fewer migrants than Canada" should be a controversial one, it's a fairly basic statistical point.

At any rate, in terms of recent figures, here's the largest components of each country's foreign born population presented as a share of the total population:

2016 Census Australia (every country of birth forming over 0.5% of the population):

Australia 66.7% (or 73.3% if you include all the "not stated" as Australian born)
Country of Birth Not stated 6.9%
England 3.9%
Born elsewhere 2.8%
New Zealand 2.2%
China 2.2%
India 1.9%
Philippines 1.0%
Vietnam 0.9%
Italy 0.7%
South Africa 0.7%
Malaysia 0.6%
Scotland 0.5%

Remainder: 11.7%

2016 Census Bureau USA (every country of birth over 0.3% of the population, this source doesn't give any "not stated" component)

USA 86.5%
Mexico 3.6%
India 0.8%
China 0.7%
Philippines 0.6%
El Salvador 0.4%
Vietnam 0.4%
Cuba 0.4%
Dominican Republic 0.3%
South Korea 0.3%

Remainder: 6.0%

And 2016 Census Canada (over 0.5%, also not clear if there's a "not stated" share or how it's treated)

Canada 76.1%
China 2.2%
India 2.1%
Philippines 1.8%
United Kingdom 1.5%
United States 1.0%
Italy 0.7%
Hong Kong 0.6%
Pakistan 0.6%
Viet Nam 0.5%
Germany 0.5%
Iran 0.5%

Remainder: 11.8%

(Also a fun fact: there's 86k Americans and 43k Canadians in Australia, 783k Canadians and 93k Australians in the USA, and 338k Americans and 31k Australians in Canada)

 

[Evie]

Traitorfish, don't drag my province (and nation - sorry Valka) into your argument with Valka over the name of our country (hers and mine, I mean. Not yours.).

 

[warpus]

I view the response to refugees as a moral and a political obligation. And I am quite vocal on this front, in my private life.

From my POV I see immigration as an integral part of what Canada is about. So I think it's important as a Canadian citizen to be educated about the subject of immigration, refugees, etc. And even if Canada wasn't such a country, immigration happens everywhere, and you can probably expect some degree of refugees to almost any western country every year.. so do it right, and hold your government accountable to figure out a proper way forward

 

[Traitorfish]

I have no idea what that is supposed to mean. Quebec is a province of Canada. Period.

Pfft, for now.

 

[Valka D'Ur]

Pfft, for now.

Seriously, WTH are you even talking about? @Evie has requested that you drop this. She and I have our own ongoing disagreements that we will probably never reconcile, but we do try to remain civil about it.

 

[warpus]

What do you expect from a bearded fish who wears a hat

 

[Cutlass]

Canada opens doors to Irish while other countries close theirs
Australia, New Zealand and US are tightening immigration. Canada is doing the opposite
Mon, Feb 12, 2018, 11:23 Updated: Mon, Feb 12, 2018, 13:47
Hugo O’Doherty

‘Irish citizens are in a particularly privileged position when it comes to planning a move to Canada.’ Photograph: iStock/Getty Images

When Siobhán Young was told after nine years in Sydney that she had just 28 days to leave Australia, it was, as she calls it, “the worst moment of my life”.

After multiple attempts to secure employer sponsorship, including a lengthy appeals process, Young had to make alternative plans. She had burned thousands of dollars on legal fees in an ultimately fruitless attempt to prove she was worthy of permanent settlement in Australia.

“My whole world was turned upside-down,” the Tipperary woman explains.

A stopover in North America on the way home ended with a trip to Vancouver. The coastal city, tucked into a mild corner of British Columbia sheltered by the 460-kilometre-long Vancouver Island, made an immediate impression.

A few months later, Young was heading back with a a two-year open work permit under the International Experience Canada (IEC) initiative. Within months she had established a business, BC Bia, distributing Irish snacks to bars and shops in the city. Running her own business was a dream she couldn’t fulfil in Australia, under restrictions of her visa.

“I’ve never felt so settled. The business is up and running, and I’ve loads of friends. I feel very much part of this community already, and I’m only here two years,” says Young, who now has a clear pathway to permanent residence through common-law sponsorship with her Canadian boyfriend.

Young is just one of many Irish who have left Australia frustrated by visa restrictions, only to find a new life in Canada.

Closing doors
Last April, the Australian government led by prime minister Malcolm Turnbull adopted an “Australians first” approach to skilled migration, scrapping the employer-sponsored 457-visa programme and announcing a much stricter replacement. The 457 had been an immigration route traveled by thousands of Irish citizens over the preceding years. While existing 457 holders were allowed to remain under the terms of the visa, those with applications in the system that had not yet been processed were subject to the new rules.

Moving the immigration goalposts has become a pastime for Australian governments, leaving many would-be visa holders scrambling for a solution.

By remarkable coincidence, Turnbull’s announcement came within hours of US president Donald Trump signing a “Buy American, Hire American” executive order. Trump’s acolytes in the Senate then tabled a bill that would cut legal immigration levels in half and only offer skilled immigration to a niche segment of the global workforce.

New Zealand followed suit by implementing more restrictive immigration policies last April. A few months later, new prime minister Jacinda Ardern was carried into office on a platform that included a proposal to reduce immigration levels and make it more difficult for temporary residents such as international students to remain long-term.

The traditional destination countries for Irish emigrants were closing their doors or leaving them only slightly ajar. One popular destination, however, was taking a different approach.

Opportunities in Canada
Between now and the end of 2020, Canada will welcome around one million new permanent residents. Announcing the multi-year plan in November, immigration minister Ahmed Hussen, himself a Somali immigrant to Canada, said the plan would “result in the most ambitious immigration levels in recent Canadian history, and represents a major investment into Canada’s prosperity now and into the future”.

Of these newcomers, the majority will be admitted as economic migrants, chosen for their experience, education level, age, language skills, and employment prospects. Canada also offers family sponsorship programmes, giving Canadian citizens and permanent residents the opportunity to sponsor their foreign spouse or common-law partner, parents, grandparents, or dependent children.

Canada will also uphold its international reputation as a safe haven for refugees, with tens of thousands to be settled each year, and continue to welcome a steady inflow of students, many of whom are likely to transition to permanent residence.

If the governing Liberals win another majority in the next election - and there is every possibility they will - Canada may increase immigration levels even further into the coming decade. Theirs is an avowedly pro-immigration, pro-diversity agenda.

Even if the opposition Conservatives come to power, a reverse on immigration policy is unlikely. When the Conservatives last held office in Ottawa from 2006 to 2015, annual immigration levels steadily increased past the quarter-million-a-year mark. In last year’s party leadership contest, the one candidate who espoused a departure from the national consensus on immigration was roundly defeated, finishing well down the ballot with 7 per cent of the vote.

Immigration debates in Ottawa and across Canada are typically fought over the details - settlement resources, recognition of foreign credentials - rather than on ideology. The few individuals and institutions proposing a significant reduction in immigration levels are viewed as a fringe element.

Irish citizens are in a particularly privileged position when it comes to planning a move to Canada. Not only is Ireland included among the countries with which Canada has a reciprocal agreement under the IEC initiative, but Irish citizens under 36 years old are eligible for two-year open work permits, whereas most eligible international youth may only get one year. This work permit gives individuals the opportunity to work for any employer in any location in Canada, allowing them to gain plenty of experience and plot a pathway towards permanent residence.

After Siobhán Young transitions to permanent residence, as she can expect once her application is processed, it will end a decade of uncertainty for her, and allow her to make long-term plans for a life in Canada.

Hugo O’Doherty is an editor for Moving2Canada.com, a free information resource for people planning their move to Canada.

https://www.irishtimes.com/life-and...-while-other-countries-close-theirs-1.3389284

 

[Valka D'Ur]

In last year’s party leadership contest, the one candidate who espoused a departure from the national consensus on immigration was roundly defeated, finishing well down the ballot with 7 per cent of the vote.

Kellie Leitch is a disgusting racist, and I'm relieved that most of the Reformacons didn't vote for her. She was (and probably still is) a Trump groupie and harbored some serious delusions about what she would do "when I become Prime Minister."

 

[Crime Doesn't Pay]

I honestly couldn't say, since I was born here and the most recent immigration that happened in my family (dad's family; I don't count my mother's side) was nearly a century ago.

There have been articles on CBC.ca about immigration snafus regarding paperwork (the applicant is married to a Canadian, has children with her Canadian husband, wants citizenship, sends in every bit of required paperwork, the application is sent back for some flimsy reason including the claim that part of the paperwork is missing when it's clearly there...) and it must be so incredibly frustrating for these people.

Fair enough.