Is Europe on its way to a major religious resurgence?

[darky333]

Erm... I just spent 14 years in the Catholic education system, and can say without question that few young people would give a damn about more than a handful of them and would be unlikely to turn to the Catholic Church to deal with them anyway. Maybe in France, but not here.
The people of modern Europe aren't the peasants of the middle ages, they're not stupid. They can live a meaningful life without having to devote themselves to that rotting behemoth commonly known as the Catholic Church.

The question is, which path is it better to devote yourself to, for ensurance of your childrends future, your countries future, and the survival of the horrific degregation of european values, culture, and even populations of today?

The Catholic/Christian faith, strong beliefs in god, self-sacrifice, etc... with the chance of corruption, blind following and ignorance?

Or the Flat Screen TV's, less kids, more money, more power, more temporary happiness, more control over our personal happiness and lives but an empty void within ourselves and selfishness?

This is only from a Serbs point of view though, and even from American's too. Europe is starting to die, and it's dominance in the world is treatened. I, for one, do not wan't to see the Western World lose control of our world.

Something needs to change, it's just how we are willing to do it- as someone said, Europeans aren't peasents anymore, it's time for the people to decide where they will go, and whether or not they will lead the world, whether or not their children will lead the world.

 

[Plotinus]

Well, Catholicism and nihilistic materialism are hardly the only options, you know.

However, if the major reason to hold on to Catholic values is to retain dominion and power over other parts of the world, then that is not only an utterly immoral motive to retain them, it is a wholly unchristian one too. If there was a time when Europe dominated the world, it was because Europeans abandoned Christian principles, not because they followed them.

 

[Heretic_Cata]

This is not the purpose of the mass; we are talking about a religion here, ie a celebration, not a philosophical tea salon or a political meeting.

That's why i think several religions are going downhill (catholicism included).

 

[Traitorfish]

Well, Catholicism and nihilistic materialism are hardly the only options, you know.

Indeed- even if you have to over-simplifying things like that, you have to acknowledge humanism as a viewpoint.

 

[Eran of Arcadia]

I don't know the answer to this question, but will be an interesting one to watch.

As Nylan says, look for some new faces in the crowd. Besides the obvious, I think traditional Christianity in general will lose out to all sorts of others.

 

[Pannonius]

Reading this thread, someone could think that catholicism is the only form of christianity and the only religion in Europe. Thank God, we have a choice!
(I really dislike B XVI. That guy is like a B-horror movie caracter.)

 

[Mirc]

Reading this thread, someone could think that catholicism is the only form of christianity and the only religion in Europe. Thank God, we have a choice!
(I really dislike B XVI. That guy is like a B-horror movie caracter.)

I agree.

 

[Naskra]

Very odd to thank god for a choice of religions.

 

[Pannonius]

Well, imagine you live in Saudi Arabia, or in medieval Europe. And I do believe in God, but I despise the church.

 

[Provolution]

I hope for technology to be the new god, in due time.

 

[Traitorfish]

Very odd to thank god for a choice of religions.

Only if your view of God is limited to the jealous, conformity-obsessed maniac of ancient Israel or modern fundamentalism.

 

[Pannonius]

Yes, I ment exactly that Traitorfish. If there is a omnipotent god, then He surely isn't jealous evil little maniac who will torture you if you dont follow the specific creed. And that is what organized religions want us to believe. Sorry, it's a little too ridiculous for my taste.

 

[Eran of Arcadia]

Not all organized religion can be described like that, though.

 

[Plotinus]

No, it certainly can't. Making generalisations about religion like that is always unwise.

 

[Pannonius]

Yes, you're right. Some are way worse than others, but I dont want to name any so no one could get offended. But my general opinion is: more autocracy is always worse.

 

[Plotinus]

That may or may not be the case, but I can't think why you would assume that organised religions necessarily involve autocracy. Most organised religions are far less autocratic than most countries!

 

[LDeska]

My thoughts about Latin mass - I took part in such a mass once, when B16 was in Warsaw last year. Readings were in Polish (B16 really tried to speak Polish ) but the rest was in Latin. It was interesting to listen to it once, but I really prefer to listen to mass in Polish.

I have nothing against this move to let people listen to the mass in Latin. It is strange for me, but some people prefer Latin mass - I don't know why, but if they insist, why not? If mass might be in Suahili, Polish, English etc, why not in Latin? It's just an option, I think that anyway almost all people will use local languages and Latin mass will be only for those who prefer Latin.

Back to the topic: I think that God invented our world in a very clever way - those conformists have no children or not too many, so they will die. Followers have children, so they will not die - simple like an evolution - the better will survive. I hope that Europe will get that resurgence. I live in a country where almost all citizen admits that are Catholics, but rest of Europe probably need such resurgence (but I think that it's not so bad).

 

[Traitorfish]

Back to the topic: I think that God invented our world in a very clever way - those conformists have no children or not too many, so they will die. Followers have children, so they will not die

How, exactly, did you connect "conformist" with irreligious? Most religions are conformist on some level- anything that demands a defined, limited way of thinking will lead to conformity. Even when they break from mainstream conformity, they still maintain inner conformity- look at the Amish. They represent a major break from the mainstream of society, but they are still a hugely conformist group.
Besides, that logic is highly flawed- it makes the assumption that all children raised as "followers" will remain so for the rest of their lives, while the very fact that atheists exist proves this to be a false.

 

[Plotinus]

As far as I can tell, religious profession and childbearing seem to have no particular correlation, apart from the fact that Catholics tend to have more children because they're not supposed to use birth control. But that's just a particular feature of that particular church. I don't understand the claim that "followers" have more children. If they do then that rather undermines the claim of religion to have the moral high ground, given that there are too many people in the world already and plenty of unwanted children requiring adoption: under such circumstances I don't think having lots of children is a morally very defensible act.

 

[Holycannoli]

It's a sad fact that the more well-off people are the less they need God. So basically the more prosperous a country becomes the less religious it's likely to become. That holds especially true for Christianity which praises poverty and piety.

I would love to see a resurgence of catholicism in Europe, just as I'd love to see it here in the US. But I don't see it happening any time soon. People, young people especially, just don't want to be bothered with it's morals and limitations on life, so they instead subscribe to the idea that it's all false (makes their lives easier you know? That's what I used to do before my own personal resurgence).

I do predict though that with the massive Islamic immigration going on in Europe, if it gets out of hand there will be a minor resurgence to sort of counteract the Islamic influence. Europe has traditionally been Christian and I don't think a heavy Islamic influence will be much appreciated.

I also don't think the Latin mass has any relevance today. It's not a language anyone uses. It's perfectly fine to OK Latin masses, but I think only a few traditional parishes will use Latin. Parishes in my area use whatever language the parishoners speak-here it's either English, Spanish or Italian (mostly). I think St. Lucy's in Newark might still use Italian, at least according to my mother and grandmother who used to belong to that parish. EDIT: Nope it's Spanish and English now. Guess the last of the Italians moved out of the neighborhood.