Is it even winnable?

InvincibleSun

Chieftain
Joined
Nov 19, 2020
Messages
4
Hi, everyone!

I got this game in a random fractal map and it looks to be hardly winnable on Deity.


After several turns you meet Pacal, who is boxing you in a small corner.
Good thing is you have Stone and horses but that's it.

HAR is not great idea against Maya.
Any ideas?
 

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I looked at the map and came up with 3 ideas. First it's important to note that you DO have iron.
1. Click IW. Don't even mess with ag/ah. They don't bring you commerce and you have forests for days. Just preroad and prechop everything and make a go of it. I personally gave this a go last night and did manage to take out two cities including his capital. There were heavy losses and I'm not in a good position, but it's certainly possible with decent luck, you'll just be playing crazy catch-up after that point.

2. Beeline your second city on stone and try for TGW. While TGW can only reliably be built on deity if your capital has stone in BFC, if you WERE going to rely on a second city bringing you stone, TW and Myst are actually the best starting techs for this. After Masonry go Monotheism, not even joking. The holy city gives a 40% bonus on espionage, and lets you run OR asap for more failgold from the stone wonders and to build a couple missionaries to prepare target cities for tech steals. Should be able to make it to cataphracts, just save all the forests so you have some way to build them.

3. Combo! Open settler first heading to stone and steal a worker off Pacal to mine/road to stone. You can win TGW north of 95% of the time with this improvement. Build a wall w/ stone while teching archery, then add a few archers, and you can farm GGs with both IMP and TGW's bonus. Use these for a bunch of CRIII swords and use the gspy to get back into the game economically after you kill Pacal.

Ideas 2-3 kinda rely on map knowledge, but #1 is pretty honest. You'd have to assume you have iron, but in game I think I'd make that assumption out of sheer desperation here, as you're more likely to have iron than beat holkans with chariots.
 
I did think about the 1c from horses but it's not paying off in time lol. I actually think fishing first has a chance to pay off, especially with a second city working the coast. But that's really gamey, because unless you know what you're in for no one looks at that start, sees a lake, wheat and cow and thinks mmmm fish. Getting a second city down does break even just with trade routes and gives you a way to convert failgold into beakers.
 
To be honest just because the AI gets holkans as a resourceless unit doesn't mean that they will build many of them.

Agriculture, AH....Mining, Bronze Working --> whatever you want

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WOW!
It really does not look that hopeless anymore. You showed me ways to break out.
Thanks a lot, everyone!
 
You killed 2 holkan, 4 archers, and 2 chariots while only losing 6 chariots? :dubious:
Some of the archers could have been barbs? Perhaps the Holkans injured by barbs too. Maybe 1-2 units on settler escort. 14 chariots so possible some withdrew from combat.

As Mylene suggests maybe some luck too. Usually chariot vs holkan is not great odds. Even worse if fortified with 40% culture too.
 
I had a go today, with a more peaceful approach.

Tech path agriculture, animal husbandry, writing. Failgold Stonehenge.

I was able to settle 2 cities (eastern fish, western fish + clams) beyond pacal. Then early scientist for math bulb and hit pacal at construction. I built the pyramids in between, was going for fail gold but actually got them…

Ended in a loss sadly as Ragnar and kublai dog piled me straight after, but definitely a possible approach.
 
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