Israeli government sets up checkpoints in East Jerusalem

[JollyRoger]

Just a matter of time before Israel kills a few hundred women and children in retaliation.

 

[Formaldehyde]

Most likely, "Jewishness" in the ethnic sense as opposed to a religious sense.

Is that supposed to be any sort of rationalization for the religion-based human rights violations, Judaic sharia laws, and a general insistence a god specifically gave that land to them as the basis for rampant xenophobia, while doing essentially nothing to stop blatant discrimination and persecution of those of other religious groups? That more people in Israel now might consider it an ethnic issue than a religious one?

Jews don't need a specific "homeland" any more than Kurds or any other ethnic or religious group do. This is particularly true when they are directly instigating and fomenting so much ethnic and religious trouble in a region where it clearly needs to be de-emphasized instead of the opposite.

They should only have two choices. Either become a true democracy where Arabs will soon outnumber them, if they haven't already. Or finally give the Palestinians back their land which was agreed upon back in 1948 in the very same agreement which created Israel in the first place. If they refuse, the UNSC should implement harsh economic sanctions against them while turning them into international pariah. Eventually, a coalition should be formed to overthrow their government after doing everything possible to destroy their nuclear capabilities beforehand.

Just a matter of time before Israel kills a few hundred women and children in retaliation.

Drop knives have probably already become quite fashionable accessories.

 

[Tahuti]

Eventually, a coalition should be formed to overthrow their government after doing everything possible to destroy their nuclear capabilities beforehand.

Man, even Dubya wasn't that crazy.

 

[Kyriakos]

Most likely, "Jewishness" in the ethnic sense as opposed to a religious sense. Israel's political culture closely resembles that European countries, more precisely Early 20th century European states and in particular Imperial Germany, which isn't a surprise, considering the first Zionists were German Jews. It's quite possible that (German-)Jewish ethnocentrism was an inheritance from Imperial German political thought, as Imperial Germany conducted policies, particularly against Poles, that were rather similar to modern day Israeli policies including building settlements.

There is a strong emphasis on Westphalian nationalism, which distrusts international institutions as well as transnational institutions like multinational corporations but also universalist religions like Christianity and Islam. This is even more emphasised by the fact most Israelis are either non-religious or member of the Jewish faith, which is particularistic.

Sadly there are parallels between current Israel and another era of Germany as well

 

[JollyRoger]

Yeah - "never forget" may mean something quite sinister to Netanyahoo and company.

 

[Tahuti]

Sadly there are parallels between current Israel and another era of Germany as well

Prussia?

 

[Kyriakos]

Prussia?

Ulm.
-

 

[classical_hero]

http://david-collier.com/?p=1151

Before the partition, before Israel, before the settlements, before the ‘occupation’, before the refugees, before Sharon walked onto Temple Mount, before the ‘wall’, before immigration, before Balfour and before even Zionism itself. In the beginning there was an Arab with a knife and he murdered a Jew, simply because he was a Jew. It is an absurd logic that attempts to blame Zionism for creating violence against Jews when Zionism *only came about* because of relentless violence against Jews; both in Europe and in the Middle East. You cannot place the cart before the horse. Enough with the excuses.

Arabs have always killed Jews with knives. It is time we hold Arabs responsible for their attacks. No more excuses allowed.

But as is typical of all Arab violence it is based on lies.
http://www.timesofisrael.com/terrorist-abbas-said-executed-by-israel-shown-alive-in-hospital/
This boy was supposedly "executed by Israel, but he is clearly alive. There is no need for Israel to not shoot aat children, when the Arabs are sending them in to do the killing themselves. Now this is the Amnesty Internation approved method of defending against knife attacks, since you can't kill someone who is trying to kill you with a knife.
https://www.facebook.com/RogatkaProductions/videos/1005075889544657/

 

[Formaldehyde]

Man, even Dubya wasn't that crazy.

Why in the world would the biggest threat to world peace want to attack his staunch ally, Netanyahu, the second biggest threat to world peace at the time?

 

[JollyRoger]

Bringing knives to a missile fight?

 

[Ajidica]

http://david-collier.com/?p=1151


Arabs have always killed Jews with knives. It is time we hold Arabs responsible for their attacks. No more excuses allowed.

But as is typical of all Arab violence it is based on lies.
http://www.timesofisrael.com/terrorist-abbas-said-executed-by-israel-shown-alive-in-hospital/
This boy was supposedly "executed by Israel, but he is clearly alive. There is no need for Israel to not shoot aat children, when the Arabs are sending them in to do the killing themselves. Now this is the Amnesty Internation approved method of defending against knife attacks, since you can't kill someone who is trying to kill you with a knife.
https://www.facebook.com/RogatkaProductions/videos/1005075889544657/

I'm not trying to trap you in a 'gotcha!' moment or anything, I'm genuinely curious as to your opinion on the Israeli government saying it will destroy the houses of and remove the residency of the families of the individuals responsible for criminal attacks.
Original question:

As probably the most vocal supporter of the current Israeli government on this forum, I am curious as to your opinion on the Israeli government saying it will destroy the homes and strip residency from the families of the attackers; an action which basically flies in the face of established norms for criminal law of limiting the punishment to the ones that committed the criminal act.

 

[JollyRoger]

Rumor has it that Israel may sue the United States for infringing on its intellectual property by attacking the Afghanistan hospital.

 

[HannibalBarka]

Most likely, "Jewishness" in the ethnic sense as opposed to a religious sense. Israel's political culture closely resembles that European countries, more precisely Early 20th century European states and in particular Imperial Germany, which isn't a surprise, considering the first Zionists were German Jews. It's quite possible that (German-)Jewish ethnocentrism was an inheritance from Imperial German political thought, as Imperial Germany conducted policies, particularly against Poles, that were rather similar to modern day Israeli policies including building settlements.

There is a strong emphasis on Westphalian nationalism, which distrusts international institutions as well as transnational institutions like multinational corporations but also universalist religions like Christianity and Islam. This is even more emphasised by the fact most Israelis are either non-religious or member of the Jewish faith, which is particularistic.

I think what you are saying was true from the begining of the Zionist movement till well after the creation of Israel in the late 80ies. Secular Ashkenazi jews were running the country, they had few "religious" jews to deal with in the begining. Later on more religious jews came to the country (most of them Sefaradi) but were too poor and less educated so they were politically less influential than the established Ashkenazi/secular establishement.
Things start to change in the 90ies and Israel government and the state itself start to be more religious because Sefaradi become more influential, their kids did receive a good education and became economically/politically more influential. Many Sefaradi jews became important political figures, some thing that was very rare in the early days of Israel and compeltly absent in the early days of Zionism which was exclusively european. The rise of Hamas and Islamism in the Palestinian movement did happen at almost the same time and I think the two movements were strengthening each other. The conflict that was mostly national started to become religious. If it weren't the fall of the USSR and the following migration of thousands of eastern mostly secular jews to Israel, the phenomenon would have been much more visible.
Today religious jews do indeed have a big role in Israeli politics, some time it is indeed mixed with nationalism but that does not remove the importance of religion in Israeli politics. Religion and Nationalism are mixed in the Palestinians politics same way.
Today, the importance of religion in Israel is in no way comparable to that in Europe. Sadly.

 

[Tahuti]

I think what you are saying was true from the begining of the Zionist movement till well after the creation of Israel in the late 80ies. Secular Ashkenazi jews were running the country, they had few "religious" jews to deal with in the begining. Later on more religious jews came to the country (most of them Sefaradi) but were too poor and less educated so they were politically less influential than the established Ashkenazi/secular establishement.
Things start to change in the 90ies and Israel government and the state itself start to be more religious because Sefaradi become more influential, their kids did receive a good education and became economically/politically more influential. Many Sefaradi jews became important political figures, some thing that was very rare in the early days of Israel and compeltly absent in the early days of Zionism which was exclusively european. The rise of Hamas and Islamism in the Palestinian movement did happen at almost the same time and I think the two movements were strengthening each other. The conflict that was mostly national started to become religious. If it weren't the fall of the USSR and the following migration of thousands of eastern mostly secular jews to Israel, the phenomenon would have been much more visible.
Today religious jews do indeed have a big role in Israeli politics, some time it is indeed mixed with nationalism but that does not remove the importance of religion in Israeli politics. Religion and Nationalism are mixed in the Palestinians politics same way.
Today, the importance of religion in Israel is in no way comparable to that in Europe. Sadly.

You forgot the influence of Soviet Jewish migration in the early 1990s. They are quite secular. Quite often atheists. While they generally despise Palestinians, unlike most of the Israeli right are often explicitly anticlerical, seeking to reduce the influence of Jewish religion by pressuring the Israeli government to give more leeway for the slaughter and sale of pork, for instance.

So, the Israeli political landscape is more polarised, not more religious or more secular. Both those who are secular and religious have gained more power at the expense of those seeking a middle ground. And Israel is arguably more hostile to Palestinians than ever, because it makes Israelis forgot issues that otherwise prove divisive such as the Secularism vs. Religion debate.

 

[HannibalBarka]

You forgot the influence of Soviet Jewish migration in the early 1990s. They are quite secular. Quite often atheists. While they generally despise Palestinians, unlike most of the Israeli right are often explicitly anticlerical, seeking to reduce the influence of Jewish religion by pressuring the Israeli government to give more leeway for the slaughter and sale of pork, for instance.

So, the Israeli political landscape is more polarised, not more religious or more secular. Both those who are secular and religious have gained more power at the expense of those seeking a middle ground. And Israel is arguably more hostile to Palestinians than ever, because it makes Israelis forgot issues that otherwise prove divisive such as the Secularism vs. Religion debate.

I di not forget it, I wrote this :

If it weren't the fall of the USSR and the following migration of thousands of eastern mostly secular jews to Israel, the phenomenon would have been much more visible.

 

[Tahuti]

I di not forget it, I wrote this :

If it weren't the fall of the USSR and the following migration of thousands of eastern mostly secular jews to Israel, the phenomenon would have been much more visible.

My bad, though the influx of Soviet Jews had an impact just as great as rise to power of Sefaradim. Possibly greater.

 

[CELTICEMPIRE]

Vice is suggesting that this is Intifada 3.0.

 

[useless]

Given that Israel has no actual intent of ever agreeing to any sort of 2-state solution, it seems more violence is inevitable.

 

[classical_hero]

I'm not trying to trap you in a 'gotcha!' moment or anything, I'm genuinely curious as to your opinion on the Israeli government saying it will destroy the houses of and remove the residency of the families of the individuals responsible for criminal attacks.
Original question:

If you read the article you see that this has been happening for a long time and it unfortunately a cultural thing for Arabs to do, so you have to punish the society for fomenting this and destroying the terrorists houses i one way to do that. Enough with the excuses of Arab violence since they have been doing this sort of thing for far too long and the West needs to punish the Arabs for this.

@useless, there already is two states from the Palestine mandate, Israel and Jordan, We don't need a 3 state solution.

 

[Silurian]

It has been going on for a long time!

Frim Wiki

Spoiler :

Sicarii (Latin plural form of Sicarius "dagger-man"; in Modern Hebrew rendered siqariqim סיקריקי&#1501 is a term applied, in the decades immediately preceding the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 CE, to an extremist splinter group[1] of the Jewish Zealots, who attempted to expel the Romans and their partisans from the Roman province of Judea.[2] The Sicarii carried sicae, or small daggers, concealed in their cloaks, hence their name.[3] At public gatherings, they pulled out these daggers to attack Romans or Roman sympathizers, blending into the crowd after the deed to escape detection. They were one of the earliest forms of an organized assassination society or cloak and daggers, predating the Middle Eastern assassins and Japanese ninjas by centuries.[4][5]