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King of the World #19: Qin Shi Huang

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Strategy & Tips' started by Neal, Sep 16, 2011.

  1. GGracchus

    GGracchus Tribune of Rome

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    +1 to cavalry. Extra movement is awesome. I would go after europe first, in my games hatty peacevassaled to me, so if you're lucky she'll do the same to you and won't force you to waste troops on her. She is 4th in power, but your power is constantly growing faster. Europe is better land, too.
     
  2. r_rolo1

    r_rolo1 King of myself

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    Vassals in AW ? :nono: Unless RAW changes that ...

    Anyway, solid progress. Too bad that you had to see Moscow burn because you couldn't keep it ... Napoleon complex ? :D But I echo GGrachus . Cavs and go to Europe first, then Hatty, then ... well , I'm pretty sure that Mr Zuma will give you a warm welcome with his 134142343245 units :p
     
  3. The Oz-Man

    The Oz-Man Enter: The VAIKE!

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    Man. Five Great Generals. That's building level 3 units right out the gates. With no Barracks or Vassalage.

    I mean, you didn't really need it, but wow. Sucks that it had to go.

    In America, unless Monty can manage to get a credible stack to Chile (probably not), I suspect Monty will have to fall back on ritualistic slaughter of his own people to sate his bloodlust. Ten bucks says you never even meet him.

    At this point, Cavs are going to win the game for you. Africa is enormous, and slogging through all of that territory by foot is going to be a bear. Grens are good, but you've said yourself that everyone's a long way off from Rifles, so you can probably put them off for now. The only good reason to go through Chemistry is for Cannon down the road, and I don't think you'll need them.

    How's the tech screen looking now that you've got Alphabet? Ridiculous, I bet? ;) I only ask because I suspect your opponents are going to start spamming Castles if they've got Engineering, and that's probably the best justification for going for Steel.

    Pacify Europe first, then Africa. As long as Saladin's still alive, he should buffer the old Persian lands for you from Hattie. Europe should go fairly quickly considering how tight everything is over there. Then on to Africa to squash Hattie and watch Mansa launch his spaceship!
     
  4. strijder20

    strijder20 Wallowing in irony

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    Be more clear, please? Montegandhizuma? Montepassmethesaltpleasezuma? Monteeverestzuma?

    Do you have an obsession with nude emperors/empires?

    Don't forget she is researching Metal Casting. On Monarch. And it's 1500 AD.
     
  5. Neal

    Neal King of the World

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    Regarding Cavalry, keep in mind that it's not quite as simple as Nationalism-Military Tradition. There's also Music. Which requires Drama or Literature. Which both require Aesthetics. Not a huge extra burden, but an extra burden nonetheless.
     
  6. GGracchus

    GGracchus Tribune of Rome

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    I'll take your word for it, I've never played AW...
     
  7. strijder20

    strijder20 Wallowing in irony

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    Neal, you could also go Chemistry-Steel-MS, and use Grenadiers, Cannons and Frigates. At least it's somewhat different from the ordinary cavalry rush ;)
     
  8. Neal

    Neal King of the World

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    'Course, then I need Compass-Optics-Astronomy :p
     
  9. WelshGandalf

    WelshGandalf King

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    Start rolling on people with rifles, then add in cannons or cavalry or whatever. You should tech towards one of them, then the other, the 3 of them together should take you to the end of the game I reckon.

    Personally I think go cavalry and switch to nationhood on the way, that'll get you an awful lot of riflemen up in short order.
     
  10. Bigv32

    Bigv32 Prince

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    If you want to stick with just rifles then I would go with cannon. If you think you can wait for cannon then I would go for cavalry.

    If you get nationalism as you go for cavalry, you could build the Maj Tohong (sorry for spelling I am talking about the wonder that gives you a free golden age.) In some of the games I build it in, I can usually get it built right as I get Cavalry, so the extra hammers make it a faster process to build them. On top of that, it would give you a boost to get cannons.

    As for whom to attack next, if you go for cannons, I would hit Europe as cavs don't do well in hills. If you go cavs, then hit Egypt/Africa.
     
  11. Neal

    Neal King of the World

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    Or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love Low Difficulty Settings

    All of Asia, once fragrant with exotic spices and the metallic tang of the occasional Forge, now hung thick with the scent of burnt powder. Traditionalists clucked their tongues and wondered what would become of traditional Chinese warrior virtue, but the march of progress was resolute. Shining armor and Knightly steeds gave way to neatly pressed uniforms and heavy Cannons. The Emperor's advisors recommended outfitting China's Knights with Rifled firearms for the sake of mobility, but Qin Shi Huang was thinking bigger. Cavalry could indeed move quickly on Engineered Roads, but do you know what could move faster? Riflemen and Cannons on Rails, and these latter would pack more of a punch in the field. And the Iron Horse was tantalizingly close.

    Newly trained Riflemen, backed up by traditional Maces, Knights, and Trebuchets, descended upon Basra, the gateway to Saladin's empire. Arabia is normally a backwater on the Earth18 map, hamstrung by empty deserts and powerful neighbors. With Real Always War, Saladin could not even ingratiate himself with the rest of the world and trade himself to near-parity. No, he was forced to face down a modern army with Archers and Chariots:



    The city was rechristened Kuwait and quickly surrounded by Cottages. Yes, Saladin would be easy pickings. And his empire, while hardly as fruitful a core as east Asia, would certainly be able to contribute as a satellite state.

    Let it not be said, though, that China was all happiness and light in those days. Conditions were harsh in the Forges, turning out gun barrels in the searing heat. Maimings were not infrequent, and, finally, in the island-city of Yakushima, resentment over the regrettably necessary institution of Slavery boiled over into open revolt:



    The emperor was not a cruel man, and so he took pity on the slaves, providing pensions for the lame and the families of those who had died in their work. But social justice was not a major issue on his agenda. No, he was Qin the Conqueror, not Qin the Soft-Hearted. Slavery would continue. The long hours would continue, for blacksmiths and scholars alike. China had shirked its destiny long enough. The time for glory, true glory, had come.

    Where Saladin was a primitive savage, Hatshepsut of Egypt was a scholar-queen, second only to Qin Shi Huang in the arts and sciences. Her cities were garrisoned by Longbowmen and Macemen, soldiers which had been state of the art in China mere centuries before. Regardless, though, they stood little chance against truly modern weaponry:



    Elephantine was large, but poorly placed and full of Egyptian national sentiment, and it lacked the infrastructure that might have softened the emperor's heart. The city burned.

    As that stack eliminated Hatshepsut's influence in the region, another opened a backdoor into Russia's heartland:



    Steel was in hand, and Cannons were being manufactured and shipped from as far away as Shanghai. But until they arrived on the front lines, older technology would have to do. And do it did, albeit slowly, and with more losses than the emperor was comfortable with. But soldiers could always be replaced. Catherine's lost cities would not be rewon.

    Without siege weapons, the battle on Russia's eastern front was going so slowly that it could hardly be termed a battle at all. It had become more of a guerilla war of denial, as Mines and Farms were razed and the occasional straggling unit caught out in the open was routed. Spies were in place, but without anything for them to do until reinforcements arrived, they busied themselves backfilling our techs a bit:



    We'd eventually pick up Polytheism, Compass, and even Drama. Hardly vital stuff, but a worthy use of our massive stockpiles of Espionage Points.

    By the mid-16th century, the groundwork was in place to begin work on the specifics of the emperor's dreams of Railroads. In addition, Riflemen began to outnumber archaic units in the field, and the first Cannons had arrived at the front lines. It was time to put an end to Saladin's presence on the leaderboard:





    Sadly, cleansing the Arabian peninsula did not rid the world of Arabia. I would later learn that he had retreated to Madagascar, which is honestly not worth the trouble it will take to conquer. Saladin is, for all intents and purposes, done with. At least for now.

    Despite my intentions at the end of last round, I found myself salivating at the thought of the Egyptian empire being within my grasp, especially when I saw how thinly defended it was:



    Mind you, its defenses were increased as China's military might was brought to bear, but those defenses were still woefully inadequate. Europe could wait.

    As the first Train neared completion, Chinese Cannon had finally made its way into eastern Russia. Catherine's time of defiance was at an end:



    I won't bore you with every screenshot, but the war with Russia would quickly become a rout, and my greatest challenge became Alt-Tabbing to look up real-world names for all the cities I was taking over. It became a little tedious toward the end, so I'm sure I missed on a few.

    Thebes and Memphis (renamed Luxor) were every bit the shining jewels I'd hoped they would be:





    A few more settled Great People would have been nice, but they had Infrastructure and Wonders, and they were surrounded by fully-developed Flood Plain Towns. Astute readers will also note that, with Railroads completed (and with tracks being laid from Korea to Egypt), research had begun on Scientific Method. Combustion was within our grasp, and we had very few Monasteries (Two? Three, maybe?) that would go obsolete, so the ability to see our Oil deposits would be helpful.

    By the middle of the 17th century, China's military was almost fully modernized, and had become a true juggernaut:



    And that's just one stack of many. You'll also note that Combustion has been delayed by Communism, one of the must-have techs on a map this big.

    With State Property unlocked, it was time for the Wonder Triplets to fashion a Golden Age out of cryptography, heliocentric models, and exploration of places that were already Chinese territories to begin with:



    The Civics switch, coupled with the effects of a Golden Age, had a tremendous effect on our research output. Between the two, our Beakers per turn nearly doubled.

    You can see these effects in the following screenshot, which documents our armies pushing farther south into Africa:



    A lack of proper reinforcements, together with the difficulty of shipping troops over rough Egyptian Roads, would cause the African front to stall a bit, but Hatshepsut is (by the end of the round), confined to what I believe is two cities in the south of Africa.

    By 1655, the well had been bled dry on the game's Great General list:



    Such is life. The Settler standing in the ruins of Elephantine went on to found Suez in the spot occupied by the Cannon. Hardly a great city, but it cements my hold on the region, in addition to opening the Mediterranean up to my ships. That's right, ships. With Combustion near completion, we will have entirely skipped the Age of Sail. From Galleys and Triremes to Transports and Destroyers :D

    Of course, I'm not perfect. Once I'm faced with the dozens of cities that a rollicking Earth18 game provides, I can get a little lazy. Hence my leaving cities open to opportunistic Greek raiders:



    Novorossiysk was quickly retaken, of course, and I took Athens, too, for good measure, but that still stung a bit. I think it might have lost a Granary in the chaos.

    And Alexander wasn't exactly super careful himself:



    Well, sure, I'll pounce on your totally unprotected Settler traipsing near my borders. Don't mind if I do, thanks.

    A quick jaunt into Nationalism (for Constitution and Corporation, mind you- I think the window of usefulness may have closed on Military Tradition) allowed Hong Kong to extend our Golden Age through a feat of architectural beauty:



    And, yes, that is indeed Assembly Line on the docket. I'm getting a little tired of looking at all those Riflemen, what can I say? :)

    Rome beat us to Alexander's last city, but taking it from Caesar was no chore at all, and that spelled the end of Greece and, ominously, the Inca:



    So.... Monty has been busy, after all. He now apparently controls the whole of the New World. And 1700 isn't a bad year for him to complete it. That's near human speed. He'll be a force to reckon with if we decide to tangle with him. As of the end of the round, we have a Destroyer off the coast of Mexico, and a single Transport loaded with Cannons and Riflemen prepared to form a beachhead, if that's what you all want to see.

    But first, we have some other decisions to make. Like Technology:



    I think it's finally time to go Optics-Astronomy. I've gotten a ton of use out of Stonehenge, but we need Physics for Planes and Tanks. Well, we don't technically need anything at this point, but you know what I mean. And another free Great Person will be icing on the cake.

    Here's a look at our frankly ridiculous empire:



    The gray areas of the map are no longer really our problem since we liberated the Great Wall from Hatshepsut. So I don't see much of a need to settle those deserts unless we decide to go Domination. And yeah. Catherine is now confined to one city which will be under siege in a turn or two, and Egypt and Arabia now seem to consist of two cities apiece. It's all mopup from here on out (again, unless we decide to hit up the Americas).

    Here's a look at our Military Advisor:



    Looks a lot different from last round, huh? We're a little Cannon-heavy on the northern European front, and, again, our African army is basically exhausted. Maybe enough to clear out the Egyptian remnant, but in no way ready to tangle with the Mali.

    Finally, for the first time, the Victory Screen:



    Yup, we're now one of ten. Seven, if you consider that Russia, Egypt, and Arabia are pretty much already dead. Two, if you consider that the Aztecs are the only real challenge left. So let's talk victory conditions. The next round will be our win. It's all a matter of, what kind of win do you want to see?

    The save:
     
  12. capnvonbaron

    capnvonbaron Democratia gladii

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    Ahh I love the smell of gunpowder in the morning! I also love when a new round pops up just as I get done reading the last round :goodjob: I think domination is the best option here, although culture isn't out of the question.....
     
  13. The Oz-Man

    The Oz-Man Enter: The VAIKE!

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    Turtle up and go into space! :mischief:

    Nah, just keep killing guys until you hit either Domination or Conquest--whichever comes first. Straight-up wipe-everyone-out Conquest is usually too tedious, but it shouldn't be hard.

    Tech path is good. Beeline Industrialism for Tanks and win. It's really a matter of what sounds fun at this point, and a big climactic battle with Monty might be a good time just to see what kind of stacks he's fielding in his empire (which should be enormous and full of jillions of Axemen). You're really not that far from Flight, so an intercontinental invasion will be less of a bear once airports go online. You likely won't get the land area you need taking Mansa and Europe without spamming some Settlers, and that's boring. ;) Monty must pay!
     
  14. Bigv32

    Bigv32 Prince

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    I was very interested in the tech screen. I had no idea you could bipass so many techs. I mean destroyers without optics? I found that funny.

    Well now you have to just mop up. I would beeline flight and take to the skies.

    I know tanks are cool, but since you will have to cross the atlantic, planes will be better. Fighters, bombers, and destroyers can take down the culture and whatever is left over could be your seige. It would make it easier as all you would have to do is transport rifles/infantry.

    Granted that assumes that monty is as backwards as usual.

    So my opinion is to continue mopping up Europe/Africa and send a destroyer to find out if monty is close to flight. If he is, beeline tanks, if not, beeline flight and start bombing his cities while you wait for your ground troops. If you go for flight, I would then beeline radio for bombers.
     
  15. strijder20

    strijder20 Wallowing in irony

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    Go diplo! Fitting for the variant!
     
  16. WelshGandalf

    WelshGandalf King

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    Clearly Monotheism is the obvious next thing to research.
     
  17. Coffee Mug

    Coffee Mug Chieftain

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    What about a quick detour to fascism for the great spy and Mt. Rushmore? It looks like there are a few unhappy cities; is war weariness a factor at all?
     
  18. Archon_Wing

    Archon_Wing Vote for me or die

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    I would say tech to nukes while cleaning everyone up, and turn the New World into a radioactive wasteland. :D
     
  19. Bigv32

    Bigv32 Prince

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    Nice idea. I did not think about nukes. However, unless he hits shift-enter alot, it will take a while to get there. If all he does is nuke, I am assuming you are voting for a victory other than conquest?
     
  20. Jehoshua

    Jehoshua Catholic

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    You must destroy the usurper emperor of the Americas who dares lay claim to equality with the son of heaven and destroy him in a final intercontinental war so that you may dominate the worldon both Afro-Eurasia, and in the Americas.

    Honestly taking out the pitiful eurotrash would be much less interesting than attempting a final epic conflict with montezuma. Nukes would just waste time and conquest is too tedious.
     

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