Let's discuss Mathematics

Well, I guess it's suppsoed to be some kind of joke or comment on maths.

The idea is that the equation x2 +1=0 has

1) no real number solution, since each x in R has non-negative square

2) solution i in complex numbers, C, and

3) solutions 2 and 3 in quotient group Z5.

The idea of C is that while there's no real number x such that x2 =-1, we can imagine there is one, so let's call it imaginary number i. Some people did this during and after renessaince as a tool to solve equations, but they didn't accept them as answers (if I remember correctly). Then they found out that these imaginary numbers can be used in a rigorous way: calculate like i is just a unknown variable, and at the end use knowledge that i2=-1. For example:
(x+2i)(2x2-i)=2x3-ix+4ix2-2i2 (pay attention to the last term)
=2x3+4ix2-ix -2(-1)
=2x3+4ix2-ix +2. Here we have used i2=-1.

You also have geometric interpretation of C when instead of thinking numbers as a straight, you think a plane: Complex number x+iy is a point on a plane, whose cordinates are (x,y):
Complex_number_illustration.svg


So the numbers without imaginary part are only the x-axis, which corresponds the straight of real numbers. Complex numers are added then like vectors, and for the multiplication there's simple geometric interpertation too, but explaining it on this brief text would probably just get you confused.

The quotient group Z5 is just group {0,1,2,3,4} (total of five numbers), and you calculate there just like with natural numbers, but whenever you get something bigger than four, you substract so many fives that the number is in the group again.

For an example, 3+2=0 (calculate 3+2=5, and substract 5).
2+2+2=1 (calculate 2+2+2=6 and substract 5)
4*3=2 (calculate 4*3=12 and substract 5, you get 7, substract 5 again, and you get 2)
22 +1 =0 (calculate 2*2+1=5 and substract 5).
32 +1 =0 (calculate 3*3+1=10, substract 5, you get 5, and substract 5 again, and you get 0).

Quotient groups are pretty simple also, and are covered in elementary algebra books. This wikipage seems to be pretty easy to understand too (probably more so than my explanation, but since written I won't bother to erase it).

Ambiguity of mathematics is whole different thing though. The equation at the top is itself ambiguous as it doesn't say what kind of thing x is supposed to be, so it's no wonder that the answers are ambiguous too. It's like asking "who is the president?". You have to narrow it down, president of what country? If the country is US, it's Barack Obama. If Finland, Tarja Halonen. If Sweden, there's no answer. However that doesn't mean that the state offices were ambiguously held.

The whole thing relies on the high school -way of thinking that equations themselves are meaningful, but of course you have to specify to what group the unknown variable belongs. This on the other hand comes from the thought that maths deals only with numbers, and the word "number" itself is unambiguous. So this thing boils down to asking amiguous question, and when there's no answer deducing that maths is ambiguous. Little like child thinking that "Who?" is in itself meaningful question.

As often in these cases, it also contains error, since also x=-i solves the equation in C.
 
Thanks for that. I can't believe I forgot C stood for the complex numbers. And thanks for teaching me what Z5 is.
 
No problem. My explanation was pretty brief though, but I guess the wiki article is tells it better. It had a picture of clock at least, which illustrates the point pretty good: time goes always on, but whenever you reach 12 you alwyas jump back to 1. And so you can calculate that 5 hours after 10 is at three o'clock (that's Z12).
 
The way they (try to) explain it to us (also a physics student) is that it's a bit like a matrix. That's pretty wishy washy too though :p)
 
Tensors are a generalisation of vectors and matrices.

An order 0 tensor is a scalar.
An order 1 tensor is a vector.
An order 2 tensor is a matrix.

And then you can get into more complex things such as an order 3 tensor :)

Basically it's an n-dimensional array, but we can't use the word "dimension", as that already refers to the number of elements in a vector.

Also see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tensor .
 
so would a 3rd rank tensor be visualised as a matrix that has a z axis also? (depth), and then 4D would be some continuation of this. (excepting of course, that its NOT a dimension). And I would be correct in saying that tensors are sort of a step up from scalar/vector/matrix (i.e. a step up from a number could be seen as algebra, a more general approach which contains all numbers, whilst in this case Tensors are a step up from scalar/vectors and matrices)

Furthermore, any simple examples? The example in the wiki pages simply reduces to matrix elements, and I think this is hindering my understanding of what tensors are, is there a simple enough higher order example out there?
 
Caution: Although it is very convenient to see tensors just as an extension of vectors and matrices, they're not just that.

Tensors are expected to transform in a certain way under coordinate transformations.

Not everything that looks like a tensor actually is a tensor. If you stick to the standard tensors and don't do something like General Relativity, it's unlikely that you run into that, but it's something you should keep in mind.
 
I've run into them in differential geometry course, but am not able to clarify them. If you want, I can give tell some books which might be worth looking at, but I must also warn, that physicicts may find them useless.
 
so would a 3rd rank tensor be visualised as a matrix that has a z axis also? (depth), and then 4D would be some continuation of this. (excepting of course, that its NOT a dimension).
I'm not sure in what sense you mean - it's called order rather than dimension, though that's really just terminology.

Furthermore, any simple examples? The example in the wiki pages simply reduces to matrix elements, and I think this is hindering my understanding of what tensors are, is there a simple enough higher order example out there?
See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Levi-Civita_symbol for example of an order 3 tensor.
 
Actually the Levi-Civita-symbol is a pseudotensor. It aquires a minus sign on mirroring transformations. Tensors don't do that.
 
We had a revision lecture today for my physical mathmatics course, I asked him about these tensors (oddly not in the course this year, but they were the year before, and they aren't used till the 5th year :/).

Anyway, I think he managed to adequetly describe via comparing a bifrigent crystal to that of a normal application of snells law. (I.e. a normal one would simply have n down the diagonal, whilst the fact that the bifrigent crystal would depend on polariation would add terms to the matrix. And basically talked about how it used for coupled situation, which I broadly understood and put my mind to rest on the subject.)
 
Mathematically speaking a (k,l)-Tensor T over a Vectorspace V is formally defined as a multilinear function with the first k arguments being Vectors V and the next l in the dual space. So an example for a (2,0)-Tensor would be the standard scalar product.

Using a given base e_1,..,e_n for V you can then characterize T by how it acts on the vectors of that base. In the above example that would
be
T_j,j = e_i * e_j.

Because that representations depends on the base, the T_i,j do also change when changing the base and do so according to certain transformation laws.

Differential geometry is a good example where tensors are used, vectors, the metric and curvature are all tensors but the Christoffel-Symbols which do *look* like a tensor in that it is given by components like above is not. Because it behaves differently under transformations.
 
Are derivatives of vector valued functions tensors as well?

E.g. derivative of a fn from R^2 -> R is a vector. 2nd derivative is a matrix. 3rd derivative = tensor?
 
True, so does differentiating a vector function just bump the rank of the tensor?
 
I'm not sure, I understood about half of what Ammar said. Then again I'm not usually obliged to understand it mathmatically, only enough to be able to play around with it.

So further I'm not sure how differentiating it alters things, I've only looked at vector calculus, nothing further :/
 
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