LK81 - Exploring RaR, Monarchy, a new civ

[meldor]

From the games I have played it is important to get the food bonuses early. Since you can not irrigate to start, if you want the kingdom to grow, you have to have something.

The first game I played, my capital had no food bonuses around it. I had to builf the 30 shield settlers and my capital was stuck at size 2 until I could irrigate.

 

[Doc Tsiolkovski]

Emperor/DG in RaR are comparable with the regular levels, once you have limited knowledge of the Mod. Of course, when you really know the tricks, it might be easier. Deity depends a lot on the start; a mediocre start feels more like Sid.

You should make sure to use the RaR1.01 version; there are no gamebreaking problems in 1.00, but annoyances.

And I'm sure Pfeffersack can tell you what to do.

 

[meldor]

The civ will be random. I am playing with the Rar 1.01 basic.biq file.

I have what is supposed to be the latest version and it has version 1.00 of the file. I will redownload the files from the site. I don't think it will matter unless there were changes to the units. Since you start the game, the rest of us don't need the biq file.

I will see what it says after the re-install.

 

[Pfeffersack]

I would rate Emperor in RaR close to Emperor in Conquests (under the assumption your are familar with the mods special characteristics and basic rules).Monarch is the first level the AI plays resonable, but soon to easy IMO if you are an experienced Civ3 player.

As meldor pointed out, food boni and city location are very important (even more because irrigation is pushed back).The value of the civ traits is not the same; for example the number of differnt government makes religious much more valuable.RaR gives an offense playing style an edge, because of the relative higher units offensive stats.High production is important in civ, but even more in RAR, since the progression in costs is steeper.And with all the stuff there is one rule: you can build anything, but not everything; it is all about choice, but you have a lot of ways to win.

There is more, but as DocTS has already (cross)posted, those things will come up during playing

 

[LKendter]

There was a patch announcement that I downloaded. It give the newer .biq along with instructions to copy one directory. I can't recall the directory to copy of the top of my head.

I will work on getting this started soon. My new PC just arrived today, so I will be busy for a bit getting it running.

Some notes I started accumlating about RaR:
1) Rate cap governments are a royal pain. It is very easy to run into financial trouble with science forced to be 50% at chiefdom. Expect more then one revolt.

2) War is much more likely in the ancient age. Every city must have a quality defender. Paper cutout defense is a guarantee of war.

3) Cash is pretty useless early on. Use it heavily to buy techs, and to upgrade units. It will get demanded away else wise. Not to mention barbarians raids.

4) The tech tree is radically different, and even the simple things like irrigation aren't available for a long time. Often a tech that appears useless turns out great if no other AI civ gets it. As an example: I used Naval Warfare to get techs from all 4 known AI civs. Then 2 of those techs got a 5th tech.

5) If the game last to the modern age I suspect the technology of that age produces wild wars.

6) Expect to get overwhelmed with choices to build in a city, especially coastal cities. Don't build aqueducts in coastal cities, but the appropriate port as it has more value.

7) The luxury model is different. You don't have the luxury boosting effect of marketplaces, but instead many buildings are 50% boast to luxury tax.

8) Watch all goods, as every thing is different. A couple of examples: incense is required for religious buildings, and gold is required for many revenue buildings. You really want at least one of them.

 

[microbe]

Question about the mod:

Important: To be able to play RaR, you need the unit animation folders "World War II" and "Medieval Japan". These folders were part of the PtW addon, but are not included in C3C. However, the files are available to download here.

Aren't these part of C3C scenarios already? Or they are different and have to be downloaded separately?

 

[meldor]

Can someone post a link to where the updated files are. The site only has the version I already have. Is it here at CFC?

 

[Doc Tsiolkovski]

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=2296604#post2296604



Edit: (Crosspost) Microbe:
Those folders were included in PtW, but are not included in C3C.
Pfeffersack: There was no space left on the C3C CD.

 

[Pfeffersack]

(...) Aren't these part of C3C scenarios already? Or they are different and have to be downloaded separately?

Only partly.The (complete) extras were shipped with PTW and for some reason forgotten in Conquests and CivIII Complete.

 

[microbe]

Only partly.The (complete) extras were shipped with PTW and for some reason forgotten in Conquests and CivIII Complete.

Should they be installed to the "extras" folder under PTW? I see I have "Medieval Japan" already there but not WWII.

 

[Doc Tsiolkovski]

Exactly there. Japan is part of C3C (not sure if all of it, though), WW2 is not.

 

[meldor]

OK, I have the 1.01 biq file (not that I think I needed it. And, just to be sure, I reloaded PTW from the original CD and then re-updated it.

 

[Matt_G]

lurker's comment:
I'm going to watch this one with great interest. Sounds like the easiest way to set this up, is on it's own PC, assuming you have one.

 

[LKendter]

4000 BC
Our random Civ is Ethiopia. We have cereal, fish in a lake, and cattle. Need I say that food is NOT a problem?

The first research is pottery for the potential granary.


3600 BC
(IT) Our 2nd research project is Domestication to find the camels, pigs and horses.


3400 BC
We meet Babylon whom is awful close to us. We make a massive trade giving Masonry, Pottery and Ritualism in return for Cultivation, Alphabet and $22.


2950 BC
We ship Babylon Domestication for Warfare and $28. Our next research project is weaving for possible resources.


2750 BC
We meet Carthage and simply buy boat building for $48.


2670 BC
We ship Babylon Weaving and $18 to get Caste System.


2630 BC
This is the turn of contacts as we meet America and the Zulu.
We ship the Zulu Alphabet, Boat Building and Cultivation in return for Scrape Mining and $91.

2550 BC
I ship America Caste System for Mysticism and $2.
I sell Mysticism to Babylon for $100.


2510 BC
I ship Carthage Mysticism and Weaving to get a worker and $4.
I sell America Alphabet for $100.
(IT) I start research on Mythology hoping for a monopoly tech.


2470 BC
I sell Babylon Fermentation for $78.


2270 BC
I ship the Zulu Fermentation for Sailing.
I ship America Fermentation and Weaving for The Wheel and $2.
I ship Babylon Sailing and The Wheel for Slavery and $44.
I sell America Slavery for $90 and $1/turn.
I sell Carthage The Wheel for $62.


2190 BC
We meet Egypt but no deals happen.


2150 BC
Matara is formed to claim Coffee (luxury) and Elephants (military and food).


1990 BC
I ship Mythology to America for Urbanization and $65.
The next research project is Writing. With the obscene cash we have I want the right to build embassies and to use up some of it.


1950 BC
We add the Sioux to the list of known Civs.


1750 BC
I establish all possible embassies.
Egypt has spices.
The Zulu have no resources or luxuries.
The Sioux have spices.
America has horses and incense. They could become powerfully culturally with the right to build religious buildings.
Carthage has no resources or luxuries.
Babylon has no resources or luxuries. However, they have wines and camels near the capitol.
Would you believe we still have $356 left over?

==========================

Summary:


Signed up:
LKendter
Rrau (currently playing)
Pfeffersack (on deck)
Meldor
Microbe

Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads8/LK81-1750BC.zip

 

[rrau]

>>>THE SAVE<<<


Preflight (1750bc)

Looks good

ibt: Aksum Tribal Guardsman => clan

turn 1 (1725bc)

lux slider down to 30%
Start roading jumbos
moved scouts

turn 2 (1700bc)

moved scouts

ibt: Matara monument => Tribal Guardsman

turn 3 (1675bc)

Trade Zulu writing, Mythology and 25g for math.
Sell America math for 56g
Sell Babylon math for 23g
Sell Carthage math for 15g
Sell Souix writing for 15g

ibt: jumbos are roaded

turn 4 (1650bc)

moved scouts and worker

turn 5 (1625bc)

move worker
move scouts and meet Germany - they are backwards but have 182g to fill our coffers for old techs.
Sell Germany pottery and wheel for 182g
Naval warfare is known, but costs 81g as it's only known by 2 civs. IMHO on a pangea map, that's too expensive, so I pass on buying it right now.

ibt: Aksum clan => worker housing

turn 6 (1600bc)

move scouts, settler and a tribal guardsman
decrease lux slider to 20%

turn 7 (1475bc)

scouting and moving settler and TG

turn 8 (1550bc)

scouting and moving settler and tg

turn 9 (1525bc)

Found Zeila to claim horse. Start a monument to get Buffalo in city radius.
Moving scouts
Dynastism is known but a monopoly and costs more than the 632 we have in our treasury .
Establish embassy with Germany - they are probably going to be one of the weaker civs. They have all the shields towards a regular clan at 1 spt but only 2 pop so can't build it right now.

ibt: Souix DoW on Zulu

turn 10 (1500bc)

lux slider back to 30%
Dynastism is still a monopoly


Notes:

We have a Souix warrior that, so far, has been peacefully crossing our lands from the E to the W. (I haven't challenged them)

I like the blue dot for the next city site. It has a couple olive oils.

Babylon appears to be settling towards us. I think war is going to have to come sooner rather than later. (Ugh - bowman induced GA )

 

[LKendter]

ibt: Matara monument => Tribal Guardsman

The capitol is the ONLY source of vet troops for the moment. Please try to limit troop building in other cities.

ibt: Aksum clan => worker housing

Worker housing goes obsolete quickly. A forge is a much better choice for more shields. I would then do another guardsman and settler.

I like the blue dot for the next city site. It has a couple olive oils.

I would move it one square to the west. We still claim the olive oil luxury, but greatly reduce the overlap with our other cities.

We are in good shape for military with horses and elephants. Don't forget an odd elephant fact that I think they can build roads.


Signed up:
LKendter
Rrau
Pfeffersack (currently playing)
Meldor (on deck)
Microbe

Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.

 

[Pfeffersack]

Got it.

(...) We are in good shape for military with horses and elephants. Don't forget an odd elephant fact that I think they can build roads. (...)

Plus the ability to ignore movement penalties in jungle and forest.

 

[Doc Tsiolkovski]

lurker's comment:

ibt: jumbos are roaded

Wouldn't have done that. Jumbos can deplete, and you cannot use them now, you need Elephant Training first.

Dyna is better researched by yourself, the Gov makes this horribly expensive to buy.

It'll e some time before Worker Housings go obsolete, and they even provide Happiness for now, so they are still worth it IMHO.

 

[rrau]

lurker's comment:
Wouldn't have done that. Jumbos can deplete, and you cannot use them now, you need Elephant Training first.

Thanks, I didn't know that jumbos can deplete. I've never seen them do it yet.

 

[Pfeffersack]

1500 BC (PT):
- switched Aksum to Forge (3t)
- switched Matara to Clan (8t)

1475BC (1):
zzz

IBT:
- Matara expands borders

1450 BC (2):
- Dynasticism has now become nearly a common good (only Babylon and Germany lack it) and the price had dropped below 450 gold.Not cheap and it is a gov tech, but nevertheless I think trading is the better option here...we will have it a few turns earlier, we reduce our cash reserve in case someone demands something and we can use our research capacity for trying to get monopoly techs - this means getting the money back and having the chance for SGLs.
- Trade with Zulus: Got Dynasticism <--> for 444 gold
- revolt to get out of Chiefdom

1425 BC (3):
zzz

1400 BC (4):
- we are now in Monarchy
- reduced lux to 20%
- increased science to 60%, Polytheism now in 2t

1375 BC (5):
- Aksum: Forge ---> Tribal Guardsman (2t)
- lux raised to 30% again
- science lowered to 50%

1350 BC (6):
- researched Polytheism; new research goal: Philosophy (9t); not sure if we will get it first, but in most of my Emperor games I was able to get it before the AI, if I was not completly behind in science
- Trade with Zulus: Got 235 gold <--> for Polytheism
- Trade with Egypt: Got Naval Warfare, 63 gold and 4 gpt <--> for Polytheism
- Trade with Carthage: Got 50 gold, 3 gpt <--> for Polytheism

IBT:
- Zukus start the Sphinx

1325 BC (7):
- Aksum: Tribal Guardsman ---> Worker Housing (3t) [I agree here with DocTS, they are definitly worth building in cities with decent base shield output, since Feudalism is still a bit away]
- lowering lux to 20%

IBT:
- the Zulu demand 44 gold from us; they are rated stronger, nonetheless I refuse, because they are far away, RaR doesn't allow MA alliances in this stage of the game and we could even profit from the war happiness, if they should declare war - they do and we are now in war with the Zulus!

1300 BC (8):
- Matara: Pioneer ---> Shrine (20t)
- lowered lux to 10%

1275 BC (9):
zzz

1250 BC (10):
- Aksum: Worker Housing ---> Palace Gardens(5t) [they can bring a lot of cash if you build them early thanks tourism bonus and also a lot of culture; I have MM Aksum to churn them out in 5t, so the running on -1 food is on purpose]
- Trade with Carthage: Got Bronze Working <--> for 134 gold