Marriage

[Low Tier Hero]

Love is constant and unchanging, contageous and ever giving. It is people that are fickle and changeable in what they want for gratification.

I see no reason that in life I am forced to attribute some mystical status to love that as far as I've seen, and been in love (many times), does not exist. My mother loves me, for example, but thats not the same kind of love as a romantic love.

Being in a relationship, when the spark of the initial beggining goes away, the realationship is entirely dependent on what is left. When you speak of love thats unchanging, constant anc contageous, ever giving, thats friendly love. Thats the same kind of love I could expierience with my best friend as I could with a signifigant other. The only different kind of love is romatic love, and that IS fickle and comes and goes like the wind.

Hmm...you must be young and still of the mind that having sex is the best part of any relationship.

Heh, is 25, been engaged, been in several serious relationships since the age of 18 too young? I've come to realize that I'm perfectly comfortable outside of a relationship. Within one, I feel the tug that Im missing out on expieriencing other people as deeply (no pun intended) as I could if I were single with no hangups. I think a person can have many great loves in thier lifetime, and getting into a relationship or marriage is like shooting yourself in the foot. Your giving away potential for stability.. I for one think thats a cruddy tradeoff.

 

[Eran of Arcadia]

LTH, you seem to be saying that the major drawback to being in a relationship is that it limits your ability to enter into relationships with other people. That doesn't seem to make any sense.

 

[Low Tier Hero]

LTH, you seem to be saying that the major drawback to being in a relationship is that it limits your ability to enter into relationships with other people. That doesn't seem to make any sense.

To clarify, it prevents me from being able to be as close to other people as I could. I personally have no problem being sexually/emotionally/intellectually intimate with one person while at the same time pursuing a similar relationship with someone else. Most people require exclusivity in thier relationship practices, I do not of myself or anyone else.

As long as I am honest with any parties to which I am involved with in any signifigant fashion and they and I both understand there is no "binding" monogamy, then there isnt a problem. If the persons I wish to pursue a close "relationship" with have a problem with that, then I don't pursue them because it would be unfair and go against thier sensibilities.

As a side note, Im lucky enough to be able to force myself over the jealousy/possessiveness/exclusivity hurdle. It's not easy, when from the age of understanding you are beset that monogamy is the only form of acceptable relationship.

 

[Eran of Arcadia]

But I think that it is human nature to want this exclusiveness just with one person. That is why so many mores and religious beliefs put so much emphasis on it. It is for most people the only way to really be secure. You might be different, but then I think you are the exception.

 

[Tulkas12]

To clarify, it prevents me from being able to be as close to other people as I could. I personally have no problem being sexually/emotionally/intellectually intimate with one person while at the same time pursuing a similar relationship with someone else. Most people require exclusivity in thier relationship practices, I do not of myself or anyone else.

As long as I am honest with any parties to which I am involved with in any signifigant fashion and they and I both understand there is no "binding" monogamy, then there isnt a problem. If the persons I wish to pursue a close "relationship" with have a problem with that, then I don't pursue them because it would be unfair and go against thier sensibilities.

As a side note, Im lucky enough to be able to force myself over the jealousy/possessiveness/exclusivity hurdle. It's not easy, when from the age of understanding you are beset that monogamy is the only form of acceptable relationship.

as much as you're going to think I am lieing to you, you can never be as close as you could if youwere exclusive. You actions lead to mistrust my man, therefore destroying a true joy of a great relationship. . .trust.

 

[Low Tier Hero]

as much as you're going to think I am lieing to you, you can never be as close as you could if youwere exclusive. You actions lead to mistrust my man, therefore destroying a true joy of a great relationship. . .trust.

Mistrust of what?
Im not setting double standards for my partners either. They are free to come and go as they please. There is no trust issue to be dealt with, I dont understand your criticism.

 

[Low Tier Hero]

But I think that it is human nature to want this exclusiveness just with one person. That is why so many mores and religious beliefs put so much emphasis on it. It is for most people the only way to really be secure. You might be different, but then I think you are the exception.

I understand that people desire that, and I have desired that in the past... but I no longer do. If I'm the exception, then cool for me

For me, if I love someone, placing the constraint of a relationship on them for my own sense of security would be like acting against that feeling of love. Im barring them from other people and expieriences and to me it is unconcionable to do that.

 

[Pyrite]

What's good about exclusivity? It brings possessivity and lots of other unwanted emotional baggage into an otherwise healthy relationship.
Requirements for marriage: Fear of the future, social predilections, and a belief that love can only exist in an equation of two. I love lots of peoples!

 

[Narz]

Sorry, animals cant reason like humans can .

Love has nothing to do with the how well someone can reason.

True, many people have been hurt by giving love when its not returned back.

Ture, but it's all the more reason they need to feel the joy of loving again and recieving love in the future. If a person shuts off love out of fear they've been defeated. Of course the yearning for love is never truly defeated but their attitudes and actions can be.

Once again you attribute human emotions to animals and in error I do believe.

Thanks for sharing your belief. Until you're an animal though you can't really say though can you?

No, people are not afraid to give love....but I will go as far as people are afraid to commit to love to the extent of what it takes to make a good marriage.

Probably both.

Marriage takes a lot of work. A lot of trust and compromise and self-sacrifice.

If giving love feels like a sacrifice you're not doing it right.

Love isnt lust or desire....its more than that. Those that base their marriage on physical love/lust/desire are doomed to fail. Those that base their relationship on friendship and trust and giving will make it.

Agreed. Course physical attraction is important too but probably shouldn't be priority #1.

 

[Narz]

What's good about exclusivity? It brings possessivity and lots of other unwanted emotional baggage into an otherwise healthy relationship.

Usually.

Requirements for marriage: Fear of the future, social predilections, and a belief that love can only exist in an equation of two.

Yeah, probably usually.

I love lots of peoples!

I'm sure they love you too.

Now if you can sell this bill of goods to my girl I'll keep you in clover for the rest of your days.

 

[Narz]

by the way, are you up early or up late?

 

[Methos]

Marriage takes a lot of work. A lot of trust and compromise and self-sacrifice.

If giving love feels like a sacrifice you're not doing it right.

I do not believe sacrifice is a good word for it, more a compromise or being responsible. Prior to getting married I made several decisions and/or compromises because of my intention to propose. I do not consider them as sacrificing, nor do I regret those decisions any.

In my belief marriage means each member needs to make their decisions based off of both husband and wife, and not just their selves, as consequences from those decisions affect both the husband and wife. In my opinion I believe it’s the willingness to work together that strengthens the bonds of the relationship. Not sacrificing yourself for the other, but working together.

 

[Narz]

Sounds about right Methos. The creative individual can always find a solution that benefits both parties. If a man (or woman) cannot find a mutually satisfactory than either they aren't creative, they aren't trying enough or simply they are with the wrong person.

As for "sacrifice" I make "noble sacrifices" every day (washing the dishes if my girl is tired, taking out the trash, getting stuff at the library for her) but they never feel like "sacrifices". If I can't find a way to enjoy doing stuff for her I won't do it. Fortunatly I can find a way to enjoy doing just about anything for her (even if it's only by focusing on feeling happy that I'm making her happy).

 

[ComradeDavo]

Further clarification may be required. Number one factor regarding what? What individuals look for? Social utility? Ramifications for extension of privilege?

I would have to say love, closely followed by religion and tradition. Love is ideal, but not necessary for a fine marriage. Affection and friendship can grow over time.

Number 1 in general. Taking everything into account.

None of the above. The reason I say that is love isnt something that most people really understand. Thats why so many get divorced.

What then?

Love, between one man and one woman. That is a concise definition for marriage.

You should have voted tradition or religion if you really think that. The poll option is simply 'love', without that requirement added on.

Love, between a man and a woman is a requierment for marriage.

Ditto. You should have voted tradition or religion.

Tradition is my second most important choice for marriage.

Given what you say above, i'd say it was number 1.

 

[Pyrite]

"by the way, are you up early or up late?"

Late!

"If giving love feels like a sacrifice you're not doing it right."

Welllll said!

"Now if you can sell this bill of goods to my girl I'll keep you in clover for the rest of your days"

Good sex with multiple partners requires a "selling"????? Who WOULDN'T jump on that bandwagon..?


"In my belief marriage means each member needs to make their decisions based off of both husband and wife, and not just their selves, as consequences from those decisions affect both the husband and wife. In my opinion I believe it’s the willingness to work together that strengthens the bonds of the relationship. Not sacrificing yourself for the other, but working together."

Working together is fun, but why make it a limit of two people? I just don't get the logic.

 

[Narz]

Late!

Me too.

Welllll said!

Thanks.

Good sex with multiple partners requires a "selling"????? Who WOULDN'T jump on that bandwagon..?

Hmm, my girl doesn't seem overjoyed at the thought of me having sex with other women. I try to explain that loving figs doesn't necessarily mean I love apples or cherimoya any less. However the analogy generally doesn't go over too well.

Working together is fun, but why make it a limit of two people? I just don't get the logic.

There is a lot of percieved logic there. People want a guarentee their partner will not leave them alone (which of course marriage doesn't provide - look at the divorce rate). People want to feel safe from disease. People want to feel special (the theory that you can only love ONE which seems to me steeped in insecurity). Financial security. Jealousy. The list goes on.

Honestly, my ideal is to be with three or four women (no more than four) who all love me and all love each other. Seriously. I have yet to find a woman who's down for that.

Ok, while I'm here, let me tackle the flip side... would I want my girl with some other dude? No, not ideally. HOWEVER, I realize that this (like my repulsion towards armpit hair) is due to cultural conditioning and the primal desire to spread my own seed to the females of my choice at the exclusion of other males. Since it's my life though (fantasy for now), why not aviod the male dillema altogether. They're are plenty of chicks who like chicks. There are also plenty of chicks who'd like me (if they met me). Therefore I just need to find three of them with compatable personalities to me and each other and then we all win. We each have three receptive partners to choose from at all times. No one feels excluded, everyone feels special. Yep, it's 's all around.

 

[classical_hero]

Love is not an emotion, but an action. By this definition if you love someone, you will continually be showing it, that means that marriage is hard work.

 

[classical_hero]

You should have voted tradition or religion if you really think that. The poll option is simply 'love', without that requirement added on.

I would say that what people in those other situation, are not really love situations.

 

[ComradeDavo]

I would say that what people in those other situation, are not really love situations.

In other words you claim to know how others feel.

 

[Narz]

Love is not an emotion, but an action. By this definition if you love someone, you will continually be showing it, that means that marriage is hard work.

Showing love is "hard work"?