Discussion in 'Civ6 - General Discussions' started by bite, May 14, 2020.
Hey, they haven't hinted yet that Italy won't be in the game!
Victor Emmanuel II with Risorgimento abilities and Garibaldi as a unique governor? Yes, please!
Yeah I imagine going Magnus for all the chopping you are likely to do and Liang to prevent disasters will be way to go. Maybe with the Mayans more than any other civ you may want to pay close attention to leave at least 1 forest every X tiles to prevent droughts. location location location.
I'm not sure I get it.
You will need to pack cities around your capital, but you'll need farms for housing, and plantations for the campus (probably a strong start bias there). Add some mountains around... where do you put your districts ?
Besides, if your capital is in the middle of a continent, your coastal cities will be very weak.
I'd be more confortable with a +15% bonus/ -10% malus than this one.
I'm wishing more of one-civ two-leaders thing with a Venetian doge as one of them.
No, this is clearly a top tier civ.
Now that we are talking about disaster prevention, maybe we'll get new wonders that operate like The great Baths in preventing floods? because I would be down to build a shrine to Chaac on a cenote to prevent droughts with the Maya.
And really the first animations of the video are clearly the same than Amanitore's : same figure, same hip move towards the right, same hand swipe parallel to the floor...
That could work too. Maybe we could have a popular patron of the arts who could focus on great works, while the Venetian Doge could focus on trade/luxuries.
Talking about abilities, the Mayans are a very average civilization. I mean, it's not weak, but it's not strong enough to be a terrible threat (I'm looking at you, Korea and Australia). But since they are the type that change the way you play, they will be fun. I'll have to prioritize a little more builders and less warriors, this can leave me a little vulnerable if other civilizations attack me, so I'll have to focus on getting Hul'che as much as possible.
In general, they will be fun. I like these civilizations that make me think more about planning the placement of districts and settlement of cities.
The fun part is the important one for me. I don't want just S-Tier powerhouses (plus anyway, if everybody is S-Tier, is anyone still really S-Tier ???), so I'm happy to see a civ that forces you to play differently, that was the best part of Gathering Storm for me.
Certainly interesting to have multiple penalties (no fresh water bonus, yield penalty to distant cities).
At a first glance, those campuses will certainly rival Korea and Australia for yields - +2 per plantation means if you get the right zone, you can really be killing it. And without worrying about freshwater, you have some good flexibility for city placement.
The tough part I think will be that you will immediately hit your housing cap in your capital, so I almost feel like they're gonna need to rush a builder first just to get some housing down. They're almost going to be like a Mali in that sense, with some struggles until they get infrastructure online, but once they do, obviously they'll be able to rocket forward in science.
The other interesting question for them will be what tier 1 government plaza do they go with. In theory being a dense, tall civ feels like Audience Chamber would be a logical play. But they're also really gonna need builders ASAP in cities, so that immediate free builder per city is pretty critical too.
Liang could be Sexy for the Maya because of Guildmaster ability which gives +1 charge to builders. But I think I would still prefer Pingala over her.
Ancestral Hall is sweet.
Interesting design, but the number needs to be tweaked, otherwise this civ is gonna so underwhelming. When they have a unique Campus, they will for sure be compared to the other one. If this is a truly good design, there will be situations where the Seowon shines and situations where the Observatory dominates. So far, I can't pinpoint a single case where the Observatory is the better version.
Also, I'd rather see a +15% bonus and -10% malus than the other way around. Why does the negative have the outweigh the positive when the positive in itself is already limiting?
Depending on their start bias they may have to rush a lot of builders - first to chop the jungles, then to to build the farms.
The Observatory does seem to get minor adjacency bonuses from districts as well as farms. So you can slap down farms to boost it, and then replace those farms with districts as you build up your city. Assuming you have other food/housing sources by then (like an aqueduct).
The Maya will have a really challenging start. You really want to start with a builder, so if a barbarian camp spawn near you early and you fail to stop their Scout, or if you spawn near another Civ that doesn't look like a good neighbor, you're forced to go for military and suffer for a while with a capital that doesn't grow. If you get luck with a peaceful start, farms are a pretty bad tile improvement into you unlock Feudalism. You'll only be able to build mines, pasture on horses, improve luxuries or chop/harvest after you build at least a couple of farms. If you survive that, you'll be in a pretty good spot, but you need to get there and it won't be easy, mostly in higher difficulties.
Seowon is limited to hills and isolation. Observatory will actually do best when packed in, since the farm and plantation bonuses are on top of the regular bonuses they gain. You only need 2 plantations next to each other to gain a +4 observatory on either side of them, and that's not counting any other bonuses. Jungle bonus would pack on top of that, so 2 jungle bananas/cocoa and now you have a base +5 observatory
*actually, now that I check, I don't see jungle, mountain, or reef bonuses listed for the Observatory, so I wonder if those are simply omissions from the list, or if they like the Seowon they don't gain those bonuses either and will only have plantation/farm/district. If they don't have those other bonuses, that's a little worse for sure.
**on closer look at the first look video, it was a +0 Observatory despite being next to a mountain, district, and farm, so sadly they haven't fixed adding in the half points together to gain a full bonus. Hmm, so yeah, that's going to be an interesting play to make sure you have an even number of farms and an even number of districts to maximize.
Or it could be that the Seowon itself isn’t particularly well designed.
The Korea comparisons are to be expected but not helpful. In isolation, the Observatory is a half price campus that can very easily be splendid. That is very powerful
This civ is giving me serious Ethiopia in Civ V vibes, with the incentives to turtle up and defend your tall core. I wonder if they might go in a different direction with Ethiopia this time, then.
Overall, I like this a lot. It has similar feeling to Korea, but requires more thought and organizing to make it work.
According to how it is phrased, the plantation bonus doesnt not stack, only the farm one does. Doesn't matter if it's next to 1 or 6 plantations, you have 2 bonus science from that source. If it's stackable, great, it is decent, if it doesn't then this district is 100% weaker. You do not have jungle/mountain/reef/fissure bonus for this district, please read it again.
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