Middle-Earth: Lord of the Mods (octa)
- Thread starter Celeborn
- Start date
Ok, I proably won't get conquests until about January, so I don't really know. but should we get the updated civ citizens at later techs? just a thought. I don't think that the tech tree is advanced enough for that.
Oh, and just ask my teacher -- I could never spell. espicially when writing very quickly
RRNut
Oh, and just ask my teacher -- I could never spell. espicially when writing very quickly
RRNut
As promised, RRnut's map with marshes and volcano (mt. doom).
It's nice looking map, I just can't wait to play it ( with mod ).
And also ( RRnut ), are you maybe planning to make some other version of map for midlle earth? If so, I'll be glad to help you.
Bye
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads5/midlle_earth_RRnut.zip
It's nice looking map, I just can't wait to play it ( with mod ).
And also ( RRnut ), are you maybe planning to make some other version of map for midlle earth? If so, I'll be glad to help you.
Bye
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads5/midlle_earth_RRnut.zip
Maybe I am misunderstanding your theory here. This is mainly what I think your theory is:
In a two player tiny map, 4billion years old, with a appearance ratio of 160, we only end up with 2 resources. Shouldnt we have 3? If there are two players than we should get 150% resources. 2 players divided by half is 1, 1+2 is obviously 3, thus three resources?
Using a ratio and adding the number of players we have 2/6, then 1/3. Again we end up with three resources, not two. Yet the map only generates 2.
At the same token, the helpfile is also wrong, as I should be getting 4 resources on the map. However the helpfile states: Appearance Ratio- Determines how many instances of the selected resource will appear in game. Perhaps this only applies if there is some type of disappearance property, and if no disappearance probability is marked, it is simply ignored.
But maybe if you could explain the execution of your ratio more.
For instance, by your theory (not by testing) exactly how many iron resources should I get per player if I set the ratio at 200? How many should I get if I set it at 1? And finally, how many would I get if I set it at 900?
Supervisor sounds a bit cheesy, too modern. In that case a spy as suggested before would be more accurate. But I agree, we should probably keep Torturer as a scientist.
Webpage? Were you thinking of finding one for your War Hammer mod also? You might want to talk to Celeborn about it, he may have heard of something. If not, yahoo\aol and other browsers offer stuff like that, simply pages to write fashionable html code on.
I also get disorganized when trying to reply to multi-posts so Ill leave my praise for RRnut , and the next tab for tomorrow
.
In a two player tiny map, 4billion years old, with a appearance ratio of 160, we only end up with 2 resources. Shouldnt we have 3? If there are two players than we should get 150% resources. 2 players divided by half is 1, 1+2 is obviously 3, thus three resources?
Using a ratio and adding the number of players we have 2/6, then 1/3. Again we end up with three resources, not two. Yet the map only generates 2.
At the same token, the helpfile is also wrong, as I should be getting 4 resources on the map. However the helpfile states: Appearance Ratio- Determines how many instances of the selected resource will appear in game. Perhaps this only applies if there is some type of disappearance property, and if no disappearance probability is marked, it is simply ignored.
But maybe if you could explain the execution of your ratio more.
For instance, by your theory (not by testing) exactly how many iron resources should I get per player if I set the ratio at 200? How many should I get if I set it at 1? And finally, how many would I get if I set it at 900?
Supervisor sounds a bit cheesy, too modern. In that case a spy as suggested before would be more accurate. But I agree, we should probably keep Torturer as a scientist.
Webpage? Were you thinking of finding one for your War Hammer mod also? You might want to talk to Celeborn about it, he may have heard of something. If not, yahoo\aol and other browsers offer stuff like that, simply pages to write fashionable html code on
.I also get disorganized when trying to reply to multi-posts so Ill leave my praise for RRnut , and the next tab for tomorrow
.Hello,
I can wait PCH 
jok.
but thanks anyway.
On a more serious note I was working on starting a scenario by inputting cities and stuff like that. I noted a few errors with the map, but was wondering wether you could post a copy of the most recent .bix file before you got C3C? That way I could start using the already programmed civs and units and stuff and just upda\te the thing once the mod is relased. Is this possible?
What is the next page up for discussion?
RRnut
I can wait PCH
jok.but thanks anyway.
On a more serious note I was working on starting a scenario by inputting cities and stuff like that. I noted a few errors with the map, but was wondering wether you could post a copy of the most recent .bix file before you got C3C? That way I could start using the already programmed civs and units and stuff and just upda\te the thing once the mod is relased. Is this possible?
What is the next page up for discussion?
RRnut
embryodead
Caliph
I have bad news
Actually, it generates 3 correctly... in PTW, while 2 in C3C. I already wrote about this in C3C forum - it seems that they changed the formula slighly, in favor of bonus resources. You can see frustrated players complaining about it in C3C forum - the same settings for PTW will create more strategic resources than in C3C. How much more? well, a bit, though I didn't come up with proper formula for C3C yet, nor have tested it enough to say if it's random or not (I prefer to wait for new C3MT, too lazy to count).perhaps? I gave you a proof that the help file is wrong, gave you a working, logical theory, and you put it down by a guess? oh, c'mon. you may be guessing, but "my" pattern just works, that's the problem
you desperately add "if's" and "or's" to the poor help file, whereas it's just plain mathematical mistake - the author divided instead of multiplying...
ratio of 1 = 2 resources on the whole map regardless of # of players
200 = 2 resources per player
900 = theoretically 9 per player, but I guess it will fail because there will be no room (though it may succeed as well if you "make" room by removing other resources, just guessing)
This is valid for PTW of course, I didn't have C3C by then... so far it seems that apart from the slight change (actually *further* away from the help file) the minimum number of resources have been changed from 2 to 1.
Webpage? Were you thinking of finding one for your War Hammer mod also? You might want to talk to Celeborn about it, he may have heard of something. If not, yahoo\aol and other browsers offer stuff like that, simply pages to write fashionable html code on
ummm.. .well, you see I have the one for warhammer already
it's up since the mod is availalble, the link is on the 1st page. I got the space from GIDustin. as for the HTML... AOL? don't insult me I code for living... I even make notes in HTML instead of word/excel, that's why I proposed to make such webpage.For this mod I was thinking about something more "technical" than the one I made, since it could be information center for every participant. Would be divided into tabs and summing up what we have done already.
If PCH can't insult you, may I do it? Pleeeeease? Ugly please with swearwords on top?
I think a webpage/html document could be good, then PCH wouldn't have to write those overviews in vB code.
RRNut, I think it's too early to start adding cities... Why don't you write some more pedia texts instead?
I think a webpage/html document could be good, then PCH wouldn't have to write those overviews in vB code.
RRNut, I think it's too early to start adding cities... Why don't you write some more pedia texts instead?
Celeborn
Silver-Death
I already designed a website for the mod to tell the truth... (Digital Design Project) it aint on the net but i have the lay-out done and some jibbirish...
it might need some ajustment but I like it...
the Mordor Cop could perhaps be Overseer, or do we have that?
it might need some ajustment but I like it...
the Mordor Cop could perhaps be Overseer, or do we have that?
embryodead
Caliph
Overseer sounds perfect.
embryodead
Caliph
hey PCH
I made some tests... actually we got the whole misunderstanding since you were using C3C and I PTW... My formula works 100% in PTW, even regardless of all terrain settings etc. because it's PTW. In C3C ... it's a long story.. but in an outcome we might end up with actually higher ratios, like you wanted ... why? see here.
I made some tests... actually we got the whole misunderstanding since you were using C3C and I PTW... My formula works 100% in PTW, even regardless of all terrain settings etc. because it's PTW. In C3C ... it's a long story.. but in an outcome we might end up with actually higher ratios, like you wanted
... why? see here.Woah!
Sounds great! You know what server you are going to find? They arent all free you know. But regardless, Ill be happy if it gets rid of those damn overviews
. I agree with embryodead, Overseer is good.
You 'sound' winded on that post
.But seriously, I'm glad I waited to post, it could have turned out ugly if I said "oh so it 'suddenly' changed for c3c did it"
. If what you say is true (which I am far more willing to accept) then should we add +20 to some of the resources(stone\timber)? Or would that be +33? I think iron is ok at 170, unless you want to go back to 180. I think Lux's should be random.
I actually finished all the civilopedia entries for resources, but they would probably be better if someone went over it and made it fit into Middle-earth.mrtn-
Everything.
BTW I posted a cute hare/rabbit/thingy for the coney resource yesterday. (Check my sig, "My Resources")
If your willing RRnut, I can post them resource civilopedia up.
I remember mentioning that we should make a small Middle-earth reference section in the civilopedia. I think it would be great if we mentioned historic battles and important events, such as Dagor Bragollach for the former, and Durins Bane for the latter. Where is Mithadan
?Lotm Terrain
First up, we should decide what type of terrain we want, and which ones we want to get rid of. Obviously, we will need the standards, such as Grassland, Plains, Hills, Mountains, Tundra, Coast, Sea, Ocean. That leaves us with 3 (5) we dont need in their present form. Desert-Floodplains, Jungle, Marshes, and Volcanos.
It has been suggested that for Desert, we should replace this with a ashland of sorts. However, now that the mods has come more into fruition, it seems desert is necessary.
With this out of the picture, we approached with two options. One, is to make Jungle a type of ashlands. This makes sense to me, as Jungle is rarely in little bursts such as desert most often is. Moreover, marshes tend to blend into Jungles, just as the Dead marshes are part of Mordor. And having a Marsh (or Fen?) In the middle of the grassland wont look that out of place.
Volcanos are more tricky. Ideally we want to be true to Middle-earth, these should not be generated on Random Maps, and reserved for maps of Mordor and Middle-earth. Yet the problem here is we cant delete terrain without a hacked editor. The other option we have, is to minimize (or maximize, rather) the Max Eruption Period and replace the Volcano graphics with that of regular mountains, and give it the same stats as mountains.
My suggestion, would be quite different. I believe we should make marshes the ashland. I dont think the map should contain too much of it. Moreover, this leaves jungle free. I suggest we make jungle into a wilderland, un-settable, and as mentioned earlier instead of getting reduced by disease they would get reduced by wolves or wild animals. The graphics would look more or less like spacious grassland-like terrain, with a thicket here and there. I have made some primitive graphics for this, whether its used or not.
embryodead
Caliph
winded? damn you, I did my best to be clear. +20 is ok. 170 will give less Iron that in umodded PTW, though it's ok for me.
Terrain:
desert is a must. flood plains also, at least for gameplay purposes.
volcanos - I think they should be in random maps. if we wan't 100% true middle-earth why are we doing random map mod at all?
as for the graphics, we haven't even decided which set to use... and since we are having very custom terrain, I think we should go for one default set first. for sn00py's, there is a perfect wilderland (the alternative tree set, see attachment) that could replace jungles like you said. however I'd keep the swamps or marshes, they seem more important than the ashlands, which can be added as landmark easily.
Terrain:
desert is a must. flood plains also, at least for gameplay purposes.
volcanos - I think they should be in random maps. if we wan't 100% true middle-earth why are we doing random map mod at all?
as for the graphics, we haven't even decided which set to use... and since we are having very custom terrain, I think we should go for one default set first. for sn00py's, there is a perfect wilderland (the alternative tree set, see attachment) that could replace jungles like you said. however I'd keep the swamps or marshes, they seem more important than the ashlands, which can be added as landmark easily.
Attachments
And very good at it too! You like the civilopedia idea?Mithadan-
Lurking!
Winded in the sense that you used lots of periods... You know... What I mean?
j\k180 sounds good to me.
Thats not exactly fair
. I could have submitted to Orcish Crossbows, or gunpowder units a long time ago too. It would make the mod much easier to make, for one. But some things just don't fit very well. Besides, the volcanos are very cool at first, but as time goes on and after you've seen 16 different unit types fall over, and 6 cities obliterated, then volcanos are about as cool as getting a starting location surrounded by jungle. Maybe you'll change your mind once the novelty wears off.
If we absolutely must have volcanos, then we should lower the amount of eruptions anyway. Do you know a good pollution we could use? I'm not fond of the dead bodies, and I forgot if Mrtn made any or not
.
Err.. Thats the thing. We couldn't decide on a terrain pack in the beginning, we all wanted different types. Some wanted Warpstorms, some wanted Snoopy's, some wanted Womoks, and some wanted vanilla. In the end we decided that it would be up to the down-loader to decide. Although, if we can agree on it I think we should blend our own together.
It's not easy for a new-comer to modding civ3 to make their own type of terrain. We should attempt to standardize it outside of the flavor editions.
That is perfect
. All we need is someone to cut and paste it into the jungle format. About ashlands, I think we should have them in the random map. I don't see anything particularly appealing about marshes, ashland would be a nice fantasy addition. (Volcanos but no Ashland?
)
Code:
[b][u]Desert Plains[/b][/u]
Defensive Bonus: 0 (originally 10) Defensive Bonus: 10
Movement Cost: 2 (originally 1) Movement Cost: 1
Tile Values- Tile Values-
Food: 0 Food: 1
Shield: 1 Shield: 1
Commerce: 0 Commerce: 0
Terraform Bonuses- Terraform Bonuses-
Irrigation: 1 Irrigation: 1
Mining: 1 Mining: 1
Road: 1 Road: 1
Other- Other-
Does not allow Forts. None
[b][u]Grassland Tundra[/b][/u]
Defensive Bonus: 10 Defensive Bonus:15(was 10)
Movement Cost: 1 Movement Cost: 2
Tile Values- Tile Values-
Food: 2 Food: 0 (originally 1)
Shield: 0 Shield: 1
Commerce: 0 Commerce: 1
Terraform Bonuses- Terraform Bonuses-
Irrigation: 1 Irrigation: 0
Mining: 1 Mining: 1
Road: 1 Road: 1
Other- Other-
None None
[b][u] Flood Plain Hills[/b][/u]
Defensive Bonus: 10 Defensive Bonus: 50
Movement Cost: 1 Movement Cost: 2
Tile Values- Tile Values-
Food: 3 Food: 1
Shield: 0 Shield: 1
Commerce: 0 Commerce: 0
Terraform Bonuses- Terraform Bonuses-
Irrigation: 1 Irrigation:1*(was 0)
Mining: 0 Mining: 2
Road: 1 Road: 1
Other- Other-
Causes Disease. None
Disease strength:35 (was 50).
Can be cured by a future tech.
[b][u] Mountains Forest[/b][/u]
Defensive Bonus: 100 Defensive Bonus:40(was 20)
Movement Cost: 2 Movement Cost: 2
Tile Values- Tile Values-
Food: 0 Food: 1
Shield: 1 Shield: 2
Commerce: 0 Commerce: 0
Terraform Bonuses- Terraform Bonuses-
Irrigation: 0 Irrigation: 0
Mining: 2 Mining: 0
Road: 2 (originally 1) Road: 1
Other- Other-
Does not allow cities (standard). None
Impassable by wheeled units
(workers are wheeled).embryodead
Caliph
periods you say... well... I like them they make the post look more... clever
Volcanos - comparing volcano's to gunpowder idea is a bit extreme don't you think?. Lower eruptions would be fine.
mrtn "wasteland" pollution is the best, it fits both volcanos and land "corruption" that could result in evil experiments, extensive mining and... stuff
Terrain sets - I think the original + Sn00py's and Warpstorm's are the only 3 options, since other creators haven't updated their sets. Sn00py's has that wildforest and we can add custom stuff to it ourselves. I have the ancient forest copy'n'pasted over jungles already for the ultra-green version though I can do it for others too. I can do ashlands also since I need them for wh-mod.
Can we start we sn00py's then? say, the normal one, unless the majority wants the greener or ultra-greener version?
Terrains:
Most of it is ok. Some comments though:
- Why mountains have movement cost of 2 not 3? and why they're so good? esp. the trade?
- Irrigation of hills - AI is the problem here - for some reason, it will only irrigate, never mine, which isn't too good setting for hills. It could have changed in C3C, but somehow I doubt it.
- Where are the ashlands?
Volcanos - comparing volcano's to gunpowder idea is a bit extreme don't you think?. Lower eruptions would be fine.
mrtn "wasteland" pollution is the best, it fits both volcanos and land "corruption" that could result in evil experiments, extensive mining and... stuff
Terrain sets - I think the original + Sn00py's and Warpstorm's are the only 3 options, since other creators haven't updated their sets. Sn00py's has that wildforest and we can add custom stuff to it ourselves. I have the ancient forest copy'n'pasted over jungles already for the ultra-green version though I can do it for others too. I can do ashlands also since I need them for wh-mod.
Can we start we sn00py's then?
say, the normal one, unless the majority wants the greener or ultra-greener version?Terrains:
Most of it is ok. Some comments though:
- Why mountains have movement cost of 2 not 3? and why they're so good? esp. the trade?
- Irrigation of hills - AI is the problem here - for some reason, it will only irrigate, never mine, which isn't too good setting for hills. It could have changed in C3C, but somehow I doubt it.
- Where are the ashlands?
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