I would love to have the SoZ sooner rather than later. I just don't think that it is worth delaying building units to do the research when we need the GL anyway. I think the AI will do math. We can build attack 3 units now @ 2-turn each (after next expansion). It is not units we will ultimately need but $$. Any way it is a group decision so Akots can decide bases on our input and current circumstances.
MM2: Aggressive Athenians-AWM-OCC
- Thread starter Mark1031
- Start date
Aggie
Deity
Mark1031 said:
Why would we need to delay unitsfor research? We'd only delay for SoZ, which will give us units until late Medieval times. I'm afraid that we get our SoZ far later if we count on the TGL. Maybe even not at all, if another tribe has ivory as well...
I really think we need some swords to go out and damage the enemy. I don't believe we will have the time to build all 3 wonders before units will start coming in and interupting our builds. The AI will grow in Monarchy and become a real Civ if we wait that long to attack. I think we have a chance to damage them now and should do so.
Once we have some swords out and destroying the enemy (unit rates are high) we can go and build some wonders. Sitting back for that long and allowing the AI to grow is a mistake, IMO.
Once we have some swords out and destroying the enemy (unit rates are high) we can go and build some wonders. Sitting back for that long and allowing the AI to grow is a mistake, IMO.
Aggie
Deity
OK. I will NOT research Math, build 4 swords and a hoplite and hand it over to the next player 
EDIT: it's just that I hate slow moving units...
EDIT2: Playing now...
EDIT: it's just that I hate slow moving units...
EDIT2: Playing now...
Aggie
Deity
IT: An archer from Orleans attacks our hoplite and doesn't do damage. We are in a Golden Age.
Turn 1 (1225 BC) We make 13 gpt at no science and 10% lux.
To be continued/waiting for comments (does this change anything?)...
Turn 1 (1225 BC) We make 13 gpt at no science and 10% lux.
To be continued/waiting for comments (does this change anything?)...
Aggie
Deity
I guess it didn't matter and I didn't want to push my little discussion too far, so...
IT: We see a Mongolian archer and a French warrior. Athens: sword->sword.
Turn 2 (1200 BC) SoD fortifies outside French borders. Archer kills Mongolian archer and loses a HP.
Turn 3 (1175 BC)
IT: sword->hoplite.
Turn 4 (1150 BC) Athens is size 9. We make 20 spt.
IT: hoplite->sword.
Turn 5 (1125 BC) Archer kills French warrior and loses 2 HP.
Turn 6 (1100 BC) Vet archer kills reg archer, losing 2 HP.
IT: Athens->sword->The Great Library.
Turn 7 (1075 BC)
Turn 8 (1050 BC) Archer kills French warrior, losing 3 HP. Hoplite kills an American scout.
Turn 9 (1025 BC) Vet archer kills reg warrior, losing 1 HP. But it promotes.
IT: A mini SoD of the Mongols goes south.
Turn 10 (1000 BC) The SoD has two archers and a warrior. Sword takes out a warrior and loses 2 HP. A 2nd sword also loses 2 HP killing an archer.Up north an elite archer kills a reg archer, losing 1 HP.
TGL in 17. We can now soon assemble the troops and send them up north. Ivory is connected within 6 turns.
Math is known by more than two other tribes. I still vote to go SoZ after TGL.
IT: We see a Mongolian archer and a French warrior. Athens: sword->sword.
Turn 2 (1200 BC) SoD fortifies outside French borders. Archer kills Mongolian archer and loses a HP.
Turn 3 (1175 BC)
IT: sword->hoplite.
Turn 4 (1150 BC) Athens is size 9. We make 20 spt.
IT: hoplite->sword.
Turn 5 (1125 BC) Archer kills French warrior and loses 2 HP.
Turn 6 (1100 BC) Vet archer kills reg archer, losing 2 HP.
IT: Athens->sword->The Great Library.
Turn 7 (1075 BC)
Turn 8 (1050 BC) Archer kills French warrior, losing 3 HP. Hoplite kills an American scout.
Turn 9 (1025 BC) Vet archer kills reg warrior, losing 1 HP. But it promotes.
IT: A mini SoD of the Mongols goes south.
Turn 10 (1000 BC) The SoD has two archers and a warrior. Sword takes out a warrior and loses 2 HP. A 2nd sword also loses 2 HP killing an archer.Up north an elite archer kills a reg archer, losing 1 HP.
TGL in 17. We can now soon assemble the troops and send them up north. Ivory is connected within 6 turns.
Math is known by more than two other tribes. I still vote to go SoZ after TGL.
I wouldn' be against spending some money on researching Math. There is no guarantee on the GLib though it is likely we will get it. Math is also important for Catapults which reduces losses.
I don't think we should build so many units that when our GA ends we are running a big deficit at 100% cash. That would be bad. So I would say build the number of units you were going to build before the GA and then start the GLib (or some other wonder) and spend the GA money on getting math.
Edit: this was a cross post. Looks like you had the same idea anyway.
I don't think we should build so many units that when our GA ends we are running a big deficit at 100% cash. That would be bad. So I would say build the number of units you were going to build before the GA and then start the GLib (or some other wonder) and spend the GA money on getting math.
Edit: this was a cross post. Looks like you had the same idea anyway.
Why will it take 6 turns to connect Ivory? We don't need to road the Ivory first - just build the Colony.
Aggie
Deity
Greebley said:
How can I make this mistake twice in two days? Luckily I just started roading this one...akots
Poet
Got that.
Please let me take a look later on on what is going on in the game, I'll post the summary and will play after the comments. It does not look good from Aggie's post but I cannot find what went wrong from the preceding posts (except for a temple).
I'm warning that I'm neither Cartouche Bee nor Randy number 2, so there will be no killing of elite spearmen with regular warriors and razing size 7 cities on the hill. If one might be interested, take a look at the recent GOTM spoiler:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=110116&page=5&pp=20
Please let me take a look later on on what is going on in the game, I'll post the summary and will play after the comments. It does not look good from Aggie's post but I cannot find what went wrong from the preceding posts (except for a temple).
I'm warning that I'm neither Cartouche Bee nor Randy number 2, so there will be no killing of elite spearmen with regular warriors and razing size 7 cities on the hill. If one might be interested, take a look at the recent GOTM spoiler:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=110116&page=5&pp=20
akots
Poet
After taking a look at the save it looks like it is bad. I'm a rather pessimistic player, so don't take this personal or too close to the heart. First, we have temple which we don't need. Second, we have tiles improved that are not on the river and tiles which are on the river are not improved. Third, with MoM we can get to size 12 with luxury rate same as we have now without Golden Age. Fourth, all 3 AI we know have Math and don't have Writing. There is also England which we have not met yet but I bet they also have Math. Researching Math without a library might be a big waste. But if we don't want to research anything later on it might be OK.
Our military sucks big, we have only hoplite, 2 archers and warrior on the offensive. Others are on the defensive apparently against a Mongol archer. There is absolutley no rush with Great Library. I just don't see now the need of frantically building it and sacrificing everything. Bad is that our Golden Age has been essentially wasted. IMO, we had a good opportunity of doing the Republic slingshot at an extremely low risk with a few units available for defense. I wish we had a granary instead of temple or 2 extra swordsmen. That was a very bad move. Alas, we did not have Pottery.
After some rant, going back to constructive thinking on how the game can be saved.
IMHO, we need another worker to improve the land and to build road further ahead and colony to another luxury if we encounter one. It also make sense to postpone the build of TGL and go for either MoM or SoZ. We are 7 turns away from either. MoM will allow us to grow to size 12 and increase the productivity accordingly. SoZ we can get at 70% in 6 turns running at -8gpt. This is a good option and allows us to have a strong unit good both in defense and attack. We can also split the offensive stack and advance with hoplites to harass not only France but whatever lies beyond them. Our lands are certainly safe upto Mapmaking since I doubt that meaningful offense can come to the choke in the near future.
It would be also nice to know how many turns of the Golden Age is left. We have also no guard on the iron colony and since wheel is around, it can be overrun anytime by a barbarian horseman. It also might be there is another luxury on our peninsula but it has not been explored yet.
Please lets discuss the ideas, I will play tomorrow evening.
IMO, to continue with the wonders we need to dispatch a hoplite per each civ to pillage. And SoZ seems the only way out. And we cannot get to size 12 at 10% luxury rate with 3 luxuries and temple: size 11 is the limit. It might be better to use offensive troops (archers and swords) in the open to attack and chop the forest near ivory colony. After SoZ and with the help of AC, it might be a good idea to start the offensive against France with a stack of units covered with hoplite while defending against the other attackers the AI will be sending. It all reminds me of an RTS game of Command and Conquer or KKND type. Who played knows. There you had a mission to survive for a certain time. But our mission is more tough since we need not only to survive but strike back and no reinforcement will come from the heavens except AC units. Well, if we go way off the limit with them, we can always stay in Anarchy.
Our military sucks big, we have only hoplite, 2 archers and warrior on the offensive. Others are on the defensive apparently against a Mongol archer. There is absolutley no rush with Great Library. I just don't see now the need of frantically building it and sacrificing everything. Bad is that our Golden Age has been essentially wasted. IMO, we had a good opportunity of doing the Republic slingshot at an extremely low risk with a few units available for defense. I wish we had a granary instead of temple or 2 extra swordsmen. That was a very bad move. Alas, we did not have Pottery.
After some rant, going back to constructive thinking on how the game can be saved.
IMHO, we need another worker to improve the land and to build road further ahead and colony to another luxury if we encounter one. It also make sense to postpone the build of TGL and go for either MoM or SoZ. We are 7 turns away from either. MoM will allow us to grow to size 12 and increase the productivity accordingly. SoZ we can get at 70% in 6 turns running at -8gpt. This is a good option and allows us to have a strong unit good both in defense and attack. We can also split the offensive stack and advance with hoplites to harass not only France but whatever lies beyond them. Our lands are certainly safe upto Mapmaking since I doubt that meaningful offense can come to the choke in the near future.
It would be also nice to know how many turns of the Golden Age is left. We have also no guard on the iron colony and since wheel is around, it can be overrun anytime by a barbarian horseman. It also might be there is another luxury on our peninsula but it has not been explored yet.
Please lets discuss the ideas, I will play tomorrow evening.
IMO, to continue with the wonders we need to dispatch a hoplite per each civ to pillage. And SoZ seems the only way out. And we cannot get to size 12 at 10% luxury rate with 3 luxuries and temple: size 11 is the limit. It might be better to use offensive troops (archers and swords) in the open to attack and chop the forest near ivory colony. After SoZ and with the help of AC, it might be a good idea to start the offensive against France with a stack of units covered with hoplite while defending against the other attackers the AI will be sending. It all reminds me of an RTS game of Command and Conquer or KKND type. Who played knows. There you had a mission to survive for a certain time. But our mission is more tough since we need not only to survive but strike back and no reinforcement will come from the heavens except AC units. Well, if we go way off the limit with them, we can always stay in Anarchy.
Aggie
Deity
I clearly mentioned that we got a GA in my very first IT. Also: that archer will probably not be taking on the fortified hoplite and if so, what's bad about that? I just killed two units with swords there.
A hoplite per civ to pillage? Do you really think that hoplites won't be attacked?
Did you READ my turnlog?
That was MY rant. I hope to come with constructive comments again in a few hours.
A hoplite per civ to pillage? Do you really think that hoplites won't be attacked?
Did you READ my turnlog?
That was MY rant. I hope to come with constructive comments again in a few hours.
I understand you arguments Akots but a few things to remember. First I care not about size 11 or 12. All I care about is 15 or 20 spt. The Republic slingshot is useless as this is AW. The main reason I want the Library is that I want to get to Monarchy. It is AW so we can never again trade. As you said can't build granery without pottery. As in all civ games everything is a trade off lets all try to remember that. I see no point in researching math as we need the GL, have started the GL and will get it from that. Our biggest problem will always be unit support costs. Any $$ earned from GA and no research will be used in the future to fund excess unit support. IMO any $$ spent on research now is wasted. I personally would have built more units, before the GL run but no big deal. When it completes I would as I said max out units for our income and then start either MoM or SoZ. If other civs had ivory they would have started the SoZ so I think we are safe. I also am not that concerned about the SoZ. I realize the attractivness of the unit but with Hoplites for defense we will do well with Swords/archers under Hop cover. I agree on the Hop pillagers. They will be attacked but if they go in 2s with 2 archers under and stay on favorable terrain they will do damage. Also Barbs were senantary so colony is safe from them. PS The only future research I would do in min on currency once math comes in from the GL as this is the last tech researched and it may take a while for 2 civs to come up with it. Especially if we do the kind of damage I hope to do.
Aggie
Deity
In this post I broke down akots' comments into seperate statements and gave my point of view on those. I did this because I think that all points need a clear view from the whole team.
"After taking a look at the save it looks like it is bad. I'm a rather pessimistic player, so don't take this personal or too close to the heart."
Well, I hope that you also don't take my comments too close to the heart!
"First, we have temple which we don't need."
I agree. I wouldn't have built it, but didn't want to break it down. I haven't seen enough common ground on this one to take such an action.
"Second, we have tiles improved that are not on the river and tiles which are on the river are not improved."
True, but I see this as a minor issue.
"Third, with MoM we can get to size 12 with luxury rate same as we have now without Golden Age."
Yes, I like MoM! But I felt that the team wanted TGL, then SoZ and then maybe MoM.
"Fourth, all 3 AI we know have Math and don't have Writing. There is also England which we have not met yet but I bet they also have Math. Researching Math without a library might be a big waste. But if we don't want to research anything later on it might be OK."
England might have math, but they have to find us. We have to cross Fench territory to meet England. That wouldn't work with the small stack we had up there. I had to retreat.
"Our military sucks big, we have only hoplite, 2 archers and warrior on the offensive. Others are on the defensive apparently against a Mongol archer."
The other troops are going north to join with the rest! But when a mini-SoD of the Mongols shows up you have to fight them off. We are fighting vs three other civs atm. They -surprise- are not waiting for us.
"There is absolutley no rush with Great Library. I just don't see now the need of frantically building it and sacrificing everything."
I didn't want to waste our GA. I figured that now we have a GA I'd better build something. The team's decision was to go for TGL. I don't see anything bad about this decision. Although I liked to make other choices.
EDIT: Getting TGL fast also means the opportunity to build SoZ fast and get AC early.
"Bad is that our Golden Age has been essentially wasted. IMO, we had a good opportunity of doing the Republic slingshot at an extremely low risk with a few units available for defense."
There was nothing I could do to avoid the GA. The hoplite stood next to Orleans and was attacked by a French archer.
"I wish we had a granary instead of temple or 2 extra swordsmen. That was a very bad move. Alas, we did not have Pottery."
True. We would have loved a granary.
"IMHO, we need another worker to improve the land and to build road further ahead and colony to another luxury if we encounter one."
OK.
"It also make sense to postpone the build of TGL and go for either MoM or SoZ. We are 7 turns away from either. MoM will allow us to grow to size 12 and increase the productivity accordingly."
I started with TGL. I see no problems in switching to SoZ or MoM.
"SoZ we can get at 70% in 6 turns running at -8gpt. This is a good option and allows us to have a strong unit good both in defense and attack."
Yes, I agree. See my previous posts about SoZ. But I didn't disagree enough with the team to go for it anyway. I left the door open for SoZ in my ten turns.
"We can also split the offensive stack and advance with hoplites to harass not only France but whatever lies beyond them."
The hoplites will be attacked and beaten sooner rather than later. But you can try and find out.
"Our lands are certainly safe upto Mapmaking since I doubt that meaningful offense can come to the choke in the near future."
Relatively safe! I have seen plenty of troops going south. I reported them all in my 10. We can't just advance and ignore the ivory and choke.
"It would be also nice to know how many turns of the Golden Age is left."
10 turns! I forgot to make the text bold, but I thought I was pretty clear.
"We have also no guard on the iron colony and since wheel is around, it can be overrun anytime by a barbarian horseman."
Don't we have -no barbs- as a setting? But you are right. It needs a defense.
"It also might be there is another luxury on our peninsula but it has not been explored yet."
True, but I focussed on getting a stack of units and sending them up north.
"IMO, to continue with the wonders we need to dispatch a hoplite per each civ to pillage."
I don't see how one hoplite can be safe in enemy territory. I assume you mean something else?
"And SoZ seems the only way out."
I don't see us in some sort of deep hole. I think we are doing well. Maybe not great. But well.
"And we cannot get to size 12 at 10% luxury rate with 3 luxuries and temple: size 11 is the limit."
I think we will get MoM if we want. We will also get a market at one point.
"It might be better to use offensive troops (archers and swords) in the open to attack and chop the forest near ivory colony. "
Good idea.
"After SoZ and with the help of AC, it might be a good idea to start the offensive against France with a stack of units covered with hoplite while defending against the other attackers the AI will be sending."
I thought we were doing this already. But SoZ will help.
"Well, if we go way off the limit with them, we can always stay in Anarchy."
I hope that this is not allowed in this SG
I don't think that we are doing a bad job. But I also don't like the temple. We could have used the shields to build more military. That said, that military would have been more archers. Swords only came available during my 10.
I made my points before my turns. I'm not going to repeat them. I will keep on giving my pow, but will follow the team's decisions, because we are playing this game with some very good players who also have excellent points for other options. I hope I did in my 10...
I had a totally different approach in mind at the start. But since this is a SG we are talking about a team effort which automatically means that things don't always go the way you expect. Often this is a good thing.
"After taking a look at the save it looks like it is bad. I'm a rather pessimistic player, so don't take this personal or too close to the heart."
Well, I hope that you also don't take my comments too close to the heart!
"First, we have temple which we don't need."
I agree. I wouldn't have built it, but didn't want to break it down. I haven't seen enough common ground on this one to take such an action.
"Second, we have tiles improved that are not on the river and tiles which are on the river are not improved."
True, but I see this as a minor issue.
"Third, with MoM we can get to size 12 with luxury rate same as we have now without Golden Age."
Yes, I like MoM! But I felt that the team wanted TGL, then SoZ and then maybe MoM.
"Fourth, all 3 AI we know have Math and don't have Writing. There is also England which we have not met yet but I bet they also have Math. Researching Math without a library might be a big waste. But if we don't want to research anything later on it might be OK."
England might have math, but they have to find us. We have to cross Fench territory to meet England. That wouldn't work with the small stack we had up there. I had to retreat.
"Our military sucks big, we have only hoplite, 2 archers and warrior on the offensive. Others are on the defensive apparently against a Mongol archer."
The other troops are going north to join with the rest! But when a mini-SoD of the Mongols shows up you have to fight them off. We are fighting vs three other civs atm. They -surprise- are not waiting for us.
"There is absolutley no rush with Great Library. I just don't see now the need of frantically building it and sacrificing everything."
I didn't want to waste our GA. I figured that now we have a GA I'd better build something. The team's decision was to go for TGL. I don't see anything bad about this decision. Although I liked to make other choices.
EDIT: Getting TGL fast also means the opportunity to build SoZ fast and get AC early.
"Bad is that our Golden Age has been essentially wasted. IMO, we had a good opportunity of doing the Republic slingshot at an extremely low risk with a few units available for defense."
There was nothing I could do to avoid the GA. The hoplite stood next to Orleans and was attacked by a French archer.
"I wish we had a granary instead of temple or 2 extra swordsmen. That was a very bad move. Alas, we did not have Pottery."
True. We would have loved a granary.
"IMHO, we need another worker to improve the land and to build road further ahead and colony to another luxury if we encounter one."
OK.
"It also make sense to postpone the build of TGL and go for either MoM or SoZ. We are 7 turns away from either. MoM will allow us to grow to size 12 and increase the productivity accordingly."
I started with TGL. I see no problems in switching to SoZ or MoM.
"SoZ we can get at 70% in 6 turns running at -8gpt. This is a good option and allows us to have a strong unit good both in defense and attack."
Yes, I agree. See my previous posts about SoZ. But I didn't disagree enough with the team to go for it anyway. I left the door open for SoZ in my ten turns.
"We can also split the offensive stack and advance with hoplites to harass not only France but whatever lies beyond them."
The hoplites will be attacked and beaten sooner rather than later. But you can try and find out.
"Our lands are certainly safe upto Mapmaking since I doubt that meaningful offense can come to the choke in the near future."
Relatively safe! I have seen plenty of troops going south. I reported them all in my 10. We can't just advance and ignore the ivory and choke.
"It would be also nice to know how many turns of the Golden Age is left."
10 turns! I forgot to make the text bold, but I thought I was pretty clear.
"We have also no guard on the iron colony and since wheel is around, it can be overrun anytime by a barbarian horseman."
Don't we have -no barbs- as a setting? But you are right. It needs a defense.
"It also might be there is another luxury on our peninsula but it has not been explored yet."
True, but I focussed on getting a stack of units and sending them up north.
"IMO, to continue with the wonders we need to dispatch a hoplite per each civ to pillage."
I don't see how one hoplite can be safe in enemy territory. I assume you mean something else?
"And SoZ seems the only way out."
I don't see us in some sort of deep hole. I think we are doing well. Maybe not great. But well.
"And we cannot get to size 12 at 10% luxury rate with 3 luxuries and temple: size 11 is the limit."
I think we will get MoM if we want. We will also get a market at one point.
"It might be better to use offensive troops (archers and swords) in the open to attack and chop the forest near ivory colony. "
Good idea.
"After SoZ and with the help of AC, it might be a good idea to start the offensive against France with a stack of units covered with hoplite while defending against the other attackers the AI will be sending."
I thought we were doing this already. But SoZ will help.
"Well, if we go way off the limit with them, we can always stay in Anarchy.
"I hope that this is not allowed in this SG
I don't think that we are doing a bad job. But I also don't like the temple. We could have used the shields to build more military. That said, that military would have been more archers. Swords only came available during my 10.
I made my points before my turns. I'm not going to repeat them. I will keep on giving my pow, but will follow the team's decisions, because we are playing this game with some very good players who also have excellent points for other options. I hope I did in my 10...
I had a totally different approach in mind at the start. But since this is a SG we are talking about a team effort which automatically means that things don't always go the way you expect. Often this is a good thing.
akots
Poet
@Aggie: All your comments make perfect sense to me! I sorry I did not see the short post before the main turnlog about the Golden Age.
Lets just decide on something. Demogame voting type if needed. Choices we have:
1. Continue building TGL (17 turns to go). Defend with whatever units we got. Don't seek contact with England, just try to survive. I'm itching to upgrade a vet warrior to sword and send him to the front as well. Looks like we are facing a lot of units according to Aggie's post. In AWM AI sends them in pairs every 4-5 turns which is barely enough to heal our wounded.
2. Research Math and get SoZ ready in 7, build more units to the top of unit support to be on the safe side and start on TGL. If we hit size 11 make sure build worker before we grow to size 12. Play more aggressively and try to advance to French territory and may be raze a city or two there.
I'd wait to hear what bed-head and Greebley have to say.
Regarding Mark's comment all I can say that we might not survive at our present state of military if we go for TGL. We will probably certainly lose the offensive stack if no reinforcements come and we might lose ivory colony as well. May be not on my turns and may be not even on subsequent 10 turns. Are we willing to take these chances?
Lets just decide on something. Demogame voting type if needed. Choices we have:
1. Continue building TGL (17 turns to go). Defend with whatever units we got. Don't seek contact with England, just try to survive. I'm itching to upgrade a vet warrior to sword and send him to the front as well. Looks like we are facing a lot of units according to Aggie's post. In AWM AI sends them in pairs every 4-5 turns which is barely enough to heal our wounded.
2. Research Math and get SoZ ready in 7, build more units to the top of unit support to be on the safe side and start on TGL. If we hit size 11 make sure build worker before we grow to size 12. Play more aggressively and try to advance to French territory and may be raze a city or two there.
I'd wait to hear what bed-head and Greebley have to say.
Regarding Mark's comment all I can say that we might not survive at our present state of military if we go for TGL. We will probably certainly lose the offensive stack if no reinforcements come and we might lose ivory colony as well. May be not on my turns and may be not even on subsequent 10 turns. Are we willing to take these chances?
Aggie
Deity
Needless to say that I'm for option 2...
OK if we can get math and not lose any shields from TGL in building the SoZ I'm for it. If not I would let TGL complete. MY reason is that we should have built up more military before starting TGL and I too want AC. Also, I want to start min research on currency ASAP. A market will be crucial and it will take forever to get it from TGL
I guess I am not a big fan of MoM. It seems too many shields to be worthwhile. We want a bigger army and adding a 3rd wonder (past SoZ and GLib) doesn't seem the way to go about it. Also, a temple is worth as much as MOM, isn't it? IIRC, it is +3 happiness for 200 shields. If so a temple is slightly more efficient than MoM in terms of shields(+1 for 60, +3 for 200). I don't follow why MoM would be be good and a temple not. We are going to need both to run no Lux at all I suspect. I am guessing the temple got built when it would save us from running a higher lux rate.
I guess I would only build MoM if we have SoZ and GLib and as many units as we want to build.
Why on earth would we want to do the Republic slingshot? Republic is a completely useless tech.
For SoZ vs GLib, doing either one is fine for me. The GLib will probably wait so if we can get Math in time, then I would go for SoZ. It does have some risk though. I have seen the AI get Lit eearly.
I guess I would only build MoM if we have SoZ and GLib and as many units as we want to build.
Why on earth would we want to do the Republic slingshot? Republic is a completely useless tech.
For SoZ vs GLib, doing either one is fine for me. The GLib will probably wait so if we can get Math in time, then I would go for SoZ. It does have some risk though. I have seen the AI get Lit eearly.
Aggie
Deity
Greebley said:
True, but this is monarch and we have a very big city.
