[MOD] Fall from Heaven

[Kael]

Just a quick gameplay question for anyone willing to answer - playing as the Ashen Vale is it considered a good thing to have sickness in the cities? Considering that the religous specific civic adds more sickness & wonders such as Typhoid Mary do as well, is it a waste of time to be building granaries & herbalist et al. or is this just a negative side effect of playing as the darker religion? If not beneficial to the religous is there a plan to perhaps make it so in future updates? Just throwing it out there. Thanks - Seamus

It isn't a good thing to have sickness in your cities. Although it is hard to keep cities healthy as the Veil (both their unique civic and special building reduce health) more people still generally = better. They are just more willing than others to sacrifice their people for the benifits of more money, research or demonic units.

 

[seamus75]

Okay - then I guess I should start cleaning things up. Are there any plans to make sickness somehow beneficial to the Vale?

 

[Kael]

Okay - then I guess I should start cleaning things up. Are there any plans to make sickness somehow beneficial to the Vale?

No, it's the price they pay for their increased research rate.

 

[RED DIAMOND]

Kael I have been lurking in your thread here for a few days and one thing comes to mind. Where did you get this idea from for this world you have created. Awfully good stuff.

 

[pippin_nl]

Hi I have a few unit ideas for a next version:

1. building (coffin) and a unit (vampire), coffin generates -1 food and money (predator), vampire has blitz and first strike (due to reflexes), movement 3 (wolf form) or movement 2 ignore terrain (bat form), withdraw 70% (gaseous form), heals quickly (+50%) and each vampire must have his own coffin

2. building (ghosthouse) and a unit (ghost), ghosthouse generates -1 trade, ghost has withdraw 70%, ignores terrain, may not leave cultural borders of own city

both units are undead of course which are immune to disease and vulnerable to silver weapons (and a wooden stake)

if you like the idea, more undead to follow?

 

[Lightzy]

Hey Kael,
I think the religion restricting civics is the way to go!
Good start on that, although I suppose I'd like to see it expanded.
That is, more civics, but certain religions only have access to a small selection.

For example, I don't see the ashen veil having access to public healers, protect the meek, humanism, etc.

It can be a nice gameplay mechanic, some religions getting more specific bonuses for their temples and such, but having fewer civics to choose from, while other religions are more flexible in civics, but not as focused in their advantages


EDIT:
Oh, also, I noticed while playing that civs with access to horses have a huge, huge military advantage which civs without horses simply can't negate until much later in the game, especially given the horse units speed and mobility upgrades (which never really gets 'negated').
A mounted unit easily pillage 2 squares in one turn, or if it stays in place, can pillage a town+roads down to nothing in one turn, and the defending civ has no answer.

there should be some kind of fast moving anti-mounted unit. perhaps wardogs? fast moving, weak, but with a big bonus against cavalry.


It's a shame civ4 didn't keep civ3s zones of control mechanism. attacking now is a no-brainer and defense is impossible

 

[Silica_Pathways]

I got suggestion. What about unit spawning wonders (like in Civ3 Warhammer mod) ? For example, "Pool of [insert evil fantasy name]" which spawns lizardman every 5 turns or "Tomb of [insert evil fantasy name]" which spawns skeleton every 5 turns, etc. What do u think ?

 

[woodelf]

Kael - how much work is it going to entail to incorporate haarbal's pack into your game if you want to tie in tech and religious restrictions on the civs? Some civs will obviously have the ability to go with multiple religions, but others like the True Elves, Dwarves, Merfolk will need to be pigeon-holed with only one choice.

And if you do put his civs into your game officially will this open the door for some UUs based on the civ, not the religion?

 

[Lightzy]

On one hand its kind of weird that dwarves end up founding the 'elven' religion, but on the other hand its weird that that the spanish found judaism.
Perhaps its not such a big problem after all
Although perhaps the slight bitter taste would go away if the fantasy civs for this mod are something created by Kael to be specific to the setting he's creating, so it'd make more sense.

 

[Psychic_Llamas]

Hey Kael, just wondering, are there going to be specific units for each civ? (like in the Warhamer Mod for Civ 3) forexample, where an Orc civ gets an Orc Archer, a Wood Elf civ gets a Wood Elf Archer, and an Undead civ would get a skeleton Archer (all with different avatars of corse' ) Its just that, there is really nothing that distinguishes one civ from another now that there are no UU units, and i feel that the game would have sooooo much more...whats the word...variation and adaptablity?

P.S. I know there is no way for anyone to make new unit's avitars from scrach, all need to be reskinned, but this just a thought for much further down the road...one unit at a time

Signed Psych.

 

[Psychic_Llamas]

Oh, one more thing, not all of the civics are useable. (even thogh my initial problem is fixed) Every time i play the game, and found all the religions, i cant use the civic Arete (what does that mean anyway???) which is, IMO, the best one of that section. I mean, i research the Dwarven thingo, it asks if i want to have a revolution, i say yes, but then when i go in later, the Arete icon isnt showing and im still on the defalt one! Im not sure if this is one of those religeon dependent things that someone was talking about before, (which i think is a bad idea IMO) but i just want to get this clarified.

Ta, Psych.

 

[woodelf]

I'm fairly sure that the Runes of Kilmorph has to be your State Religion for you to use Arete. Same for Guardians of Nature and the Fellowship. Personally this is a very good thing so people don't get the benefit of a civic while getting the benefits from another religion.

 

[Psychic_Llamas]

True... But they're both my favorite Civics!! WAAAAA!
(and i like to stick to Fellowship of the leaves, its always the most widespread )

Signed Psych.

 

[Kidinnu]

Much fun, impressive amounts of work.

Playing 0.70, I noticed that the cost for lighthouse seems to have been hugely increased over vanilla (200? instead of 60...)

Together with the fact that slavery is delayed down the tech tree, this at least slightly weakens Financial, since it's much less feasible to set up fishing villages. (I suppose the answer is to get a unit that can vitalize the land and just use cottage cheese...)

On your tech tree: you've got lots of things with two "AND" prerequisites. If you change that to one "AND" and one "OR", you'll effectively have two ANDs, but you'll get more arrows drawn on the f6 screen, which will help a lot in making sense of the progression. (Fiddling with their locations is painful, but good for players - and if it's too painful let me know and I'll try to finish up my standalone editor.)

 

[woodelf]

True... But they're both my favorite Civics!! WAAAAA!
(and i like to stick to Fellowship of the leaves, its always the most widespread )

Signed Psych.

You can stick it to them by cranking out Disciples of Runes and converting all of their towns. That or you can simply wage a Holy war on them.

 

[Kael]

Kael I have been lurking in your thread here for a few days and one thing comes to mind. Where did you get this idea from for this world you have created. Awfully good stuff.

Its the world I developed for my D&D game over the past 17 years.

 

[Kael]

Hi I have a few unit ideas for a next version:

1. building (coffin) and a unit (vampire), coffin generates -1 food and money (predator), vampire has blitz and first strike (due to reflexes), movement 3 (wolf form) or movement 2 ignore terrain (bat form), withdraw 70% (gaseous form), heals quickly (+50%) and each vampire must have his own coffin

2. building (ghosthouse) and a unit (ghost), ghosthouse generates -1 trade, ghost has withdraw 70%, ignores terrain, may not leave cultural borders of own city

both units are undead of course which are immune to disease and vulnerable to silver weapons (and a wooden stake)

if you like the idea, more undead to follow?

According to the design docs there is a difference between undead and demonic units. They were just classed together because I don't have enough units yet to do both.

I do want to add units like the ones you suggest but right now Im limited by my models. When the SDK comes out Im hoping to have more flexibility to make units like you suggest.

 

[Kael]

I got suggestion. What about unit spawning wonders (like in Civ3 Warhammer mod) ? For example, "Pool of [insert evil fantasy name]" which spawns lizardman every 5 turns or "Tomb of [insert evil fantasy name]" which spawns skeleton every 5 turns, etc. What do u think ?

Skeleton Teeth is spec'ed which provides a Skeleton unit every few turns and the Open Gate is the Dimensional Armageddon spell, it produces random permanent Demons every few turns.

 

[Kael]

Kael - how much work is it going to entail to incorporate haarbal's pack into your game if you want to tie in tech and religious restrictions on the civs? Some civs will obviously have the ability to go with multiple religions, but others like the True Elves, Dwarves, Merfolk will need to be pigeon-holed with only one choice.

And if you do put his civs into your game officially will this open the door for some UUs based on the civ, not the religion?

Its not that hard to do. I want the elves to be unable to follow the Runes or Overlords religions but everyone will be able to follow the Order or the Ashen Veil. So they could throw off their worship of Cernunnos (Fellowship) for Agares (Veil) and turn evil.

 

[Kael]

Hey Kael, just wondering, are there going to be specific units for each civ? (like in the Warhamer Mod for Civ 3) forexample, where an Orc civ gets an Orc Archer, a Wood Elf civ gets a Wood Elf Archer, and an Undead civ would get a skeleton Archer (all with different avatars of corse' ) Its just that, there is really nothing that distinguishes one civ from another now that there are no UU units, and i feel that the game would have sooooo much more...whats the word...variation and adaptablity?

P.S. I know there is no way for anyone to make new unit's avitars from scrach, all need to be reskinned, but this just a thought for much further down the road...one unit at a time

Signed Psych.

I agree 100%. As you said, the limitation now is the models, hopefully soon there will be more flexibility and I can do this kind of stuff.